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Messages - Kindler

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1051
DF Spoilers / Re: Which absent villian will appear in Peace Talks?
« on: September 12, 2017, 01:10:47 PM »
First, that's a pretty big assumption. I'm having trouble accepting that something that seemed to require ritual involving physical components can happen anyway essentially by accident. The Red Court have always seemed the most "physical" of the vampire courts, and the literal, physical blood seems to have been necessary to elevate Bianca.

As for them being more powerful... eh, I'm not totally sold on that. They have a few crippling and -- most importantly -- well-known weaknesses that let pre-infection Susan take a few of them out.

Truth is we don't know what all their servitors can do. Having minions that don't have glaring weaknesses or an addiction to blood might be worth the trade-off of power.
If there were more than the two most cowardly examples of the species, I'd agree with you more.

Think of it this way, though. Let's say they show up in Peace Talks on official business. Harry knows where they were last seen. He's on speaking terms with the guy who had them. You don't think he's going to ask? You don't think everyone else -- like the White Council contingent -- is going to notice that the Fomor had been allied with a group that had so recently tried to genocide them?

The Fomor or Nemesis would have to show a few of their holding cards to get them out and keep them out. I don't think it's worth it.

I mostly agree that the Eebs are dead anyway, but it might be interesting if they show back up with the Fomor as sponsors, which is an angle I didn't consider. What if they're planning to use the peace talks to demand restitution for, you know, genocide? Is there an equivalent of the Geneva Convention and the Hague? If Harry and, by extension, the White Council (and with Winter's support and tacit approval), committed a war crime, there might be an Accords provision that puts him, Mab, and the Merlin in the hot seat. Hell, with Cristos on the Senior Council, things might get real complicated real quick.

Speaking of which, has the full text of the Unseelie Accords been produced? It's one of those things I'd really like to read, considering how often they show up.

1052
DF Spoilers / Re: Denarian Dresden
« on: September 12, 2017, 01:00:51 PM »
Consider that Maggie would be a new point of leverage for the Denarians, including Lasciel. Imagine what a Fallen temptress could do with that knowledge if she's got control over him. Maggie could have ended up twisted in all sorts of unfortunate and deplorable ways. She still could, but I'd judge that the odds are lower with the Winter Knight mantle, which is guided by base instinct (like "Protect the offspring.") He might not set the best example of stability, but, at the very least, he'll want to keep Maggie as far away from Winter as possible, and there's a lower chance of her following in his exact footsteps.

It's also doubtful that his memory gambit with his suicide would have worked with a Coin in his possession and another entity in his head—though I guess he might not have had a Fallen convincing him to do it in the first place if he was taking up a coin, so that might be moot. In fact, Molly would not have gone off the deep end, and with Harry still around, Lea wouldn't have shaped her to be the Winter Lady, which might be the worst thing about it, assuming Maeve still offs Lily.

And what about Corpsetaker? If he wasn't a ghost (or wraith or whatever you want to call it), it's pretty doubtful he would've learned about the Darkhallow in time.

Hmm. Mirror, Mirror might be more fun than I was thinking.

1053
I thought of it like an epidural. He was going through labor, after all.

1054
DF Spoilers / Re: A Cowl WAG - I promise it's new
« on: September 08, 2017, 01:43:29 PM »
I don't think Luccio or anyone else had to be compromised for the location of Camp Kaboom, or the previous Warden safehouses that Ebenezer mentions at the end of Proven Guilty, to be leaked. When Eb says that only a few people knew about it, he's simply wrong: he forgot about Peabody, the secretary who was managing all of the documentation for the ongoing war effort. Everything has a paper trail, and Peabody's role was maintaining it for the Council.

If you walk into any business, the person who knows more than anyone else is the CEO's secretary, even more than the CEO realizes. That's pretty much Peabody's job.

Also, I'm not sure Cowl's voice is evidence of much. My reading of the odd vibrations and warble to it was that he was deliberately disguising it with magic. I could be wrong, though.

Anyone know what the origin of the only spell we hear him use is? Dorosh? That might be a big clue; its language origin would probably at least eliminate a nationality or three. It sounds Central European to me.


1055
DF Spoilers / Re: Denarian Dresden
« on: September 08, 2017, 01:17:54 PM »
It's fun to think about how him taking the coin would've played out. Certainly Harry's view of the Outsider situation would be drastically different. And, if you believe that Nic is working to protect our universe from the Outsiders in the long-term (because nobody gets to break his toys but him), Harry's role in supporting that effort would be crazy fun.

I sort of see Nicodemus as our reality's answer to Nemesis, a kind of counterspy working to plant false leads and sabotage their efforts. The key difference is that while Nemesis has access to allies via some kind of hivemind-type thing, Nic is no longer trusted by anyone.

In the end, though, I think Mab is just more Harry's style, and a far, far safer bet than Lasciel. The Coin would have completely changed him, and I believe that Lasciel is perfectly capable of dominating Harry rather than working alongside him, as she claims.

There is one big advantage to the Coin, though: Harry could have set it aside afterward. Michael would have saved him, I'm certain of it. It's going to be much harder to get out of being the Winter Knight, at least until next Halloween.

1056
DF Spoilers / Re: Ivy/The Archive and digital information
« on: September 07, 2017, 01:50:56 PM »

 I think the biggest problem for her will be the same one that everyone has, what is true and what is false information? I can see someone like Nic using a blog to great advantage spreading lies left right and center..  Supposedly the Archive records everything written but does that include the lies as well as the truth?  If it makes no distinction that can become a huge problem for it just as it has for people who's only source of information is the net...

Speaking of Nic, she knows all of the information in those records that Nic destroys every few centuries. And could probably tell me if the Voynich Manuscript was a hoax.

I'd assume she knows all of the lies AND the truth, but that's not really a new problem; yellow journalism has been a thing since town criers stood on street corners, but you're right that the sheer volume of false information virtually guarantees that she can be misled now, which is an interesting prospect to me. It's not like Harry would be able to explain 4Chan to her.

And what about her role in the Oblivion war? How could she possibly delete information that's being spread through Twitter at the speed of stupid (several times faster than the speed of light)? Hell, a bunch of low-level talents might be able to summon Old Ones if they get their hands on enough retweets.

1057
DF Spoilers / Re: Which absent villian will appear in Peace Talks?
« on: September 07, 2017, 01:38:54 PM »
Rudolph annoyed the crap out of me. I hope the next time we see him is in a padded cell with a straitjacket. As far as Langtry goes, I see him as a reluctant supporter of Harry due to Harry's actions in Changes and his ties to Mab.

Oh yeah, me too. I was mostly joking, though I do think Rudolph might show up. It was only a minor consolation that Rudolph got screwed over every time he showed up. I still don't get what was behind his extreme character derailment after Fool Moon. He was too stupid for it to be Nemesis, at least directly.

I'm with you on Langtry. I don't see him as directly antagonistic toward Harry. In my opinion, his actions are motivated by The Greater Good. He was trying to avoid a war, and trading one wizard's life is worth it—I couldn't say that I wouldn't try to do the same in his position. It's also worth noting that we haven't really seen him much since Peabody's ink has left his system. The one time we did, he was far, FAR more ready to throw down with the Reds than he had been, and might have been willing to support Harry's attack if the White Council wasn't crippled by Cristos later on.

He'll probably still be pissed at Harry for creating such a huge power vacuum after Changes, and he'll likely be annoyed that Harry is beyond his reach now that he's the Winter Knight. If he also knows that he's the Warden, I think he'll have a minor heart attack, just at the thought of so much power being in one person's hands.

To be honest, the highlight for me won't be returning villains, it'll be seeing most (if not all) of the people we haven't for several books.

1058
DF Spoilers / Re: Magical Architect
« on: September 06, 2017, 07:21:07 PM »
Ok You are Harry Dresden and you are going to spend 200K on a brand new house for yourself.   You picked a prime location that is at the convergence of three helpful ley lines, away from innocent bystanders most times, in a part of Chicago that is easily accessible and covers a half acre lot (so plenty of room, but not ridiculous like the Marcone or White court mansions).   There is already a long occupied house on the lot that can be heavily remodeled, but still retain "most" of the threshold benefit that the house had accumulated.    (ie - location is nearly perfect). 

What are the key elements of the design?   Assume you are Dresden's architect and are designing him the right house. 

Obvious Bits
1) The house will be built of thick stone or similar sturdy material that is not flammable.
2) Doors will be heavily reinforced security type doors - although not obviously so
3) Good wood burning stoves provide central heat and/or the basics of a stove/oven in the kitchen
4) Good spacious underground basement for the laboratory
5) The lot will be surrounded by a 5' tall brick or stone wall that will (slightly) slow down attackers, keep out ghosts, and give some degree of privacy so neighbors are not easily annoyed by the zombies attacking
6) the place will look like a residence, not a fortress. 
7) multiple guest rooms
8) Big freezer to hold the pizza

His 200K is gone the moment he files his taxes, so I'm going to assume a reasonable, middle-class-budget accommodations based on the sale of an existing house.

1. Base the overall design of the house and its feng shui on Mac's place so that maybe, just maybe, Dresden can keep a water heater and working lights.
2. That wall around the house should be a circle, for obvious reasons.
3. A sprinkler system that is hooked up to a tank of holy water (for Black Court vampires).
4. A garage, hopefully, so that he can stick the Beetle somewhere aside from on the street, where it seems to get messed up frequently.
5. This probably goes without saying, but a big swing set, with monkey bars, one of those wooden fort things, and all of the assorted equipment for Maggie.
6. Mouse-sized doggy doors.
7. Bunk beds.
8. This wouldn't necessarily cost money, but Dresden should spend some time scrolling the walls with the right runes so that Bonnie can effectively use the house as her skull. Instant Smart House, literally.
9. A really, really, really, really good fire suppression system.

1059
DF Spoilers / Re: Which absent villian will appear in Peace Talks?
« on: September 06, 2017, 04:02:45 PM »
Rudolph will return, trying to kill Harry and Murphy after the events of Changes ruined his life and he barely skated on corruption charges. His criminal defense was funded by Larry Fowler, who will also appear, leading a mass media campaign for Harry's arrest, pending charges of domestic terrorism.


1060
DF Spoilers / Re: Faith's importance spoilers
« on: September 04, 2017, 04:11:44 AM »
I am going to approach this question differently by asking a different question.  WHY would JB have the story end with Faith. 
*  Part of it is symmetry of course -- the really short story with Faith was the first Dresden story.  So having her play a role in the last story is symmetry.   
*  Part of this is that Dresden has a relationship with Faith -- a connection.  That connection has to be important.   
*  Part of this is just a reward for us fans -- who obsessively read everything that JB writes. :)

Symmetry is doubtlessly a part of it.
And fanservice may play into it, but I think it'd be more like giving Harry a win. The girl he saved years ago returns, and Harry's overcome with emotion, because of course he is.
His connection with Faith was one he had made when he was a very, very different man. Since then he'd seen and fought werewolves, ghosts, vampires, Faerie Queens, weird, shaggoth-like creatures, ghouls, demons, Fallen, and more dark wizards than you could shake a stick at. He fell in love, twice, and... assisted the first's suicide in a horrifying act of murder and genocide. He died, and was forced to come to terms with what the world would be like without him. He had a daughter of his own, whom he had to pull out of the vipers' nest, and has a less-than-traditional relationship with her. He's been tempted by a Fallen, and now has to battle the base impulses of the Winter Knight.

And Faith has had a whole life we haven't heard about, whether inside or out of the Supernatural community.

In all, if they had soulgazed, I'm willing to bet they've changed so much that they'd be able to do it again.

When Faith arrives, I think Harry will have a momentary emotional break. He'll remember the man he used to be, and look at the way he is now, and he won't like it. And, honestly, I'm looking forward to that kind of introspection.

I don't know what her role is going to be. If she brings him a case (which, to me, means he's back working as a PI and no longer the Winter Knight), I don't expect her to be a person of power, just someone desperate who remembers the man who helped her once.

If she turns up as a body, then I will personally write Mr. Butcher a very angry letter that I'll never send.

1061
DF Spoilers / Re: Why Attack Arctus Tor?
« on: August 31, 2017, 06:41:11 PM »
She may have felt Titania was infected, but that does not explain why she piled everyone in winter on the border of summer.   That action effectively prevented either from participating in the fighting. 

Mab could have achieved the same objective by having summer and winter bring equal forces to the battlefield while still keeping back a substantial force to defend winter.   Winter is still protected from betrayal by summer, but she also targets the red court which attacked her borders -- and is clearly allied with outsiders.    Yet she did not do this.  She had some clear reason to keep summer and winter out of the fighting.  A reason important enough that she was willing to let the white council fall. 

Yet this compelling reason did not prevent her from standing by while Dresden brough summer fire to the heart of winter.  No way that little butterfly of summer power was missed by Mab.    Which had a huge effect on her borders. 

Which means she
a) was testing summer's reaction
b) was compelled to do what she did (block summer and winter from going to war) by some promise or debt. 
c) she was testing Maeve

"a" is a pretty weak reason as it is a pretty unreliable test.  Even if summer attacked winter in full force, it would not accomplish much.  So a corrupted winter would do little.   "C" is a possibility especially as Small Favor was after this attack, but what about Maeve's behavior would reveal she was infected to Mab.  After all, if Mab was insane, then Maeve's actions would have been loyal to Winter. 

B is the easiest explanation - but that is still a pretty big favor.

Not trying to shore up my failing hypothesis here, but what if it was also about the White Council traitor? At the end of the book, Ebenezer points out that the Reds were able to hit the White Council (coinciding right around the attack on Arctis Tor) at their Baby Warden camp, presumably through the NeverNever. He mentions that only a handful of people knew where it was. It might've been motivated by an attempt to narrow down the suspect pool, or confirm an existing one, and could've been part of an agreement between Mab and the Gatekeeper.

Note, it's only that Ebenezer fails to consider the paperwork that Peabody wasn't on the list; he clearly did know everything, he was just beneath notice, like an evil Ehren.

1062
DF Spoilers / Re: Faith's importance spoilers
« on: August 31, 2017, 06:27:33 PM »
Why the sarcasm? She could be Jenny Sells, couldn't she?

Mostly sarcastic about my false tone of certainty. I think it's super unlikely that Jenny Sells is Kumori, but there's just nothing that really supports the idea. Plus she'd have to be old enough in Grave Peril to accompany Cowl to the party, and I had her pegged at, like, ten during Storm Front.

My overall point in the post was that there is so little information about Kumori that the suspect pool isn't usefully small. We basically know she's tall enough to hold a knife to Dresden's throat (as has been pointed out in most threads), that she's idealistic, particularly about magic, that she knows necromancy (at least enough necromancy to temporarily halt death), and that Dresden knows her. That pretty much eliminates Murphy and hardly anyone else. And, like I said, with necromancy being a relatively unknown quantity (what are the functional limits? Could someone be resurrected from the dead, like Kemmler evidently was? Does Cowl know how to do that?) you might not even be able to write off dead characters.

She's really only present for... what, three speaking scenes, total? "Priscilla" in White Night tricked Dresden for longer than that. How do we know it's even a woman? Maybe the reveal is that Kumori is actually... Ebenezar (*cue musical sting*). Not really, of course; it's just that there are so many precedents for unorthodox disguises, like "Priscilla," not to mention illusion magic, faerie glamour, and even platform shoes that make even physical descriptions fallible.

Brainwashing is a thing—see Elaine. Cowl definitely has the juice to pull it off if Justin did. Can you even tell if her idealism is her own? Does she even remember being Kumori, or is her memory being tampered with like Dresden's was in Small Favor? Might very well be a persona that Cowl just activates whenever he needs a flunky, and there's precedent for the kind of mental domination it'd require. Hell, the Darkhallow might have had enough of a magical backlash that Cowl's mental hold on her was broken, which is why she's not seen with him next time he shows up.

Then people like to toss around time travel, and that just completely obliterates any names you might otherwise eliminate—Margaret the Elder, Maggie Dresden, and so on. One of the reasons I hope time travel isn't really confirmed to be a thing that Dresden can do is because then every hanging thread can be answered with it. Who's Cowl? Harry from the future. Who tried to run Harry off the road in Proven Guilty? Harry from the future. Who fixed Little Chicago? Mouse from the future, after finishing college and becoming the first Pupper President (he'd have my vote).

Not to say Mr. Butcher couldn't do it well, because I think he can, but it would play merry hell with pretty much any hanging plots and is a pretty messy way of making everything neat, if that makes any sense.

For me, the frustrating thing is that Harry doesn't seem to care about Cowl and Kumori's identities nearly as much as we do, so we're never going to know until he runs into them and literally unmasks them.

Anyway, the overall point is just that there is not nearly enough information for me to make a real guess, so pretty much everything I say about Kumori is sarcastic—which isn't intended to diminish anyone else's ideas or take away anyone's fun, I promise.

1063
DF Spoilers / Re: Small Favor: Why Mab got involved in the first place
« on: August 30, 2017, 03:11:30 PM »
Maeve may have tried to get Summer to kill Harry early by claiming that he was the emissary; I can see that happening, and it almost worked. It would have, actually, and might've even had the added bonus of killing Molly and Charity during the first attack.

Mab might have then made his emissary status official to prevent Summer from seeing division within Winter. It seems to me that the Fae courts take great pains to posture and appear stronger than they are, especially to one another. If it looks like Maeve and Mab aren't on the same page, then Summer might perceive that as weakness, and strike, which Mab can't afford—her Knight is off the table, so the appearance that her Lady is working against her might be too tempting to pass up. I do think that Mab knows for a fact that Maeve is infected at this point; she's speaking entirely through Cait Sith, for the first time (as far as I recall; I'm finishing my annual reread, and have only hit Proven Guilty), and I've always understood her anger to be because she realized her daughter had been taken and there was no turning back. I figure that she didn't move against Maeve officially because (A) she was her daughter and didn't want to hurt her if possible, and (B) she wanted to project a unified front for as long as she could. She did push for Dresden to accept pretty hard in this one, harder than she had in the past, and may have dropped any pretenses and ordered him to kill Maeve as soon as possible if he had signed up.

In my opinion, Small Favor has almost as many unanswered questions as Proven Guilty because of all this kind of thing.

1064
DF Spoilers / Re: Faith's importance spoilers
« on: August 30, 2017, 02:38:36 PM »
Not only will faith will be important, but that ring that Harry gave will be important or key somehow.

That's a good point. Remember, Harry notes that nobody had ever clocked his force ring until Kumori told him to take it off during their half-hour truce powwow. Faith would definitely check to see if he had a magic ring. Hmm.

But come on, we all know that Kumori is actually little Jenny Sells all grown up and trying to fix the world after her father ruined her life. (/sarcasm).

I do think that Kumori is someone we've seen in the main series, actually, not one of the short stories, someone who's shown up on the page of the novels. Really reaching here, but what about a resurrected Kim Delaney? A wide-eyed idealist with a track record of messing with stuff that's way too powerful for her is brought back from a terrible death by Necromancer Cowl, then apprenticed and taught that all death could be conquered with enough power. Sure, I could see it. Almost certainly not the case, of course, but with necromancy involved, it's hard to eliminate too many people.

1065
DF Spoilers / Re: Murphy in Peace Talks (WoJ spoilers)
« on: August 18, 2017, 01:36:10 PM »
No, truth is he couldn't he had been mostly dead for half of that year and in rehab for the rest...  She also had good reason to believe he was dead in Ghost Story, so why weren't her first words to Harry, "HARRY!  YOU'RE ALIVE! I thought you were dead, what happened?"  But no, about her feeling betrayed because he didn't call or write....

Murphy didn't know about Harry being held by Mab. When he tells her, she even points out that it's really unlikely that Harry couldn't have figured out how to contact her. Dresden's narration agrees that yeah, if he had really wanted to, he probably could have, but didn't. Thomas is the only one who really has the reaction a lot of fans probably want, and I get it, but hers is perfectly consistent with her character.

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Point here is, she knows she shouldn't wield one, her instincts are right...  But she brings it anyway... Does she even ask Harry's opinion on whether or not that was a good idea considering?  No...  Did she trust that he might agree with her? No..  Instead she hides it like a fat lady hiding a candy wrapper thinking no one would notice..  For all her smarts, she displayed her ignorance because she should have known that Nick was listening in and would set her up.. Harry realized it the minute she pulled the Sword out that he didn't know she had with her, but it was too late then..

She doesn't have to ask Harry for permission. First, she has the swords already, and Dresden has accepted that by Skin Game. He doesn't say "Bring the swords," he says, "Are you going to bring the swords?"

Second, she really doesn't have to ask him if it's a good idea, because he had already told her it was.

Skin Game, from pages 40-41 on my Nook:
(click to show/hide)

Anyway, Harry makes his opinion clear. He thinks they should be used, Murphy says she has to be careful.

And, again, her making a mistake doesn't mean she makes that mistake out of distrust. I didn't say that she was smart to hide it—in fact, I said quite the opposite. I'm not sure what Nic listening in has to do with anything; he didn't hear anything about the Sword, because she didn't say anything about it.


Quote
Not cheerleader, but supportive...  If you have a alcoholic that has stayed off the booze for a year, do you berate him because he went off to kick the habit?  Or do you say something to the effect that he looks great or keep up the good work you are there for him?  That's what friends do...

I'm not sure which point you're referring to. In Cold Days, Harry isn't an alcoholic who laid off booze for a year, he's an alcoholic who's been sipping amaretto for the past hour and insisting that he's fine, and she's trying to make sure he doesn't have his car keys. In Skin Game, I don't see any berating at all.

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Evidence?  The fact that she keeps reminding him he could turn into a monster... That means she thinks he could still turn into a monster... No, my friend she doesn't completely trust that he won't.

She mentioned it at the beginning and the end of Cold Days, because Harry keeps saying so. He arranged his own suicide because he was terrified that he might turn into one. She then says that she's afraid because she might like it too much.

And yet she spent the rest of Cold Days right there with him, trusting him enough to charge at the Wild Hunt, then, you know, drive a motorcycle across Lake Michigan.

In Skin Game, the only time (that I can recall) that she comes close to saying "Oh my God Harry you're going to murder us all" is when they first get to the slaughterhouse, and Harry starts creepily listing off reasons not to murder someone with zero context. They see someone, and the temperature in the car drops, and Harry starts saying, "Reason one: witnesses," and so on. Even then, her response isn't to, you know, run, or say "Harry you're an animal and should be locked up," it's the following:
Skin Game, page 45-46 on my Nook:
(click to show/hide)

In the above, she's acknowledging that he has a problem, which, to continue with the alcoholism comparison, is kind of important. Harry is explaining his experience, and she agrees that it's bad, because, you know, it is. He just spent a few minutes talking himself out of murder. Then she tells him that he can figure out a way to get out of it. She's telling an alcoholic that he needs to get help.

In what way is that not supportive? If I were to read Harry's conversation with Michael cynically, it's not a stretch to say that Michael is simply enabling him. Harry tells him he's worried he might change. Michael just says, "You won't. You're Harry!" I get it, and Michael is probably my favorite character, but it's a little dangerous to feed that kind of thinking for too long.

It makes Harry feel better, and he probably needed to hear something like it at that particularly low moment (less than an hour after he failed to protect yet another innocent man) but I think most people would agree that just cruising along as he has is not a long-term solution. Harry needs to lose the Winter Knight's mantle, or he's not going to last too much longer.

Don't get me wrong, that's not the way I read the conversation, really, but my point is that pretty much any conversation, viewed cynically enough, is bad for Harry.

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Do you think Butters would have come to mistrust Harry in a vacuum?  She may not have added to it, but I bet she didn't disabuse him of that notion either.

She disabuses him of it on the page, in front of us. We get to see her do it. We don't see what happens between Cold Days and Skin Game, so we don't know what took place between them. Murphy's reaction to Butters doesn't indicate one way or another that she's heard any of it before.

We do know Butters's reasons for distrusting him, and he doesn't mention Murphy at all.

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