Anyone Else Surprised or Disappointed That Harry

[The_Sibelis]

@straydog, considering Kincaid was definitely aiming center mass I don't see your point? However, no. I don't think oswald was, he hit him twice in the head and neck, firing from behind them where his center mass would have been covered by the car.

[StrayDog]

@straydog, considering Kincaid was definitely aiming center mass I don't see your point? However, no. I don't think oswald was, he hit him twice in the head and neck, firing from behind them where his center mass would have been covered by the car.

Oswald is a very poor comparison to be trying to use but please take a comparable weapon, measure a city block, put a target up and see what it looks like. Since when do bullets not pass through cars or seats or walls for that matter. Just because he scored a head shot means nothing about where he was aiming.

[StrayDog]

Why is nobody arguing the obvious? Kincaid didn't want to kill Harry. He selected  the smallest caliber that would get the job done and used and AP round so it would cause minimum damage. If he wanted Harry dead it would have been a 50cal incendiary round. Instead of small hole in, small hole out and even small hole in wall behind, it would have been small hole in and back half of torso splattered against the wall behind.

[The_Sibelis]

Oswald is a very poor comparison to be trying to use but please take a comparable weapon, measure a city block, put a target up and see what it looks like. Since when do bullets not pass through cars or seats or walls for that matter. Just because he scored a head shot means nothing about where he was aiming.

a tumbling bullet does not penetrate like a rifled round no.. And pretty much any military trained basic rifleman can make a shot on target from a mere block, it's required to pass basic.. idk why your arguing semantics on LHO. Aim small hit small. Got any evidence he wasn't aiming for his head? Cause two, not one but TWO shots to the head are hard to argue against.

[Dina]

For God's sake. Kinkaid was contracted (by Harry) to kill Harry and he does his contract. He also told him that he would go for the head if he even tried to kill him, so he would. The only reason he went for the chest is because Ivy asked him and to do it and threatened him if he didn't obey her.

[Mira]

Why is nobody arguing the obvious? Kincaid didn't want to kill Harry. He selected  the smallest caliber that would get the job done and used and AP round so it would cause minimum damage. If he wanted Harry dead it would have been a 50cal incendiary round. Instead of small hole in, small hole out and even small hole in wall behind, it would have been small hole in and back half of torso splattered against the wall behind.

Well, it also put a small hole in his heart..  I wouldn't be shocked if Ivy tipped off Mab so she'd be waiting in the water to catch Harry, lower the water temperature around him as well as his body temperature.  Not unlike when open heart surgery is performed, so if he was still living when he hit the water, she made sure he'd stay living.. She still almost lost though because of Uriel's stunt.  However it might have been Uriel that nudged the bullet ever so slightly so it wouldn't be fatal.

[StrayDog]

Aim small hit small.

LOL People still say that don't they!! I haven't heard that in years! Read that and actually laughed out loud! Thanks for that! My grandfather told me that way back when he was teaching me to hunt. I was trying to hit this tin can on the opposite bank across a stream waaayyy out back on my grandparent's farm but not having much luck. He had corrected my sitting posture and was working on my breathing when he said that. A couple of shots latter I holed the can and spent the next two days strutting around like a rooster spouting "Aim small, hit small" every chance I got. Dad quickly got tired of it though. Good times!!!!

My life doesn't permit me to read every scrap JB puts out about DF. Clearly JB has memorialized that Ivy [Harry's friend] had made arrangements with Mab [the evil Fae queen that Harry is DESPERATE to get away from] for Kincaid [the assassin Harry contracted to kill Mab's new Winter Knight] to shoot Harry through the heart [a more survivable injury than through the head] so he can fall into the lake where Mab [the evil Fae queen that Harry is DESPERATE to get away from] can save him and then [after 6 months of Harry being literally at death's door] she can take him to the center of her power where he is completely under her control while he recovers from the most compromised physical [and maybe mental] state he probably has ever been in. Guys, I think this part of the conversation has jumped it's shark.

The_Sibelis - Thank you sincerely for the much needed chuckle today.

[Dina]

StrayDog, well, whenever you have time, read "Goodbye". Is a microfiction, it's in the official JB site and it saves you discussion time. In fact, here is the link, just move pass the trailer announcement.
https://www.jim-butcher.com/posts/2020/microfiction-3-con-swap-and-virtual-signing

Also, I understand. I have not read Zoo Day, for instance (no money to buy Brief Cases) or the comics (same reason).

[Sormyst]

Thank you, had not read that story

[Dina]

You are welcome

[CrusherJen]

Clearly JB has memorialized that Ivy [Harry's friend] had made arrangements with Mab [the evil Fae queen that Harry is DESPERATE to get away from] for Kincaid [the assassin Harry contracted to kill Mab's new Winter Knight] to shoot Harry through the heart [a more survivable injury than through the head] so he can fall into the lake where Mab [the evil Fae queen that Harry is DESPERATE to get away from] can save him and then [after 6 months of Harry being literally at death's door] she can take him to the center of her power where he is completely under her control while he recovers from the most compromised physical [and maybe mental] state he probably has ever been in. Guys, I think this part of the conversation has jumped it's shark.

If Ivy had said nothing, done nothing, Harry most likely would have died from a bullet in the head. Sure, surviving and winding up in Mab's clutches isn't the best place for Harry to be, but considering the alternative... Alive and in a bad situation is better than dead and gone. And what else could she really do? The Archive is supposed to be neutral, aware but interfering as little as possible in events outside of the Oblivion War. So my WAG is, Ivy was extremely limited in what she could alter, and changing Kincaid's aim was the absolute limit of what she could do. What happened after wasn't something she could control; she had to have faith in Harry to get through it as well as he could. (I could be wrong, of course, which is why I'm labeling this theory a WAG. YMMV.)

The notion that Ivy tipped Mab off interesting, but I suspect Mab would have been able to find Harry without it, through the tie of Winter power that binds Knight and Queen. So... it's a possibility, but I'm thinking it's less than likely that Ivy had to contact Mab at all. Again, YMMV.

[Arjan]

If Ivy had said nothing, done nothing, Harry most likely would have died from a bullet in the head. Sure, surviving and winding up in Mab's clutches isn't the best place for Harry to be, but considering the alternative... Alive and in a bad situation is better than dead and gone. And what else could she really do? The Archive is supposed to be neutral, aware but interfering as little as possible in events outside of the Oblivion War. So my WAG is, Ivy was extremely limited in what she could alter, and changing Kincaid's aim was the absolute limit of what she could do. What happened after wasn't something she could control; she had to have faith in Harry to get through it as well as he could. (I could be wrong, of course, which is why I'm labeling this theory a WAG. YMMV.)

The notion that Ivy tipped Mab off interesting, but I suspect Mab would have been able to find Harry without it, through the tie of Winter power that binds Knight and Queen. So... it's a possibility, but I'm thinking it's less than likely that Ivy had to contact Mab at all. Again, YMMV.

But when did the archive tip off Mab? If it was just before the hit Mab would have prevented it. I think she was there just because she was watching her knight.

[CrusherJen]

I'm not sure Ivy tipped off Mab at all. I think it's more likely Mab sensed her Knight was in danger through the bonds of Winter power and acted to save him on her own. I'm not completely ruling out the idea that Ivy contacted Mab, but I don't find it likely. It's an interesting theory though.

[magnuskn]

   Didn't talk to Ivy?  Yes, I understand she is totally into her Archive role now, but she is still Ivy.  I
believe that Ivy still sees Harry as a friend.  What I thought was weird, he didn't even give her
a head nod in acknowledgement or vice versa..

Yeah, absolutely. It's basically my biggest disappointment of the two-parter, aside from the Merlin not having a talk with Harry (which is a minor point compared to him not talking with Ivy).

[forumghost]

TBH I just assumed that Mab was there waiting for it because she expected Harry to try and kill himself to get out of being her Knight because that was very much a Harry thing to do.