The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
What the heck was Justin *UP* to??!?
Mira:
--- Quote from: morriswalters on August 17, 2022, 05:22:43 PM ---They can kill without leaving a trace. And not the Court but one individual. It makes Harry an orphan. Unless you think is was random chance. First isolate Harry and make Malcolm his only attachment point. When the time is right kill Malcolm. Harry goes into the system. This is tailor made to create a sociopath or psychopath or whatever. Harry gets his magic, out pops Justin who mixes cruelty and affection in the right doses and supplies Harry with a sexual partner. You get a monster with a lot of power.
--- End quote ---
Yes, and do it in such a way that Malcolm wouldn't feel threatened while it was happening. Being a female, I have no clue what guys dream about when they have wet dreams, but just Googled it. What it said was it wasn't uncommon to sleep through a wet dream, and it isn't uncommon for an adult to have them. So a WCVamp could feed on a sleeping Malcolm until he died while dreaming a dream of pleasure. And unless he shared a bed with his father, it is unlikely that a six year old child would be wakened by any of this. However having said all of that, I still don't think the White Court had anything to do with Malcolm's death.. However Justin could very well have.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM ---Gosh, even I am amazed by this.
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;D ;D ;D
My work here is done!
...
Oh wait, no it's not! ;)
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM --- ... Why didn’t Nameless take Bob himself? Bob was deathly afraid of Mab so Nameless couldn’t take Bob back to Winter ...
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I have a separate WAG, here:
Bob says he is terrified of Winter, & Mab. What if Mab is actually only mildly amused by the whole "Bob situation?" What if she regards Bob mostluy as an asset? I mean: do you REALLY think that Mab didn't know -- when she told Harry, "kill Maeve" -- that Harry could learn how from Bob?
I've heard the theory that Lea was Bob's nonhuman parent; what if that was on Mab's orders? Or even Mab herself??? Done explicitly to create an asset within the mortal world, a tempting entity that wizards would value?
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM --- ... Nameless kills Malcolm and uses his legal and magical skills to make Harry vanish ...
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I really think that our clue was Morgan's use of the Summer Favor. Jim showed us that happening, and that's where he told us how Harry vanished. Yes, there are undoubtedly any number of other magical entities who could have done it; but Mr. Butcher loves his clues and his EasterEggs, and Morgan's use of the Summer Token was how he showed us the "vanishing trick" that was used on Harry. Plus, as noted, WoJ says Lea did something that would make Harry want to kill her, and murdering Malcom (to steal Harry) seems the faerie-narrative straighforward option (it's even in-keeping with the "protect Harry" edict -- in Lea's own, inimitable "crazy scary sidhe lady" way -- since mortal Malcom would be unable to "protect Harry" in the face of supernatural threats).
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM --- Where did Justin learn the type of mind control on Elaine? It isn’t something even Wardens are taught...
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Bob is the obvious source. Capiorcorpus knew a tremendous amount of mind-magic, and we can presume their master Kemmler knew quite a bit, too (and thus lab-assistant-cum-notebook Bob also does); this is amply confirmed the very first time Harry met BlueEyedBob, who promptly mentally-paralyzed Harry.
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM --- ... Mab becomes involved with Harry for the first time in Summer Knight ...
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Seriously?
You're saying that Mab wasn't involved before this? Outsider-fighting, long-range-planning, ultra-manipulative Mab, who knew the Starborn cycle was due again? Who knew Margaret LeFay? Whose own handmaiden was the boy's Faerie Godmother???
And that person "becomes involved with Harry for the first time in Summer Knight" ???
I've got a bridge to Arctis Tor to sell you, man... Weird little glitch in an ancient Winter contract. Just need to exercise your option!
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM --- ... In Proven Guilty ... Molly comes to Mab’s attention as a possible back up to her back up Winter Lady, Lea is cured and tasked with training Molly (a strange task otherwise for Mab’s second).
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Au contraire, mon ami!
Lea was seeing to Molly's training for at least a year or two already!
Winter knew of the Knights, obviously (and was very interested, as witness their attempts to grab a Sword from time to time). And the confluence of Harry with a Knight is doubly-interesing... or maybe interesting-squared.
That automatically makes Molly interesting to Mab and to Lea.
So when Molly begins to show Talent, they "arrange" for her to get "appropriate" training (i.e. haphazard, explicitly with clues to (Black) mind-magic). This sets her up to be interesting to Harry, and vulnerable to Mab's fetches.
Molly was taken to Arctis Tor on Mab's explicit orders; the Fetches were there on Mab's explicit orders; it was -- again! -- all Mab.
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on August 17, 2022, 02:01:31 AM ---Mab hasn’t been controlling Harry’s destiny, (at least not before) Summer Knight, Uriel has ...
Harry really isn’t being controlled by anyone, he’s just ...
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Neither Mab nor Uriel has been "controlling" Harry, nor his destiny. They've nevertheless both had their hands in, stirring the pot and adding new challenges & new opportunities (with Odin right alongside them, it should be noted!). But Uriel is all about the "free will," so "controlling destiny" is anathema to him. Similarly, Mab needs Harry to be free-willed to be a top-tier Knight (which she needs for the coming conflict).
Mira:
Another thought about Justin being in on Malcolm's death, then seeing to it that Harry "disappeared" into the foster system. It was the plan all along, given the hundreds and yeah after five years thousands even, of kids processed through the system, how is it that Justin just happened to find out about Elaine and Harry? Did Justin ever strike you as the nurturing type who desperately wanted a son and daughter of his own to raise and train? He wasn't, not without a plan, and further he may have had someone with in the system to let Justin know about these kids.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on August 17, 2022, 07:53:37 PM --- Another thought about Justin being in on Malcolm's death, then seeing to it that Harry "disappeared" into the foster system. It was the plan all along, given the hundreds and yeah after five years thousands even, of kids processed through the system, how is it that Justin just happened to find out about Elaine and Harry? Did Justin ever strike you as the nurturing type who desperately wanted a son and daughter of his own to raise and train? He wasn't, not without a plan, and further he may have had someone with in the system to let Justin know about these kids.
--- End quote ---
If Justin was "in on" Malcolm's death, he was very-likely equally "in on" the hiding-Harry action, knew the brat was LeFay's get (and via Salic Law, a likely wizard); and maybe even knew of her Kwisatz Haderach plans.
As per my own theory in the OP above, it was actually Faerie action that "vanished" Harry: Lea being Faerie Godmother, protecting Harry.
Then later -- when the plans called for him to be trained as a wizard -- she "sold" him (bargained him (Faeries LOVE to bargain for Firstborn children!) to Justin DuMorne.
###
I have *NO* idea how Elaine got roped-in to Justin's plans; but consensus seems to be that she's also a Starborn, or at least a Starborn-candidate.
Given that she ended up Summer-aligned -- and Harry ended up Winter-aligned -- I have to presume that (due to "Summer/Winter balance" in the Dresdenverse; when one moves the other perforce makes a matching counter-move) Summer was similarly pulling Elaine's strings... likely, even before she was conceived. Hers too was an intentional effort to beget a Starborn wizard. But other than that rough shape, we have (iirc/afaik) zero canonical/WoJ details about Elaine Mallory before Justin adopted her (she is remarkably a cipher in this regard; Jim has been canny here).
morriswalters:
Assuming that Malcolm was a mortal how did Lea kill him? He wasn't linked to either Court. Doesn't that run afoul of Winter Law? Isn't that the purpose of the Winter Knight. Can Lea just go out and murder at will? Maybe I misunderstand what Winter Law means.
If Lea had sold Harry why was she still hanging around. She watched over Harry at the orphanage. And she was close enough that when Harry ran she was where she could offer him help.
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