The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
What the heck was Justin *UP* to??!?
g33k:
Over in the "... first few books" thread, I wrote:
--- Quote from: g33k on August 16, 2022, 08:50:05 PM --- I suspect Justin was mostly his own agent, seeking his own power (but working with other parties (often as a "junior" (often a very junior) ally). But I think I'll spin that into another thread, so as not to drift this one too much... Justin (& his agenda) is part of Harry's (still very mysterious & unexplained) origin-story, not merely a "first few books" topic!
--- End quote ---
Herewith, the "Justin & his agency" thread ...
Harry's understanding is, Justin was simply a Warden-gone-bad. A warlock who was seeking personal power, who grabbed Kemmler's skull as a personal power-up, dropped off-radar, then grabbed a couple of promising proto-wizards to enthrall as core of his own Brute Squad. And summoned Outsiders because (a) why not? (b) "Dark Wizard, Harry, as dark as they come"
Which may be true, as far as it goes... but I don't think it goes far enough.
To begin with: the odds of Justin "happening" to end up with a couple of possible/probable Starborn wizards seems vanishingly small. Did he specifically target them? Was he guided to them by a 3rd party, maybe not even knowing their "provenance" & significance? Or...?
Next: how was Harry hidden, in the orphanage... hidden even from wizards? Morgan was looking for him; Dollars to diamonds that Eb was, too! Remember: these are top-tier Wardens; but Wardens aren't just "enforcers," they are also magical investigators. Was Justin part of hiding Harry (Morgan implies so, in the "Journal" microfiction)? If Justin wasn't... how did Justin find Harry? Eb, after all, had blood-of-his-blood as needed to use in a tracking spell!
My theory (ok, "theories..." or WAGs if you will):
* Yes, Justin was a warlock, a former Warden turned to Black Magic. If nothing else, the enthrallment is proof: that kind of mental-domination magic is automatically a death sentence, and (per WoJ) inherently self-corruptive.
* Harry was hidden by the Leanansidhe, as part of her "protect Harry" / "Faerie Godmother" deal with Margaret LeFay (n.b. we later saw Morgan invoke his "Summer Esquire" pin to get a period of being similarly un-findable); I have a further WAG that Mab was already involved: she knew something BAT-y was coming up, and wanted a Wizard & Starborn as her Knight (bcuz srsly, ppl -- u wanna say Mab's Handmaiden wasn't doing Mab's will in theses portentous matters??!? Mab, the most conniving & long-range-planning actor we know (running neck&neck with Odin).
* It then follows from #2 that it was Lea (proxyMab) who helped DuMorne find Harry. (Training as a wizard would absolutely be "protecting Harry" as per her deal; and it would later let her fulfill the other FG trope: showing up to "rescue" Harry from DuMorne! Still unclear is if they were "working together" all along, or if Lea just reached out to Justin when it was time for Harry to move on); even more mysterious, in all this: what was Elaine's pre-Justin origin-story??!? (noting that Harry went Winter & Elaine went Summer).
* Going back to Harry's origin -- as a Starborn, a planned birth -- we had Margaret planning this far in advance (including the infamous party where she tried to lure the Blackstaff into the plan (and where Ramp Duchess Ortega spotted the Ebenezer/Margaret family dynamic)).
So, then: Let's go even further back. Back to Margaret LeFay, pre-Raith. She is walking the Ways, well-known to Faerie-kind. Including known to Lea, and to Mab.
It is Mab herself who plants the seed of the idea with Margaret LeFay; the seed that is to become Harry Dresden: the idea that a Starborn Wizard is a good path to power. Mab works via Lea as proxy. Lea is instructed to -- subtly -- put herself into Margaret's path, to encounter her often enough to strike up a relationship, to begin a series of bargains and deals. Eventually -- when the starborn seed bears fruit -- to become the child's Faerie Godmother.
It was Mab all along.
Lea (& Mab) keep an eye on Harry & Malcom. Eventually, Lea kills Malcom (we have WoJ that something Lea did will make Harry want to kill her), and takes Harry away to an orphanage; likely it's Mab herself keeping him veiled from all other surveillance or tracking.
Then they "permit" DuMorne to find Harry. Maybe they even work a "bargain," where DuMorne gives them something (what?) in return for being told where to get a wizardling child of great potential. As noted above -- at this point, they WANT Harry being given wizard training. Hard, brutal training, of the sort Winter approves.
It was Mab all along.
AND it was ... Odin!
Because if you think that wily old wolf didn't see all the same signs that Mab saw... well, think again. Also, Odin has seen several of the Starborn cycles... he may even have planted the idea with Mab, as she did with Margaret; 0r maybe they concocted it together.
Fast-forward'ing again, to Justin. Mab (or Lea) gets Harry into Justin's hands. Justin likely has little to no idea how much high-level planning, for decades at least, has gone into this moment. He may not even know he's got a Starborn 'prentice.
He thinks he's just pursuing his own power, his own best interests.
That just makes him more amenable to being manipulated as a pawn of much-greater powers.
Conspiracy Theorist:
Gosh, even I am amazed by this.
The new facts added to the timeline by the Law is that Nameless was an associate of Kemmler and knew of Bob, and that in the fallout of Kemmlers latest death he sought Asylum in Winter and he was kicked out of Arctis Tor after the attack on it in Proven Guilty.
Why didn’t Nameless take Bob himself? Bob was deathly afraid of Mab so Nameless couldn’t take Bob back to Winter, and as soon as Nameless swore to Winter she would know of him (which suggest Mab has known about Bob ever since Harry took on the Mantle back in Changes as a vassal of her vassal) Nameless would need someone to hold onto Bob in the mortal world, especially with regard to The Word. That was Justin seduced by a Demi-god of Discord.
This is before Harry or even Thomas is born, the elusive Margaret LeFay would be visiting both Faerie Courts during the period from Kemmler’s death onward where Nameless had ensconced himself in Winter (I doubt Summer would have had him) Nameless introduces Margaret to his associate Lord Raith to control her, if Nameless had bound her to him like Laplander she would have become a vassal of Winter and Mab would know under Winter Law. Raith lets Nameless down when Margaret escapes, perhaps with the Leansidhes help before his pet Starborn can be conceived. That means Nameless has a grudge against Lea, and Raith.
Nameless kills Malcolm and uses his legal and magical skills to make Harry vanish, frustrating the watching Morgan, who even Nameless is wary of.
Where did Justin learn the type of mind control on Elaine? It isn’t something even Wardens are taught, but there is one new character who appears to have used exactly the same type of mind control- Nameless on Ms Laplander. Nameless teaches the technique to Justin as Justin is to train the Starborn. Justin gets above himself and takes on Elaine as a second apprentice, practising on her the technique which is a fatal mistake.
Harry kills Justin and takes Bob, Elaine seeks asylum in Summer. Nameless cannot intervene as Lea was summoned by Harry, intensifying his grudge against her.
Nameless tests Harry by throwing Victor Sells and the HexenWulf at Harry. Harry passes.
Nameless gets his revenge on Lea in Grave Peril, (and tries to on Raith later in White Night) leaving her nemfected. Mab becomes involved with Harry for the first time in Summer Knight, as Lea appears to be breaking Winter Law. She takes on Leas bargain with Harry as payment for Leas cure. Harry passes her test solves the case and to her surprise kills an immortal showing his Destroyer tendency. The offer of being the new Winter Knight is made at this point.
In Dead Beat a copy of The Word is unearthed bringing out the Kemmlerites and Nameless, Nameless takes advantage of the situation to try for a power up which would allow for him to break away from Mab and Winter Law. He fails.
In Small Favour Uriel is introduced, in The Warrior Uriel tells Harry about the myriad small impacts he has had on people.
In Proven Guilty we get the attack on Arctis Tor which sees Nameless expelled, but Molly comes to Mab’s attention as a possible back up to her back up Winter Lady, Lea is cured and tasked with training Molly (a strange task otherwise for Mab’s second).
In White Night Nameless is sowing discord amongst the Houses of the White Court in revenge for Raith’s earlier failure.
In Changes Harry finally accepts the Mantle, after Uriel turns him down, but after Sanya saves his life. Mab learns about Bob but Harry is about to use him in the genocide of the Red Court, shortly thereafter Harry gets himself shot, and Bob goes to Butters and away from Mab’s control.
In Ghost Story Mab is shown to be working with Uriel all along .
In Skin Game Uriel lends Michael his Grace to allow Harry to finish the mission.
In Peace Talks and Battle Ground Sanya is stranded in Chicago just when Harry needs him. Uriel’s doing, as was the creation of a second Knight in Skin Game.
Mab hasn’t been controlling Harry’s destiny, (at least not before) Summer Knight, Uriel has. There is one Uriel in the Multiverse, but a Mab for each universe, so when Harry’s decision in Grave Peril (Susan or Michael, meant he tried for both) it created a new timeline where Harry could be the Harry we know, and the potential saviour of this cycle for the multiverse, but to do that Uriel had to allow events to unfold to this point, as all the other Dresdens failed. That’s when he started working with Mab on Harry. Uriel allowed for the manipulation of Margaret LeFay, Malcolm and Harry by Nameless, and thereafter Harry by Mab.
Nameless is of course Cowl, the demi-god of Discord and a Lawyer (which is much the same thing with more paperwork). Uriel can rarely intervene in the mortal world, but he really doesn’t have to, he picks the winners of a multitude of worlds, letting an infinite number of Dresden’s use their free will to make an infinite number of different decisions which either advance his goals or not. Free will means Harry has to act like Harry, Cowl like Cowl, Mab like Mab etc.
Harry really isn’t being controlled by anyone, he’s just the Harry who has had the right decisions made about him and by him to get to this point.
Mira:
--- Quote ---It was Mab all along.
--- End quote ---
Think so, there are plenty of hints that Winter's protection of her baby was one of the assurances that motivated Margaret to give birth to Harry. Though it appears that the White Council had a lot to do with it as well. But Margaret threw a monkey wrench in all of their plans, she picked the father, and he was one of the purest and good souls alive, Malcolm.
Conspiracy Theorist:
The Leansidhe not Winter, she was definitely acting in her own interest when dealing with Margaret and Harry, their bargains were personal to her, not made with Winter.
The Leansidhe is effectively a muse, she provides inspiration to the gifted , raising them up but causes them an early death (which is why I think she is Bob’s mother, they die when a new spirit of intellect emerges as Harry nearly did) these are bargains she does in her right, not on behalf of Winter, in the same way Nameless represents Marcone in Court unless Winter Law gets in the way. Not everything a denizen of Winter does is automatically an act of Winter, unless you are a Queen.
Mab only became involved with Harry when Lea was nemfected, because she has a Mantle it became Winter business at that point.
There is a WOJ that when Harry finds out the true nature of Margaret’s deal with Lea he will want to kill her. That I think leads to two possibilities (1) that Lea wanted the first daughter of her line, which would be Maggie, or (2) that Margaret traded Malcolm’s life for Harry as part of her usual schtick, and Lea killed Malcolm perhaps giving rise to a new spirit of intellect in the process. Either would incite Harry to murder her. I favour (1) as there is another WOJ that Maggie is going to be something different, perhaps a new Leansidhe? She already has a thing for large dogs…..
forumghost:
One thing I'd like to point out is that Justin was apparently part of Maggie Sr's little Injustice League back in the day:
--- Quote from: Blood Rites ---"The Council knew that you were the son of Margaret LeFay. They knew that she was one of the wizards who had turned the Council's own laws against it. She was guilty of violating the First Law, among others, and she had . . . unsavory associations with various entities of dubious reputation. The Wardens were under orders to arrest her on sight. She'd have been tried and executed in moments when she was brought before the Council." "I was told she died in childbirth," I said. "She did," Ebenezar confirmed. "I don't know why, but for some reason she turned away from her previous associates—including Justin DuMorne. After that, nowhere was safe for her. She ran from her former allies and from the Wardens for perhaps two years. And she ran from me. I had my orders regarding her as well."
--- End quote ---
So there's a possible angle to consider there
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