ParanetOnline
The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: elerem on October 04, 2020, 06:14:02 AM
-
A bit crazy that in a series on God's and wizards this breaks my believability but here it goes:
Does anyone buy Butters becoming a athlete in a few months?
He runs around at high speed all night all around the city without any issue and harry mentions how strong he is for his size multiple times.
It's only been a few months they even say it in battle grounds
Really there were so many glowing descriptions of Butters. Far too many. As a knight he is also better then Sanya... Which just feels wrong. Sanya doesn't get his moment to defy a God like Butters does. Sanya is the one that has been doing this for far longer is stronger and deserved it more imo.
just feels like another step to butters being a god at everything,
-
Butters has turned into “hetero male geek wish fulfillment” character. It is not a good look on him.
-
^ Sooo much this. Really don't like that kind of thing with any character and Butters has really worn out his welcome.
-
Butters was already thin and minimally fit. He's been dating a young werewolf for a couple years now that probably stepped up his fitness. He was doing well enough to start running around as a vigilante with Bob. Then he had five months of intense training with people who knew exactly what his body would need to endure.
Just Google six month transformation and you'll see just how much a difference can be made. I don't see any issue with him being physically fit enough for the job. And as for technique, he has none. He was just flailing around with a weapon that couldn't hurt the innocent.
He's got the ultimate Marty Stu weapon.
-
One of my favorite moments was when Ethniu one-shotted Butters, because he tried a silly movie-swashbuckling move.
-
@Griffyn612
Exactly. He may be in shape now, but he put so many people at risk doing what he did, battle wise.
Honestly rushed through a lot of stuff dealing with him, apart from Harry's arm being burned by his sword. Couldn't stand him and I wish he'd go away for awhile. A little bit of Butters goes a long way.
-
utters was already thin and minimally fit. He's been dating a young werewolf for a couple years now that probably stepped up his fitness. He was doing well enough to start running around as a vigilante with Bob. Then he had five months of intense training with people who knew exactly what his body would need to endure.
I think he was more fit than people think. He had been a member of Murphy's Justice League and had fought the Fomor with the help of Bob. So I do think he was pretty fit, maybe not marathon runner fit, but fit. The extra training over five months enhanced that, that and the fact that the light saber doesn't require the same kind of fitness that wielding a "normal" sword would require I think.
Just Google six month transformation and you'll see just how much a difference can be made. I don't see any issue with him being physically fit enough for the job. And as for technique, he has none. He was just flailing around with a weapon that couldn't hurt the innocent.
Perhaps that is why the Sword transformed itself in the way it did? It already knew who it was going to, Harry was merely the conduit to Butters. It knew his lack of skill and that the way things were going he'd not have a lot of time to acquire those skills or perhaps the raw talent to get them, hence a light saber that cannot damage the innocent, but works good against evil. Remember also what Michael has always said, "it isn't about the blades.." Butters wields the Sword of Faith, that is what it is about, "faith" not how well the Knight can use it.
-
It is quite clear following Day One that Butters was viewing everything through a gaming heads up display, which meant it showed him the shortest point from A to B, the surest footing etc. A huge cheat.
-
To me it was mainly that Harry seemed to remark on his improvement so many times it seemed like something that should have been removed in editing. Maybe it was a hint for something?
But also, it does not take a genius to figure out that the batman act also required being in good shape.
-
Agree with Griff and Mira, nothing weird in his physical shape. It was not so fast. Also, remember that the sword levels the ground, so I am sure it helps to prevent some fatigue. But he is not better than Sanya, that is why he screws it in the end. As Harry said, he is new.
His weapon is a super weapon, totally overpowered, but he is well deserving of it and he proved with his faith not only in the Good but also in Harry (after a time of doubt). As I said in another place, I hope Ramirez do the same journey in future books.
-
I know I have to try to remember just how much time as elapsed between Changes and now. 6 months had passed from Changes to Ghost Story. And Butters had been doing the batman routine for some if not most of it, so he had months to train or get into some sort of fighting shape. Then how long before Cold Days? About a month or so? Then a year between that and Skin Games. So we are talking probably almost 2 full years. So the months spent with the knights were just refining skills, not completely getting some skinny out of shape nerd into a fighting machine.
And obviously the sword didn't need a very skilled fighter.
-
To me it was mainly that Harry seemed to remark on his improvement so many times it seemed like something that should have been removed in editing. Maybe it was a hint for something?
But also, it does not take a genius to figure out that the batman act also required being in good shape.
I think there are many times that Butcher repeats things, specially descriptions, and that has been much worse in PT/BG. I commented in another thread that I was really tired of Harry describing how a soulgaze works and the thing about eyes being the windows of the soul. But that was not the only thing. In PT Lara got a full description twice in not so many chapters, and in BG a couple of things are mentioned again. And I think Butters is one of those things. You may be right that is a hint of something, but I've felt is more about bad editing.
-
More like him padding it to try and make one book last two volumes.
-
More like him padding it to try and make one book last two volumes.
You took the words right off my finger tips.. Yes, I think we all would have found the story more
enjoyable, if some heavy editing had been done, Peace Talks I think suffers a bit more than Battle Ground, but they could have been one book around seven hundred pages more or less and not have
broken the bank, if that really was the reason to split it into two books.
-
What it shows is that Harry is accepting the changed status of Butters. Butters is a big hitter in his own right now, not the cowering, terrified hanger on to Harry from Dead Beat. That he is every bit the equal to Michael, Shiro, Sanya or Murphy as a Knight.
-
Yes, yes, but we got that idea the first time, we don't need it repeated again and again ;D
-
Yes, yes, but we got that idea the first time, we don't need it repeated again and again ;D
What it shows is that while Harry accepted it Jim is afraid some new readers don't ;D
-
I think there are many times that Butcher repeats things, specially descriptions, and that has been much worse in PT/BG. I commented in another thread that I was really tired of Harry describing how a soulgaze works and the thing about eyes being the windows of the soul. But that was not the only thing. In PT Lara got a full description twice in not so many chapters, and in BG a couple of things are mentioned again. And I think Butters is one of those things. You may be right that is a hint of something, but I've felt is more about bad editing.
Is JB getting out in the weeds in his own series? Experiencing regular bouts of writer's block? This is one of the early signs that the writer is reaching for content. Next comes creating OP weapons, protagonists, and antagonists. Followed up by death being meaningless, ie. bringing dead characters and/or broken items back at the expense of the story. All of this descends into alternate realities and/or alternate timelines. PT was acceptable enough to be entertaining but BG was almost too hard to complete.
-
It is a problem many writers of big series have. Some people start with the latest book and not with first. Jim wants to keep them on board too.
-
Is JB getting out in the weeds in his own series? Experiencing regular bouts of writer's block? This is one of the early signs that the writer is reaching for content. Next comes creating OP weapons, protagonists, and antagonists. Followed up by death being meaningless, ie. bringing dead characters and/or broken items back at the expense of the story. All of this descends into alternate realities and/or alternate timelines. PT was acceptable enough to be entertaining but BG was almost too hard to complete.
Oh, I completely disagree. First, I think it was just a problem of writing a book, spiting it in two, rewriting for make each book more independent. It lost some of the organic sense most JB books have. Second, I found PT quite messy and somehow difficult to read, while I enjoyed BG (except for the constant fear of losing characters. Something like watching GoT knowing that some character you love could die every minute. So I am looking forward for a rereading. I think I will have more fun and enjoy it even better)
-
It is a problem many writers of big series have. Some people start with the latest book and not with first. Jim wants to keep them on board too.
Tough, read Storm Front instead.
-
@Dina
Given that you enjoyed BG and look forward to rereading it and I found parts so mind-numbingly repetitive that I skipped them the first time around. Still have only been able to go to the chapters that have something in them. Pretty sure you will start each reply to my posts with "Oh, I completely disagree ..." This has actually made participating in this forum an order of magnitude more interesting than parts of BG. On an aside, don't start ppl on GoT they have some visceral responses.
@Conspiracy Theorist
LOL classic!
-
Tough, read Storm Front instead.
I started with small favor because that was the book available in the bookstore when I bought it after reading a few chapters. They did not have the older books, only the one that was just in paperback.
I read the rest out of order until turn coat.
-
LOL StrayDog.
It is very rare for me to begin a saga "in the middle". I am sure that if I had born later I would have began SW with Ep1. Similarly, I began the Asimov Robots saga with Foundation. I've read the prequels much later than the original trilogy.
-
What it shows is that Harry is accepting the changed status of Butters. Butters is a big hitter in his own right now, not the cowering, terrified hanger on to Harry from Dead Beat. That he is every bit the equal to Michael, Shiro, Sanya or Murphy as a Knight.
Yes, and Harry is happy for him. I disagree with how you describe Butters in Dead Beat, that is how Thomas described Butters in Dead Beat, thankfully Harry didn't agree with him. Let's see, this cowering,terrified hanger on, with the help of Mouse, saved Harry from being slowly killed by Cassius. That is when I wrote a thread that Butters would be a Holy Knight some day, I was right. This little cowering, terrified hanger on, was scared out of his wits, true, but he did everything he could with in his capacity to aid Harry. This little cowering, terrified hanger on, was able to take instruction draw a circle, stand in it, and drum away on his polka machine to keep Sue going while all manner of monsters and hell was going on around him.. Butters never was a coward, scared out of his skin, yes, terrified, yes, but overcame it to aid Harry when the chips were down. I call that a very brave man.
-
Oh, I completely disagree. First, I think it was just a problem of writing a book, spiting it in two, rewriting for make each book more independent. It lost some of the organic sense most JB books have. Second, I found PT quite messy and somehow difficult to read, while I enjoyed BG (except for the constant fear of losing characters. Something like watching GoT knowing that some character you love could die every minute. So I am looking forward for a rereading. I think I will have more fun and enjoy it even better)
I agree, I like Battle Ground, however I found that Peace Talks was a bit of a bore. Yes, stuff happened in it that were important later in Battle Ground, but it never seemed to quite come together. Maybe because so much of it was invested in the rescue of Thomas?
-
Yes, Mira. Anyway I think my main problem with PT were the first chapters, that seemed disjointed. Like, "we are going to introduce all the characters and the problem", but not organically throwing it all together without order.
And I agree with your other post. Butters is very brave because he overcomes his fear to do what is right.
-
The problem, in my opinion, with PT is it is only half a book. Both books improve upon viewing them as a whole. And as others have stated, cut out some stuff that might not be important and it could have easily been one book.
-
The problem, in my opinion, with PT is it is only half a book. Both books improve upon viewing them as a whole. And as others have stated, cut out some stuff that might not be important and it could have easily been one book.
It is better on the second read, I think it tried to go in too many directions at once, so we never got Harry searching for answers. That is what was disappointing, no search for answers and no answers.
-
I agree, I like Battle Ground, however I found that Peace Talks was a bit of a bore. Yes, stuff happened in it that were important later in Battle Ground, but it never seemed to quite come together. Maybe because so much of it was invested in the rescue of Thomas?
LOL seems like my reply to Dina easily applies here as well. All adds to the spice of life :)
-
LOL seems like my reply to Dina easily applies here as well. All adds to the spice of life :)
Yes, in the sense that on the second read one looks for the bread crumbs that might actually lead to something. As in since the corner hounds were Outsider creatures it takes a mortal to call them up.. Only two anywhere close, the doorman and Justine.. Also Harry's reaction to Justine's reaction to the news about Thomas screamed that something was amiss.. But the trail went cold as soon as the crisis of the corner hounds was resolved, and the story jumped to something else.. Harry and us got sidetracked and it wasn't until the end of Battle Ground that it all came together.
-
This [repetitive descriptions] is one of the early signs that the writer is reaching for content.
It's been one of my complaints for the entire series, so I don't think it's evidence of Jim being "lost in the weeds." Continuity issues are another thing I find irksome. There were plenty in PT. I still enjoyed both books and am ready for Jim's next offering.
-
Yes, PT was particular bad in that sense but I blame the rewriting due to the split. I hope it gets better in the future.
-
Yes, PT was particular bad in that sense but I blame the rewriting due to the split. I hope it gets better in the future.
I think things will get better because his home is sorted out now and Jim started writing again on a regular basis.
-
I think things will get better because his home is sorted out now and Jim started writing again on a regular basis.
That is good, I hope that he doesn't wait another six years until he writes the next book. Yeah, there are selfish motives on my part, but I think by waiting that long he lost touch with the series. It isn't like he wasn't writing though, he had launched another series during those years etc. It may have hurt his focus, also for some reason he felt he had to write his version of War And Peace. I think to make up for almost nothing save a few mostly unsatisfactory short stories over that six
year span. I think he and us would be better served by shorter more focused closer together.
-
You took the words right off my finger tips.. Yes, I think we all would have found the story more
enjoyable, if some heavy editing had been done, Peace Talks I think suffers a bit more than Battle Ground, but they could have been one book around seven hundred pages more or less and not have
broken the bank, if that really was the reason to split it into two books.
At this point I'm left with the distinct impression the "it would have been two expensive to print it as one book" argument is dishonest.
Let's be realistic, using a fairly large font size is a choice. I'm pretty sure the word count for PT + BG is still less than a Rothfuss or Sanderson novel, and they aren't prohibitively expensive.
-
At this point I'm left with the distinct impression the "it would have been two expensive to print it as one book" argument is dishonest.
Let's be realistic, using a fairly large font size is a choice. I'm pretty sure the word count for PT + BG is still less than a Rothfuss or Sanderson novel, and they aren't prohibitively expensive.
Yes, perhaps instead of being dishonest, Jim was trying to make it up to his fans by having two books come out after so long. But if that is true, he should admit it.
-
Yes, perhaps instead of being dishonest, Jim was trying to make it up to his fans by having two books come out after so long. But if that is true, he should admit it.
I've been thinking about why I love the DF series, what about it do I love that keeps me engaged. JB has written each case file in a noir, gum-shoe, with a splash of fantasy style that is quite unique. Maybe he ran into a situation where PT was compatible to that style but BG was full epic battle scene. Could have been one book but the abrupt change in the flow of events would be too much for readers to enjoy.
-
I've been thinking about why I love the DF series, what about it do I love that keeps me engaged. JB has written each case file in a noir, gum-shoe, with a splash of fantasy style that is quite unique. Maybe he ran into a situation where PT was compatible to that style but BG was full epic battle scene. Could have been one book but the abrupt change in the flow of events would be too much for readers to enjoy.
Except PT fell down in that aspect in my opinion. I fell in love with the series for the reasons you state. Instead of Harry really drilling down on why abruptly Thomas would go off and try to assassinate Atri, it went off in five directions at once which became a bit distracting.
-
Except PT fell down in that aspect in my opinion. I fell in love with the series for the reasons you state. Instead of Harry really drilling down on why abruptly Thomas would go off and try to assassinate Atri, it went off in five directions at once which became a bit distracting.
Agreed and I see why you feel that way about PT. JB may well have written himself in the metaphorical corner and this is what arose from it.
-
At this point I'm left with the distinct impression the "it would have been two expensive to print it as one book" argument is dishonest.
Let's be realistic, using a fairly large font size is a choice. I'm pretty sure the word count for PT + BG is still less than a Rothfuss or Sanderson novel, and they aren't prohibitively expensive.
From what I saw, he wrote too much even before the split, and the publisher didn't have the equipment to publish a book the size of what it would be. They would have had to have subcontracted it out to another publisher under the parent, which was going to cost money to do and result in a $50 book. Or he could cut stuff out, or they could do the split.
-
From what I saw, he wrote too much even before the split, and the publisher didn't have the equipment to publish a book the size of what it would be. They would have had to have subcontracted it out to another publisher under the parent, which was going to cost money to do and result in a $50 book. Or he could cut stuff out, or they could do the split.
Cutting some of the stuff out, especially in Peace Talks and making Battle Ground slightly longer may have been better.
And if you were one of the poor smucks who bought them at Barns and Noble, the two together sill would have cost $50.00, actually more, $28.00 x 2 = $56.00 plus sales tax.. I hope the future books are more concise and closer together, for all of our sakes, including his.
-
Butters has turned into “hetero male geek wish fulfillment” character. It is not a good look on him.
This is going to come across as snarky and sarcastic but it is not intended that way.
Molly is written as a statuesque, could-be-model, tall, blond, Catholic, virgin, turned sexy un-aging Faerie Princess [still virgin] who has been groomed from childhood to worship the ground Harry walks on and now, as Winter Lady, been bound to Harry's will at least once.
Yet it's Butters who's widely panned as the “hetero male geek wish fulfillment” character. All JB hasn't done yet is dress Molly up in black lace frillies and parade her around Castle Dresden in high heels and a ball gag. [Thank you Avasarala] At the rate JB is going this series will end with Molly in Harry's bed chamber re-enacting the tie scene from Pretty Woman! "How was your day Dear ..."
I know I'm being redundant, tiresome, and boring but Molly deserves better!
-
I share most of what you say (specially because I see no problems with Butters) but just a comment. When Molly was bound to Harry's will. I see it the other way around. She is the boss (and, btw, Harry is in her debt).
-
I share most of what you say (specially because I see no problems with Butters) but just a comment. When Molly was bound to Harry's will. I see it the other way around. She is the boss (and, btw, Harry is in her debt).
Yes he is, and in a big way too. Will be interesting to see how JB writes that.
-
Molly couldn't possibly be "hetero male geek wish fulfillment". I'm pretty sure most male geeks don't see themselves as wearing spikes and a ball gag. And it doesn't matter who likes it as long as it doesn't kill sales.
No women close to Harry has gotten out whole to this point. His first apprentice dead, Susan dead, Luccio mind raped, Molly turned into a Carlos eating monster, Justine is hag ridden and Murphy takes one to the neck. Go team Dresden. The wedding is obviously Mab's plan to end Lara or to cripple her in some fashion. And what happened to Helen Beckitt? Since Marcone has Namshiel, is Beckitt wearing concrete galoshes at the bottom of the lake?
-
Yes he is, and in a big way too. Will be interesting to see how JB writes that.
Yes, but then he turned that on it's head and bound Molly and the Winter Court into aiding the people of Chicago who were hurt or killed.
Don't cry for Molly, don't get me wrong, she is one of my favorite characters. First of all, Molly isn't stupid, she is no victim, she is right where she wants to be, and she is doing a good job.
-
Yes, but then he turned that on it's head and bound Molly and the Winter Court into aiding the people of Chicago who were hurt or killed.
Don't cry for Molly, don't get me wrong, she is one of my favorite characters. First of all, Molly isn't stupid, she is no victim, she is right where she wants to be, and she is doing a good job.
Very practical points if the view is within Dresdenverse. I was talking about from the author's point of view. Molly is an interesting character that has far more potential and simple love interest.
@morriswalters
pretty sure you know I was referring to Harry as the male not Molly
-
Very practical points if the view is within Dresdenverse. I was talking about from the author's point of view. Molly is an interesting character that has far more potential and simple love interest.
@morriswalters
pretty sure you know I was referring to Harry as the male not Molly
And she is being treated as far more than a simple love interest. From the time of her apprenticeship that has been made clear.. Oh Harry notices that she is built like a brick outhouse in a peach orchard, but he doesn't act on it. He loves her as a little sister he never had and respects her talent, her good sense when she chooses to use it and her intelligence. On Molly's part she may have a crush on Harry that won't go away, but you won't catch her throwing herself at him either. She has carved out a pretty nice bit of territory for herself in the series, she is a woman of consequence.
-
And she is being treated as far more than a simple love interest. From the time of her apprenticeship that has been made clear.. Oh Harry notices that she is built like a brick outhouse in a peach orchard, but he doesn't act on it. He loves her as a little sister he never had and respects her talent, her good sense when she chooses to use it and her intelligence. On Molly's part she may have a crush on Harry that won't go away, but you won't catch her throwing herself at him either. She has carved out a pretty nice bit of territory for herself in the series, she is a woman of consequence.
Which is exactly how Harry the narcissist would see it but Mab also points out what his behavior actually was doing.
-
Which is exactly how Harry the narcissist would see it but Mab also points out what his behavior actually was doing.
Perhaps, but Mab also twists things..
-
Mab also points out what his behavior actually was doing.
If you're referring to what Mab says in Cold Days, there's a lot of assumptions about Harry knowing things he didn't know at the time.
-
Mira and Bad Allas
Granted and Granted on both points
-
Yes, but then he turned that on it's head and bound Molly and the Winter Court into aiding the people of Chicago who were hurt or killed.
Don't cry for Molly, don't get me wrong, she is one of my favorite characters. First of all, Molly isn't stupid, she is no victim, she is right where she wants to be, and she is doing a good job.
Which does not matter to my point. Individually, Harry still is in Molly's debt and I know it will be bad for him.
-
Which does not matter to my point. Individually, Harry still is in Molly's debt and I know it will be bad for him.
If it is, it will be done reluctantly on Molly's part I think. But then again Harry did have a choice, wasn't tricked into it, and whatever he end up owing Molly can't take the place of his life. He'd have been very dead at the hands of his grandfather.
-
Oh, of course, it was his idea and he was warned, he still chose to go with it. I meant that his debt is not paid already, all the other negotiations about the injured, the dead, or the people of Chicago were different deals. His deal with Molly for his suit is a more private matter, and we will see what happens. I think Molly herself won't be happy, but she will cash it.
-
Oh, of course, it was his idea and he was warned, he still chose to go with it. I meant that his debt is not paid already, all the other negotiations about the injured, the dead, or the people of Chicago were different deals. His deal with Molly for his suit is a more private matter, and we will see what happens. I think Molly herself won't be happy, but she will cash it.
Something she can save for a rainy day.
-
Yes.
-
Oh, of course, it was his idea and he was warned, he still chose to go with it. I meant that his debt is not paid already, all the other negotiations about the injured, the dead, or the people of Chicago were different deals. His deal with Molly for his suit is a more private matter, and we will see what happens. I think Molly herself won't be happy, but she will cash it.
But she can choose when to cash it and how.
-
I don't think so. I think that when Molly needs Harry help in something that roughly balances her favor to him, she will cash it, want it or not. But we will see.
-
I don't think so. I think that when Molly needs Harry help in something that roughly balances her favor to him, she will cash it, want it or not. But we will see.
There is also the question of just how human she still is. She may already be more like Mab then Molly now and Harry seems to be taking her loyalty for granted, Red Cap's reaction on the rooftop. Could be JB setting the stage for a nasty shock.
-
There is also the question of just how human she still is. She may already be more like Mab then Molly now and Harry seems to be taking her loyalty for granted, Red Cap's reaction on the rooftop. Could be JB setting the stage for a nasty shock.
I don't think he takes it for granted, Harry knows she isn't the Molly he knew, and I think he understands after Battle Ground the process that steals humanity away from the Queens bit by bit.
-
I don't think he takes it for granted, Harry knows she isn't the Molly he knew, and I think he understands after Battle Ground the process that steals humanity away from the Queens bit by bit.
But she is on Harry's side and that counts for something. Her nature might create problems but it also makes her not to lie about that. And finding a way around such problems is what the Sidhe do.
-
All I'm gonna say is that Butter was a more likable character before the magic sword. IMO Jim would be better off dumping the sword and moving on to something that makes Butters awesome because of who he is. Something nerdy. The swords are pretty much the opposite of that.
I don't have a problem with Butters as athletic, but I don't feel like he's found his own niche yet; He's just role playing Harry with a sword.
-
All I'm gonna say is that Butter was a more likable character before the magic sword. IMO Jim would be better off dumping the sword and moving on to something that makes Butters awesome because of who he is. Something nerdy. The swords are pretty much the opposite of that.
I don't have a problem with Butters as athletic, but I don't feel like he's found his own niche yet; He's just role playing Harry with a sword.
Yes, I too would rather have seen Butters remain the nerd who makes the most of Bob's and his intelligence to fight along with the Alphas. Really don't care if he's in a relationship with one, two, or the whole pack just don't like the lightsaber super Jedi bit. From a different thread: Murph would still be alive, would be a KotC, could be gone plenty on assignments, etc but still brought back into the series whenever JB wants.
-
Yes, I too would rather have seen Butters remain the nerd who makes the most of Bob's and his intelligence to fight along with the Alphas. Really don't care if he's in a relationship with one, two, or the whole pack just don't like the lightsaber super Jedi bit. From a different threat: Murph would still be alive, would be a KotC, could be gone plenty on assignments, etc but still brought back into the series whenever JB wants.
Except being a KotC didn't fit her personality, has nothing to do with whether or not she was a good woman, a good warrior, but her beliefs just didn't fit.. Nor did she enjoy the angel taking over as it did in Changes. Once Jim took her off the police force I think he had a hard time finding the proper fit.
-
But she is on Harry's side and that counts for something. Her nature might create problems but it also makes her not to lie about that. And finding a way around such problems is what the Sidhe do.
I agree with that. Also, there is a WoJ about how you are what you eat and how, basically, how fairy food is not food for humans. Priscellie asked him if even about Molly, and what she have been eating and JB told her that Molly is too clever for that (Or something around those lines, I am quoting of memory). I think that is why Molly had not been eating much (in PT she mentions that she had not food in more than a day and Harry speak about how skinny she is, but with faeries that may not meant too much). I think she is trying to eat human food mostly.
About Butters, I think the Sword is precisely "something nerdy". It's a lightsaber, for Luke's sake.
-
Except being a KotC didn't fit her personality, has nothing to do with whether or not she was a good woman, a good warrior, but her beliefs just didn't fit.. Nor did she enjoy the angel taking over as it did in Changes. Once Jim took her off the police force I think he had a hard time finding the proper fit.
Quite frankly, Murphs personality is anything JB wants to write it as. He is far and away talented enough to write that defining moment Murph reconciles with her past. Talented enough to have Murph lunge for the sword too, just be able to knock it closer to Michael's yard where Butters can get it or maybe even JUST far enough to be safe. As a result Nic gets hold of Murph and busts her up. In the next book he could write Murph using rehab exercises, maybe even like Michaels, to recover. Somewhere along the line is the defining moment where she realizes she wants to pick up the sword again. This is all within the author's prevue.
-
Quite frankly, Murphs personality is anything JB wants to write it as. He is far and away talented enough to write that defining moment Murph reconciles with her past. Talented enough to have Murph lunge for the sword too, just be able to knock it closer to Michael's yard where Butters can get it or maybe even JUST far enough to be safe. As a result Nic gets hold of Murph and busts her up. In the next book he could write Murph using rehab exercises, maybe even like Michaels, to recover. Somewhere along the line is the defining moment where she realizes she wants to pick up the sword again. This is all within the author's prevue.
Yes, her personality could be anything that Jim wanted to be. And the one in the books is the personality he wanted for her. And I also think, as much as it hurts to lose her, that as a reader
you wouldn't want it any different either if you think about it. If he had her do as you suggest, the qualities that made her Murphy would change, and you'd still lose her.
-
There is also the question of just how human she still is. She may already be more like Mab then Molly now and Harry seems to be taking her loyalty for granted, Red Cap's reaction on the rooftop. Could be JB setting the stage for a nasty shock.
She's changing but I still have faith in that Cold Case description.
I really enjoyed writing, in the previous tale, from Molly’s viewpoint at one of the lowest points of her life. I wanted to keep following her personal story after the events of Ghost Story, where she faces an uncertain future but is beginning to rebuild who she is and what she wants out of her life. Molly has always had issues with her mother—and now, as the new Winter Lady of the Unseelie Court, she has found herself faced with one of the more terrifying mother figures imaginable in Mab, the Queen of Air and Darkness. I wanted to get a look at that interplay, but I had to write the story to do it.
I also wanted to get a little bit more into the actual role of the Winter Lady in the circles of power that are the Faerie Courts, and why her role is so important, and why it was so distressing that Maeve had been shirking her duties for such a long time.
And finally, I wanted to show more of Molly, who has been through so much and learned such bitter lessons—and to demonstrate why it might just be possible that Mab may have bitten off more than she could chew in the inestimable Miss Carpenter.
-
She's changing but I still have faith in that Cold Case description.
Me too, Molly is proving so far at least that a Winter Queen can be as sane and reasonable as a Summer Queen. Cold Case also shows the key work the Lady actually does. It is no accident that Nemesis targeted the Ladies of both courts.
-
Yes, her personality could be anything that Jim wanted to be. And the one in the books is the personality he wanted for her. And I also think, as much as it hurts to lose her, that as a reader
you wouldn't want it any different either if you think about it. If he had her do as you suggest, the qualities that made her Murphy would change, and you'd still lose her.
Hate to tell you but as a reader who has given this a great deal of thought, I would like the character better a different way. Hence my position that I disagree with JB's choices for Murph and Butters starting from the point I feel JB could have written differently. There are people who think the Mona Lisa should have been painted differently too, the counter point isn't "that's the way he painted her". JB has plans for Murph but probably needs her to be able to withstand more combat damage. My guess is that I will still disagree with his choices there too.
-
@morriswalters
pretty sure you know I was referring to Harry as the male not Molly
What? I was referring to Butter being the object of wish fulfillment. He represents forty year old adolescents wanting to believe that at forty they could have washboard abs and fight monsters. Maybe I misunderstood you.
Molly's been Winter Lady a couple of years. Mab pretty much implied that she would be walking Harry around with a leash if she ascended to Queen, and maybe worse.“Kill Molly Carpenter,” she said calmly. “As quickly as possible.” “Funny,” I said. Mab stared at me. Of course. She hadn’t been joking. On a normal day, I would have been more upset. Today already hurt so much that I hardly noticed. Mab wanted me to kill someone. She usually did. It was sort of my job description. I frowned dully at her. “Why?” “As Winter Lady, she shows promise,” Mab said. “But she is not ready to become Mab. The consequences would be . . . unsettling. For both of you. Perhaps for all of Winter.”
Butcher, Jim. Battle Ground (Dresden Files) (pp. 219-220). Penguin Publishing Group. Kindle Edition.
-
::)
That is an interpretation, we don't know what she actually means.
-
Hate to tell you but as a reader who has given this a great deal of thought, I would like the character better a different way. Hence my position that I disagree with JB's choices for Murph and Butters starting from the point I feel JB could have written differently. There are people who think the Mona Lisa should have been painted differently too, the counter point isn't "that's the way he painted her". JB has plans for Murph but probably needs her to be able to withstand more combat damage. My guess is that I will still disagree with his choices there too.
She got fenced in somewhat from the beginning, athletically gifted in hand to hand combat, crack shot, smart, cop's mentality about justice and the law. That worked great until she left the police force, she still was able to use her skills, but Knight of the Cross didn't exactly fit her, nor head of a vigilante group. Jim I think had already said, no power ups for Murphy, and her fans seem to agree with that. Keep Murphy as she is, a sane vanilla anchor for Harry, and she is a good fighter as well.
Okay, but time marches on, from the start she if five years older than Harry, and while as a wizard, he is still considered quite young, she is in the middle of middle age, the slam bang fights that she was always so go at, seem less and less plausible.. So in Skin Game it all caught up with her, big time. So now lets consummate the dance her and Harry have been doing for years.. So what is left? Having her killed by a cheap shot after her doing an heroic deed.
-
::)
That is an interpretation, we don't know what she actually means.
Yes.
-
Luke's sake.
:)