The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Ebenezars journal
Ed0517:
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on September 25, 2022, 08:03:44 PM ---The island is not a mantle, it’s Harry’s spouse.
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No, it is not a partner. Not his equal, it doesn't think.
The island is his castle, Lake Michigan his moat, Alfred his dragon to overwhelm enemies. On his home ground, he is all but invincible. He knows all the island knows if he thinks about it - no one knows their spouse so well.
Ed0517:
--- Quote from: Regenbogen on September 26, 2022, 08:31:33 PM ---Harry did ice magic before, yes... But iirc before he became Winter Knight his ice was always a product of him performing his old fuego spell. He had water, from which he took the energy to fuel his fire, letting a huge flame go up in the sky, thus turning the water to ice.As Winter Knight he somehow simply creates ice, or so it seems. There is no exothermic energy released in form of fire, no water surface needed.
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Also the ice below the pursuing fetch. I think all wizards can probably do all sorts of magic, but are not GOOD at many forms. Harry did veils before Molly, but wasn't very GOOD at them, though he got better when he analyzed the practice a bit. Now, maybe he funnels ice from elsewhere - the cold of, say, frozen gas giants - the chill of Jupiter. Maybe he can link to Mouse's ice world - Mouse was an ice demon, right? Mouse cheats by living with a wizard - he channels his power source thru Harry.
I think of it in a gaming sense like each school (fire, ice, earth, mind) is different. Harry was level 14 fire, 2 in ice, 1 in the others. Really nasty at one. But say the Knight mantle confers 10 levels in the right school. Fix is now level 10. But Harry WAS a 2, so now he is a 12. So he is nearly as good with ice as he is fire, so he has options.
You and a buddy have to kill 2 men at 50 yards. You have 2 rifles, and 2 compound bows. You've never fired either. You reach for a rifle. Your buddy never fired a gun, but he's a bowhunter. he reaches for his familiar weapon, the bow. It's not AS good, given equal skills, but with his greater bow skill, he thinks he will be better with it. Harry is the bowhunter, fire is the bow. He was good with it, so he uses it when another skill might work better - but it is a skill he does not have.
--- Quote ---And also no soulfire.
--- End quote ---
No, that's mine. I note fire is usually a destructive force, Harry mentions that is why wizards use it. Ice can be made into things - sculptures, igloos, etc. My idea was Harry might be able to imbue an ice structure with Soulfire to reinforce his shield temporarily. Sort of the ice is Kevlar - the Soulfire is the armor in your plate carrier, because Kevlar doesn't stop that .30-06. So some small critical area is reinforced
--- Quote ---Maybe he was always able to do that and just because he is the knight now, makes him believe he must be able to create ice, so he can.
Just like he believes to be able to create fire.
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I don't think he CREATES. I think he CHANNELS. Like Binder, calling forth the Gray Men. He calls ectoplasm from Nevernever, he does not create matter. Fire? The Sun's corona ? or even plasma if you are good enough. Cold? South Pole? Mouse's ice world?
--- Quote ---Carlos for example is said to have an affinity to water magic. Does that mean he can create water? We never see him do more water magic than his disintegrating shield. But this I think removes water, instead of adding.
--- End quote ---
maybe that is what made the frictionless dust in the deeps duel? He yanked water out?
Regenbogen:
@Ed0517
--- Quote ---Maybe he can link to Mouse's ice world - Mouse was an ice demon, right? Mouse cheats by living with a wizard - he channels his power source thru Harry.
--- End quote ---
Is a foo dog an ice demon? I don't understand? Honestly I don't know much about foo dogs, is this somewhere in the books or side stories?
I can follow you explanation of power levels. Yes, this is how one can imagine it.
But I don't think, he calls ectoplasm. In the books it is often described that he reaches inside, fuels his spells with his emotions and sometimes he explicitly takes from his surroundings.
This is just my head canon, but I think it is the magic itself as a kind of substance which a wizard can use and transform with his will. Not something from the nevernever.
Why can't it be ectoplasm? Because ectoplasm evaporates and there is never any goo left after a wizard does magic, except the times in Peace Talks when he sneezes ectoplasm things.
Also Harry often states, that fire is hard to controll, because once it is there, even magical fire, it behaves like any fire does.
Then there us the difference between magical fire and mundane fire. I think the first mention was in Ghost Story, when he remembers his fight with the Walker and uses his first fuego to kaboom the gas station. Good that he didn't directly use it on the Walker, because in Peace Talks (the fight against the cornerhounds) Ebenezer tells him that Outsiders are somehow immune to magical fire, and that he has to use mundane fire to hurt them.
So I think, a wizard's spell is made of magic transformed into what the wizard wants it to be. Be it force, fire, water, ice...
--- Quote --- He yanked water out?
--- End quote ---
Exactly. Removing water imho is what Carlos' shield does. I think it is even somewhere in the text, I might look it up later, or maybe someone has it handy before I do.
Actually used this way, water magic can be applied very powerful. Have you read the Alex Verus books? There is one wizard, Rachel (she is crazy and doing a lot of morally compromised stuff), ewho does exactly that. She can remove water from any target, essentially turning it to dust. I think this is what Carlos can also do. I think this is what he does, when he fights. Harry sometimes describes it as a green ray (hope I can find example, too), but there is never a description what happens to the targets. Probably because usually Harry has no time watching closeely during a fight.
Ice magic as winter knight: I think Harry reaches for the Winter Mantle to do it other than taking heat from water.
Sadly there is not much explanation in the texts as to how exactly magic works.
I think of it as some sort of catalyst, that some people have inside and some don't. Some have much of it, some only a little bit.
The catalyst takes either from inside the wizard and/or from the surroundings to amplify whats already there, depending on the source the wizard prefers for his spell.
Ed0517:
--- Quote from: Regenbogen on September 27, 2022, 06:46:38 AM ---@Ed0517Is a foo dog an ice demon? I don't understand? Honestly I don't know much about foo dogs, is this somewhere in the books or side stories?
--- End quote ---
In Changes the Eebs refer to him as a Mountain Ice Demon. We don't know a lot about what this means.
--- Quote ---
But I don't think, he calls ectoplasm. In the books it is often described that he reaches inside, fuels his spells with his emotions and sometimes he explicitly takes from his surroundings.
This is just my head canon, but I think it is the magic itself as a kind of substance which a wizard can use and transform with his will. Not something from the nevernever.
Why can't it be ectoplasm? Because ectoplasm evaporates and there is never any goo left after a wizard does magic, except the times in Peace Talks when he sneezes ectoplasm things.
--- End quote ---
But when the gray men get killed, the kinda ooze and it all evaporates, like Spider Man's webbing (Jim did a Spider man book - inspiration?)
--- Quote ---Also Harry often states, that fire is hard to controll, because once it is there, even magical fire, it behaves like any fire does.
Then there us the difference between magical fire and mundane fire. I think the first mention was in Ghost Story, when he remembers his fight with the Walker and uses his first fuego to kaboom the gas station. Good that he didn't directly use it on the Walker, because in Peace Talks (the fight against the cornerhounds) Ebenezer tells him that Outsiders are somehow immune to magical fire, and that he has to use mundane fire to hurt them.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, I was thinking Jim kinda went back on what he said before.... that magical fire is not quite the same.
--- Quote ---Exactly. Removing water imho is what Carlos' shield does. I think it is even somewhere in the text, I might look it up later, or maybe someone has it handy before I do.
--- End quote ---
Has to do more. He disintegrates bullets - the lead will not have so much water. You pour molten lead into forms... which puts it above 325* C, IIRC. can't have water there. He may have some sort of abrasives? Diamond dust?
Actually used this way, water magic can be applied very powerful. Have you read the Alex Verus books? There is one wizard, Rachel (she is crazy and doing a lot of morally compromised stuff), ewho does exactly that. She can remove water from any target, essentially turning it to dust. I think this is what Carlos can also do. I think this is what he does, when he fights. Harry sometimes describes it as a green ray (hope I can find example, too), but there is never a description what happens to the targets. Probably because usually Harry has no time watching closely during a fight.
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A little water, taken precisely, should sludge the blood and might cause a coronary or stroke. Loss of volume is a bad thing. (No Verus)
Tinfoil hat:
--- Quote from: Conspiracy Theorist on September 25, 2022, 12:58:16 PM ---There is a WOJ that Odin traded his immortality to be able to continue to operate in the mortal world, and took on the Kringle Mantle to regain immortality.
I wonder actually if Odin’s immortality went into the Kringle Mantle. It’s the kind of sneaky thing he would do. Trade in his immortality as a huge sacrifice to be rewarded with the Mantle. I think KrIngle must have a partial intellectus, he knows whether everyone has been naughty or nice I.e. he has knowledge of a persons good and bad deeds, at least over the last year. That would be consistent with the lore and the use of intellectus in the Files. For someone in the Security Business that would be nice. He doesn’t need to vet people. If so he would have known immediately about Marcone picking up the coin. That would suggest he is keeping close to Marcone for that reason, and is doing the same now with Lara.
Everyone at the level of immortal is generally prohibited from living in the Mortal World the exceptions being the Queens, Ladies and Kringle (the Mothers power levels are so great they can’t without warping it). You can give it up, live in the NeverNever, or suffer Demonreach.
Now the Erl King is an immortal but the Wild Hunt rides in the mortal world. Did he undertake Vassallage to Mab to permit this? It surprised me in Battle Ground that he was Mab’s Vassal, but there would have to be some reason why he would agree to be so bound.
The other free- roaming immortals are the Naagloshii, and they are tied to a particular geographical area. If they break that is it Demonreach? There are at least half a dozen in there.
My thought is that the Ladies Mantles were imbued with just enough power to render their wearers immortal. The Queen’s with just enough to avoid reality breaking down too badly around them, the Mother’s with enough for full intellectus.
The Angels are immortal but are again subject to restrictions.
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The key seems to have been be weaker than Mab to stay in the mortal world. Being immortal is just an added bonus of great power. Sort of if u reach a certain level of magic power. Boom u are immortal. Strength of a river is young to his kin yet 1000s old. I think the more magic you have the less mortal u are. Wizards seem tk grow more powerful in magic as they age and they reach 300s. Irvine was young but as strong as harry. He doesn't get sick etc. May is ur really strong u get immortality has a side effect
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