The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Drakul is the third Walker
Bad Alias:
--- Quote from: g33k on August 21, 2019, 09:08:33 PM ---Not incapable... he just hasn't.
If you can't make a choice, there is no choice!
--- End quote ---
That's my point. A Harry who hasn't made a choice must exist. If a choiceless Harry must exist, he can't make a choice, otherwise, he wouldn't exist as a choiceless Harry. It is only the Harry that chose that had the ability to choose.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Bad Alias on August 22, 2019, 04:21:18 AM ---That's my point. A Harry who hasn't made a choice must exist. If a choiceless Harry must exist, he can't make a choice, otherwise, he wouldn't exist as a choiceless Harry. It is only the Harry that chose that had the ability to choose.
--- End quote ---
"Didn't choose" is different from "couldn't choose."
Unfortunately, "choiceless" does not differentiate.
A Harry who could have chosen, but didn't... who just drifted with whatever the mood of the moment brought? He didn't have his free will taken away; he just never made use of it.
That Harry isn't "choiceless," in that he still has his free will. At any future instant he might be confronted with a meaningful choice... and make such a choice. He isn't "choiceless" in the sense of being unable to make a choice, but in the sense of not having done so in any prior instance.
(are we descended into the uttermost pits of geek depravity here? Or is there a Lower Hell yet to delve? And will we 'Choose' to do so?)
morriswalters:
--- Quote from: Bad Alias ---The premise of Mirror Mirror is that Harry made a different choice/didn't make a choice in Grave Peril and every time a Choice is made, the universe splits. One universe in which the Choice is made, and one in which it wasn't. Therefore there must be a universe in which Harry hasn't made a single choice. Because that universe must exist, there has to be a Harry incapable of making choices.
--- End quote ---
There can't be a point where no choice is made since not making a decision is, in itself, a choice. Mirror Mirror wold seem to be about contrasting the difference between two different possible paths.
isoycrazy:
I like the concept of Drakul being an outsider trapped and unable to die. Perhaps Vlad II was a real man who sacrificed his own life and existence to save his people from this evil and became a human prison for it? Or was some evil person who sought power but didn't understand the price. Like how Fallen is trapped in a coin and, when it has a host, a human-shaped can. They can do more things but are still limited by a human's reach.
As for SoS and Dracula being born, two possibilities. If Drakul is the human-shaped can the outsider is in, then some of that plumbing still works and there could be enough of his soul left to care for someone to produce a child. And like that, maybe Lucifer will posses a human to conceive a child that way. He will use the love of these two mortals to force the creation of his offspring. After all, Nicodemus shows his plumbing still works in having made a daughter after he was possessed, and several centuries after he found the coin.
And while love is nice in the creation of a new soul, I don't think it is needed in all cases, otherwise you set a bad precedent for when rape causes pregnancy. I don't think you want to say there is love in that moment when the victim is against this from happening, nor that any kid born from rape is "soulless" as the parents' souls didn't merge into a third.
It is just that an act of love is a type of creation but not all types of creation are acts of love.
Bad Alias:
--- Quote from: g33k on August 22, 2019, 07:36:09 AM ---(are we descended into the uttermost pits of geek depravity here? Or is there a Lower Hell yet to delve? And will we 'Choose' to do so?)
--- End quote ---
To the very depths we shall go. But the thing is, when Harry makes a Choice, this rule causes there to be a Harry that doesn't make a Choice. It takes his Choice away. It just occurred to me that perhaps the universe splits because in exercising free will, Harry opens up multiple/all possible realities in which a Choice can be made. Let's keep the Choice binary for simplicity's sake (three options). Let's say it's at the point where Ortega offers Harry a way out. Option 1: Harry doesn't exercise free will and this results in his death because he "gives up." Option 2/Choice 1: Harry does what he did in the book. Option 3/Choice 2: Harry takes the deal. So, when Harry chooses to exercise free will, then Choices 1 and 2 both come into being and Option 1 doesn't exist.
Otherwise Option 1 Harry must exist. If he must exist, the can't Choose and every use of free will is also not a use of free will.
--- Quote from: morriswalters on August 22, 2019, 11:23:40 AM --- There can't be a point where no choice is made since not making a decision is, in itself, a choice. Mirror Mirror wold seem to be about contrasting the difference between two different possible paths.
--- End quote ---
I'm using "choice" as short hand for the exercise of free will, which is a rarity. Think of it as if Dresden lives in a largely deterministic universe where in rare instances people exercise free will in a non-deterministic fashion. Most actions or inactions would normally be entirely predictable given enough information. However on rare occasions, the prediction would be wrong because someone Choose.
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