The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

(false)peace and the second coming

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Rasins:
"...by the wild beasts of the earth."

What about the Erlking?

jonas:
@ Kindler... well.. the thing is is those horsemen are aspected those things by proxy. I think the original aspects break down into Fear/rage Despair/hate(there seems to be some bleed over between the two reactionary responses) Lust(which ties into Greed and maybe envy too), and basically death/non existence. I think I have the 5 primary forces that keep repeating in the DF pegged down to the reincarnation of the 4 horsemen and the Chooser of fate.
and what's more is I think you can see other incarnations and where they took those mentioned directly, war, pestilence, ect. I think all 5 exist on Archangel level but were intentionally broken down into the courts and other things so as to not be a direct mirror(like they broke down the two Mothers into whole courts under them). Ever notice the 4 Queens are all riding one of the same colors as is rode by a horsemen of the Apocalypse in SK? Harry is seen by Denton with Hwwbh as a form of Hell behind him just like he might be the earthly carnation of Death?(which I've been looking into recently under the guise that Death is what births 'the end', so time to reexamine those Daughters... :o and the idea it would have ended practitioners with a death so close to Merlin's bloodline)Uriel, decider of fate uses the 3 swords under him to achieve his goal just as death uses all three?
Red King as war makes sense kinda, but I think the Whites are connected to Lust... which translates as Famine, see Dresden's monologue on Club Zero and the end state of WCV's running things. The Horsemen are deep into the DF, Nic and co basically represent their original purpose in Greek mythos now, to spread the apocalypse out similar to the Necronomicon, the Fallen themselves mirror the holders, taking the mirroring availability away from the originals. The Archangel bit because, withing the courts there are 4 supernatural entities still holding a certain freedom of will/mortal power. EK, Kringle, and the 2 Knights. those are the bits of the graces that hold the choice of balance. Breaking it down provides more and more insulation.
When looking remember there are versions who rose and those who fell,(and those torn apart intentionally) most of those get got though.

*iirc the original translation was Hel, as in the goddess/place and before that plain Hades as the patron/place.

Quantus:

--- Quote from: jonas on January 16, 2018, 09:22:53 PM ---Which one? We have Marcone whose going to apply to the criminal/empirical aspect, Harry who takes on the inhuman Mother and inversion of Christ. Nic..., Nic might be key in actually having a 'rise' or replacement which with the repeating inverse and precisely how things appear to have turned out directly last time(which you can figure out which reign came directly before by remembering the father of the author of Dante's inferno was the previous gatekeeper... Which also tends to prove that as each generation overcomes the veil the previous 'threat' is brought inside and given balance)

Your complicating things too much I think, it should be easy to power point the aspects of the Antichrist and where manifest. He's to do war with the actual forces of 'heaven', in DF terms this is Harry fighting against a process enforced and enacted by the cosmic order of events, the hierchy itself.

lets see.... Will possess supernatural power, will be an atheist, will have jewish ancestory(I am highly suspect of Dresden on that), proud and arrogant,  deal in secrecy whenever possible, skilled in ambiguous speech, brilliant intellectual, deceive many people with words of peace, will be politically powerful, empowered by Satan, he will rule over the supernatural realm of the entire world, he will rule Babylon only in the second half of the 7 years, he will blaspheme God, He will worship satan and call himself a god requiring worship, He will kill the last Christian ushering in an end of the age.

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I wouldnt say complicating things, just trying to tease out your underlying assumptions.  So, if Im up to speed with your theory, your seeing his/her roles as:

War Against the Universal Order, but also War Against TWG, specifically.

Meanwhile you see their expected Traits as:

- Magically Powerful
- Politically Powerful, Mundane
- Politically Powerful, Supernatural
- Atheist
- Jewish (genetic)
- Proud (as in the Sin)
- Prone to Clandestine methods
- Deceitfully Charming
- Vocally Anti- TWG
- Personally Pro-Satan/Pro-hell
- Empowered by the Forces of Judeo-christian Hell (Specifically)
- Associated with Rulership of Babylon (Literally or Symbolically?)


That about sum up your Antichrist vision?

jonas:

--- Quote from: Quantus on January 19, 2018, 04:27:19 PM ---I wouldnt say complicating things, just trying to tease out your underlying assumptions.  So, if Im up to speed with your theory, your seeing his/her roles as:

War Against the Universal Order, but also War Against TWG, specifically./
--- Quote ---well yes and no, I don't think TWG himself is going to twig to be a secret bad guy or something, but the order of events that lead to the coming Apocalypti is something set into motion by the way the universe is ordered itself... Say Mab and Titania are gone(with those falling stars and Mab's word) so the Mothers themselves are enforced into try to entreat a new balance? MS especially as the 'creator' and her shelf full of death jars makes me think of her as the holder of God's 7 bowls of wrath for instance.


--- Quote ---Meanwhile you see their expected Traits as:

- Magically Powerful
- Politically Powerful, Mundane
- Politically Powerful, Supernatural
- Atheist
- Jewish (genetic)
- Proud (as in the Sin)
- Prone to Clandestine methods
- Deceitfully Charming
- Vocally Anti- TWG
- Personally Pro-Satan/Pro-hell
- Empowered by the Forces of Judeo-christian Hell (Specifically)
- Associated with Rulership of Babylon (Literally or Symbolically?)


That about sum up your Antichrist vision?

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The pieces I see in play, yea. Obviously theres some overlapping.
Wanna get real technical about it. I think Harry is THE Anti-Christ, Marcone is the one who is going to represent his dark rise and Nic is going to be the Spiritual identity we think of in it's association.
It's a theory woven through Yeat's second coming and the Gyre. I think the repeating Archatypes of Harry and Marcone equate to previously being Harry/Lucifer and Marcone Being TWC(not in a TT way, in a starborn generational way) every time history repeats itself it inverts from last time(with... apparently people/immortals from previous era's being able to fall or rise based upon being alive during said inverse actions of fate.
i'd have to organize my thoughts a bit on this one,(the inverse is hard to explain but there are examples) But basically TWC saved us by being good, Harry's going to save us by becoming Our Monster. The actual evil of TAC(the anti Christ)is going to be spread around in a balance... which I think Harry will be The Deity all other deities balance out, He'll literally be one whole side of a pantheon that everyone else balances this aspect or that one. Everythings going to change in the cosmic order.
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