Author Topic: EB McCoy after the BAT  (Read 17005 times)

Offline wardenferry419

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 5265
  • Can I get a Hells Bells !!!!
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #30 on: December 07, 2017, 11:21:35 PM »
Not my original intention but I am curious enough to want to see it.
Make Mine Butcher!
Who do I have to turn to ice to get a whiskey on the rocks?

Offline Snark Knight

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 3931
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #31 on: December 08, 2017, 01:55:33 AM »
He did not foresee that but neither did Ebenezar.

Yeah, once Ebenezar had seen the evidence on Peabody, responsibility for how to play it kind of is on the SC member rather than Harry.

Politically, they couldn't really have the Merlin just go "hey, trial on Morgan is cancelled" anyway. The spectators from LaFortier's bloc had to be convinced that Peabody was responsible because of how much suspicion was going around that Langtry would subvert the process to rescue his favourite attack dog. It wasn't just Harry that failed to anticipate the "bureaucromancer" posing a physical threat - Ebenezar and Carlos also missed that.

Offline forumghost

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 2729
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2017, 02:03:48 AM »
And given that Peabody unleashing a Mordite-enhanced Mistfiend and mindwhammying the Wardens wound up not being sufficient to exonerate Morgan in the end, the LaFortier block must be really strict about what constitutes sufficient evidence (when it's politically expedient to fo so).

Offline the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh

  • O. M. G.
  • ***
  • Posts: 39098
  • Riding eternal, shiny and Firefox
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #33 on: December 08, 2017, 04:10:19 AM »
And given that Peabody unleashing a Mordite-enhanced Mistfiend and mindwhammying the Wardens wound up not being sufficient to exonerate Morgan in the end, the LaFortier block must be really strict about what constitutes sufficient evidence (when it's politically expedient to fo so).

Some of us are still not entirely convinced Morgan was innocent, fwiw.
Mildly OCD. Please do not troll.

"What do you mean, Lawful Silly isn't a valid alignment?"

kittensgame, Sandcastle Builder, Homestuck, Welcome to Night Vale, Civ III, lots of print genre SF, and old-school SATT gaming if I had the time.  Also Pandemic Legacy is the best game ever.

Offline wardenferry419

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 5265
  • Can I get a Hells Bells !!!!
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #34 on: December 08, 2017, 08:23:28 AM »
I think Harry nailed Morgan pretty well. A jaded cop who wrapped himself in the rules of his duty.
Make Mine Butcher!
Who do I have to turn to ice to get a whiskey on the rocks?

Offline Rasins

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 12188
  • Aid the younger and weaker.
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2017, 04:18:02 AM »
Some of us are still not entirely convinced Morgan was innocent, fwiw.

He was innocent of killing Lafortier.  Luccio did it.
At times I wish I had a clone, but then I realize, I could never live with that a-hole.

DV Rasins 2006 BK+++ RP++ JB++++ TH++++ WG+(+?) CL SW++ BC- MC---

Offline Kindler

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1139
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2017, 07:40:16 PM »
Yeah, once Ebenezar had seen the evidence on Peabody, responsibility for how to play it kind of is on the SC member rather than Harry.

Politically, they couldn't really have the Merlin just go "hey, trial on Morgan is cancelled" anyway. The spectators from LaFortier's bloc had to be convinced that Peabody was responsible because of how much suspicion was going around that Langtry would subvert the process to rescue his favourite attack dog. It wasn't just Harry that failed to anticipate the "bureaucromancer" posing a physical threat - Ebenezar and Carlos also missed that.

Right, and Ebenezer should have walked up to the Merlin, said "Hey, we need to incapacitate Peabody with thorn manacles before the trial—trust me, man, this is going to be awesome." I mean, the guy might seem like a little nobody—the Butters of the White Council (pre-Ghost Story, before he leveled up)—but he's still a wizard of the White Council. There's some level of competence and power required. Why wouldn't they have anticipated him running? It was in their best interest to restrain him, but they failed to do so completely. And, you know, fifty wizards died while Harry played Poirot.

Actually, Harry's summation speech let Peabody prepare; he realized where this was going, and pulled out another inkwell during Harry's testimony, which was the one with the mistfiend in it. Or... some kind of mist that summoned a fiend somehow. Did he bottle a mistfiend, actually? Because that's pretty cool. Anyway, Harry should've made sure the Merlin was ready; there was absolutely no reason not to tell the whole Senior Council, so they could have all been prepared adequately. Privately, the blame lies mostly on Ebenezer's shoulders—he was supposed to be ready to shut him down, and wasn't—but publicly, it was Harry's grandstanding that got them all killed. Which they then used to force their guy onto the Senior Council.

Offline Rasins

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 12188
  • Aid the younger and weaker.
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2017, 12:31:42 AM »
I agree that it never set well with me that they weren't prepared for Peabody to run, but ...

We know that Eb is the junior member of the Senior council, and he's at odds with the Merlin.  I can totally see Langtry ignoring Eb's warnings (if there were any) not believing them.  After all, Peabody had been on the staff for a LONG time.
At times I wish I had a clone, but then I realize, I could never live with that a-hole.

DV Rasins 2006 BK+++ RP++ JB++++ TH++++ WG+(+?) CL SW++ BC- MC---

Offline wardenferry419

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 5265
  • Can I get a Hells Bells !!!!
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2017, 09:02:46 AM »
Basically, they under-estimated what a perceived paper-pusher would do even though he was also a wizard. I was a military clerk, so I know the mentality, even if I was a soldier as well.
Make Mine Butcher!
Who do I have to turn to ice to get a whiskey on the rocks?

Offline Kindler

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1139
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2017, 04:11:23 PM »
I agree that it never set well with me that they weren't prepared for Peabody to run, but ...

We know that Eb is the junior member of the Senior council, and he's at odds with the Merlin.  I can totally see Langtry ignoring Eb's warnings (if there were any) not believing them.  After all, Peabody had been on the staff for a LONG time.

My reading of the events showed that the Merlin didn't know about Peabody at all; Harry describes Langtry as reacting with sudden hope when Harry stands up to give evidence. Something like, "The Merlin looked like he realized the game wasn't over yet." To me, that shows that Eb didn't even try to tell him, which is weird.

It's not quite Prometheus levels of "Why are you doing any of the things you're doing, this is dumb, run perpendicular to the falling thing, not parallel," but it's something I haven't found a reasonable explanation for beyond lack of foresight (rare for Ebenezer) or complicity (which I can't believe of Ebenezer, though many find him shady and I understand why).

Basically, they under-estimated what a perceived paper-pusher would do even though he was also a wizard. I was a military clerk, so I know the mentality, even if I was a soldier as well.

But that goes against everything we've seen from the White Council. They really, really, really like to plan ahead. It's just not something I can reconcile with the characters involved.

Offline Arjan

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 13235
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2017, 04:51:05 PM »
Ebenezar and the merlin had a long antagonistic relationship probably made worse by Peabody. Ebenezar wanted to judge everyone's reaction.

I don't think anyone would have expected such a dangerous outsider from him. With the complete senior council there he should not have been a problem.

Say they had confronted him in a hallway and asked him to surrender. He probably wlould have escaped after his mistfiend had killed the wardens. Only a surprise attack with immediate paralysation or something like that would have worked.

Ebenezar would have to do a lot of talking to something he thought was not needed anyway.
WG+++: The White God is Mister.
SH[Elaine+++]

Offline Kindler

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1139
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2017, 05:16:18 PM »
Ebenezar and the merlin had a long antagonistic relationship probably made worse by Peabody. Ebenezar wanted to judge everyone's reaction.

That I might be able to buy. He and Harry did briefly discuss the Merlin as Black Council.

The rest of it is too situationally ambiguous. He wouldn't have needed to do much fast talking, just go up to the Merlin, say what's going on, then sucker punch Peabody. The guy thought he was about to win a significant victory; his guard was at its lowest, and it wouldn't have been difficult to arrange.

Offline Rasins

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 12188
  • Aid the younger and weaker.
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #42 on: December 13, 2017, 06:41:18 PM »
I'm trying to remember back to my last reading.

Was there time between Harry revealing to Eb, and the trial, for Eb to sucker punch Peabody?
At times I wish I had a clone, but then I realize, I could never live with that a-hole.

DV Rasins 2006 BK+++ RP++ JB++++ TH++++ WG+(+?) CL SW++ BC- MC---

Offline Arjan

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 13235
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #43 on: December 13, 2017, 06:47:53 PM »
I'm trying to remember back to my last reading.

Was there time between Harry revealing to Eb, and the trial, for Eb to sucker punch Peabody?
Enough to search Peabodies quarters for evidence.
WG+++: The White God is Mister.
SH[Elaine+++]

Offline Rasins

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 12188
  • Aid the younger and weaker.
    • View Profile
Re: EB McCoy after the BAT
« Reply #44 on: December 13, 2017, 07:17:44 PM »
Enough to search Peabodies quarters for evidence.

Ah, so Yeah.  Or they could have done it as soon as he sat down at the Trial.
At times I wish I had a clone, but then I realize, I could never live with that a-hole.

DV Rasins 2006 BK+++ RP++ JB++++ TH++++ WG+(+?) CL SW++ BC- MC---