The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
WAG: Id Harry's Bargain with Mab.
Froklsnt:
--- Quote from: raidem on October 05, 2017, 01:13:46 AM ---Namschiels coin was confirmed on the helicopter gryffn. Or at least somebody's was.
--- End quote ---
Just re-listened to the pertinent sections. The hand goes into Michael's pouch, and hasn't been seen since. The next time they looked for it was at the hospital, at which time it was missing. The purposed theory in the book in that someone took it in the helicopter, as they got Michael out of his gear. But no one is stated to have seen it at that time. That would put the suspect list as Sanya, Marcone, Hendricks, Gard, and Luccio (Ivy was unconscious). However, there is a period of relative calm in the remnants of the lighthouse, before the helicopter arrives, and Harry is there. Harry swiping it is at least possible. Michael still had his pouch at the hospital (Sanya says so), so it would have needed to be one very smooth pickpocket job, but it's possible. Maybe while Michael was putting the harness on.
The snowflake pin being a Winter boon fits so well that it's headcanon for me now, which means the theory in the OP needs some reworking. The coin fits very nicely too. However, that part doesn't explain near as many odd loose ends as the rest of the theory did. So I might modify the idea to include two meetings. The first meeting happened as stated above, at the beginning of the book, but the pin is no longer part of the deal. Instead, Mab visits with Id Harry at the end of the book, tells her of his extra gift, unplanned, and is given the boon.
One detail of Griffyn's thinking I disagree with though. I don't think that Id Harry would have any desire to one day be rid of the mantle of Winter Knight. For one thing, he doesn't plan that far ahead. But moreover, why would he want to stop being Winter Knight? How is that not a near-total good thing from his perspective? It gives him more say in Harry's actions, gives him more power and better ability to protect his children. Resentment of Mab may come eventually, but as I said, it isn't in the Id's nature to think that far down the road.
Froklsnt:
I found one other potential issue with the theory in the OP, though it might be alright. Mab's words about what she did with Harry's fire magic:
--- Quote from: Small Favor - Chapter 46 ---"The I was right." I said, accepting [the blasting rod] "You took it, and you took the memory of it happening."
"Yes"
"Why?"
"Because I deemed it proper." She replied, as if speaking to a rather slow-witted child. "You would have risked your own life, and my purpose, to protect your precious mortals had I not taken your fire from you."
--- End quote ---
The OP theory asserts that the actual hiding of the memories was performed by Id Harry, acting on Mab's behalf. Are her above statements still true enough if that is the case? I'd say yes, but it isn't cut and dry.
Griffyn612:
--- Quote from: forumghost on October 05, 2017, 12:44:04 PM ---Yeah, I feel that people treat him as more of a separate entity then he actually is- eg "ID Harry picked up Lasciel's coin"
No, Harry picked up Lasciel's coin, because he was driven to do so by his baser desires/darker instincts, which ID Harry represents.
There's not literally another guy in Harry's head bodyjacking him- At least I hope not. Because that would be dumb.
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I look at it this way. Imagine that the human psyche is an operation system. The supposed S-Ego, Ego, and Id are all part of the same OS, with no real separation. The person doesn't work without the whole package, and no part of the package can run things on its own.
But in the case of dark magic contagion, there is a separation. The corruption partitions off the Id, making a kernel OS of it. It's still part of the whole, but there's a division. Then, the corruption works at deteriorating the moral portion of the psyche, leaving only the Id behind. In that state, a good family man would lose his emotional ties to family. In that state, a moral and honorable cop would lose his sense of right and wrong.
Only, in Harry's case, he somehow avoided the moral deterioration. He was left with the partition in place, to the point that the Id can run things on its own at times, if only in the background.
Griffyn612:
--- Quote from: Froklsnt on October 05, 2017, 02:02:53 PM ---One detail of Griffyn's thinking I disagree with though. I don't think that Id Harry would have any desire to one day be rid of the mantle of Winter Knight. For one thing, he doesn't plan that far ahead. But moreover, why would he want to stop being Winter Knight? How is that not a near-total good thing from his perspective? It gives him more say in Harry's actions, gives him more power and better ability to protect his children. Resentment of Mab may come eventually, but as I said, it isn't in the Id's nature to think that far down the road.
--- End quote ---
Remember that Id was open to the idea of using Lash, but not open to the idea of being controlled or manipulated by her. He wanted the power, but didn't want the shackles.
He wouldn't want Mab's shackles any more than he wanted Lash's. In his reasoning, the boon from Mab could get him out of being WK, should he feel like that must happen. If Harry became the WK, and somewhere along the way realized deep down (all the way to Id) that he could not do that anymore, he'd have an out.
Or it could be held back for something else. A debt from the likes of Mab is valuable, even if you don't know exactly what you'd claim when you accept it. Nico had no idea that what he'd ask of Mab when he gained a favor from her; he just knew it was valuable.
Griffyn612:
--- Quote from: Froklsnt on October 05, 2017, 02:11:34 PM ---I found one other potential issue with the theory in the OP, though it might be alright. Mab's words about what she did with Harry's fire magic:
The OP theory asserts that the actual hiding of the memories was performed by Id Harry, acting on Mab's behalf. Are her above statements still true enough if that is the case? I'd say yes, but it isn't cut and dry.
--- End quote ---
Two things.
First, I think it was Mab that manipulated Harry's memories. She's got the ability to run roughshod over him.
Second, I think even if Id had been the one to actually conceal the memories, Mab could still say that she took them from Harry, as long as Id was acting in her name. It's like how Harry was responsible for Aurora's death, even though she was killed by dew drop faeries.
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