The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Nemesis is different
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Rasins on July 12, 2017, 08:34:00 PM ---Ah ...
Where I'm coming from is this ...
Odin does not exist. I'll grant you that people believe he exists, but he doesn't. If for no other purposes than this discussion let's agree that Odin does not exist.
But LOTS of people BELIEVE he does. Because of this, somewhere out in the never-never Odin DOES exist. That being the case, then Odin does have the powers assigned to him.
Now, Belief in Odin started a LONG time ago. To get the kind of metaphysical oomph needed to BE Odin, it would take a LOT of belief.
What I'm saying is that Jim's stories could be like those early tales of the All-Father. Over time, his stories will pass into myth and legend, but the Belief that his stories bring could create something "out there", and because of the belief, it WILL have the power to defeat the Outsiders.
To give another example, there is an anime of Naratu (?), or was it Goku?
Anyway, supposedly this being can "unmake" anything. Anything at all.
Now if there was enough belief in this being, it would become in the never-never and eventually actually have the power to unmake ANYTHING, including outsiders.
ls that any better?
--- End quote ---
Much! Sorry for me being dense.
OK, to the meat: I see your thinking and it's sound, but I see the underlying mechanism as being different. I dont think the Belief and/or characterization is going to create a whole new entity. Rather I think it would create a sympathetic connection that would allow some existing entity to tap into it. Maybe just from the depth of the the NN, likely from the Other Side of Oblivion (and I dont know if those two are mutually exclusive).
That being said, according to Harry in Day One (the new Butters Short) BOTH of our described mechanisms are possibilities. Given that I just expect that you'd waste/use up a lot more Power creating one from scratch than if you found something pre-existing and willing to undergo the Make-over.
And separately, I dont actually think that there Exist enough Power in any one Universe to actually Destroy the Outsiders as a whole (which by my current theorycraft actually transcend the Multiverse). At best they might be able to Seal off that particular Universe from further Outsider hostilities, but I then have to ask "If it were Possible, why didnt the last group do That instead of making a pair of Fae Courts?"
Rasins:
--- Quote from: Quantus on July 12, 2017, 08:52:07 PM ---Much! Sorry for me being dense.
OK, to the meat: I see your thinking and it's sound, but I see the underlying mechanism as being different. I dont think the Belief and/or characterization is going to create a whole new entity. Rather I think it would create a sympathetic connection that would allow some existing entity to tap into it. Maybe just from the depth of the the NN, likely from the Other Side of Oblivion (and I dont know if those two are mutually exclusive).
That being said, according to Harry in Day One (the new Butters Short) BOTH of our described mechanisms are possibilities. Given that I just expect that you'd waste/use up a lot more Power creating one from scratch than if you found something pre-existing and willing to undergo the Make-over.
And separately, I dont actually think that there Exist enough Power in any one Universe to actually Destroy the Outsiders as a whole (which by my current theorycraft actually transcend the Multiverse). At best they might be able to Seal off that particular Universe from further Outsider hostilities, but I then have to ask "If it were Possible, why didnt the last group do That instead of making a pair of Fae Courts?"
--- End quote ---
Ignorance to the possibility.
Intellictus has it's limits as demonstrated by Demonreach. If Demonreach can be limited by it's geographic location, why not have someone like Uriel be limited by his reality? By Reality as it is separate from the outside.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Rasins on July 13, 2017, 03:06:32 PM ---Ignorance to the possibility.
Intellictus has it's limits as demonstrated by Demonreach. If Demonreach can be limited by it's geographic location, why not have someone like Uriel be limited by his reality? By Reality as it is separate from the outside.
--- End quote ---
Im not talking about the limits of Intellectus, Im saying that if it were possible to Seal of the Outside entirely, wouldnt that be the logical starting point before you are forced to design an absurdly complex and surprisingly fragile system to facilitate a NeverEnding War? That's just logic, and barely complex enough to even be called that.
Rasins:
--- Quote from: Quantus on July 13, 2017, 07:17:56 PM ---Im not talking about the limits of Intellectus, Im saying that if it were possible to Seal of the Outside entirely, wouldnt that be the logical starting point before you are forced to design an absurdly complex and surprisingly fragile system to facilitate a NeverEnding War? That's just logic, and barely complex enough to even be called that.
--- End quote ---
Not if the Outer Gates existed from the very beginning. It's entirely possible that those who defend the gates simply don't believe that they can be permanently sealed. Or maybe they don't want to. Having a purpose is a good thing.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Rasins on July 13, 2017, 07:22:34 PM ---Not if the Outer Gates existed from the very beginning. It's entirely possible that those who defend the gates simply don't believe that they can be permanently sealed. Or maybe they don't want to. Having a purpose is a good thing.
--- End quote ---
If The Gates existed from the Very beginning, Id agree with them I think. At that point we're talking about something that is part of the very fundamental design of Reality Itself, and sealing it might be like plugging a Safety Relief Valve.
Considering they'd be doing the designing after accepting that their role in things was ending, I doubt they'd be trying to Hang on to a purpose to the detriment of the Universe.
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