The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
He Couldn't Lose [SG Spoilers]
namkcas:
Kumori resurrected a Human and broke one of the 7 laws. It was black magic.
Which mantles were created by Black Magic Ascension? For all we know the Faerie Queen Mantles were created originally by TWG. We actually have no information about their origin. All we have is an explanation that a Darkhallow, done correctly, would create something with powers of a "God" (does that mean Mab like, Molly like, MW like, Hades like - we have no idea). If that being was subsequently killed on Halloween, we have no idea if that became a "mantle" and passed on.
megarows:
--- Quote from: namkcas on July 01, 2015, 11:13:28 PM ---Kumori resurrected a Human and broke one of the 7 laws. It was black magic.
Which mantles were created by Black Magic Ascension? For all we know the Faerie Queen Mantles were created originally by TWG. We actually have no information about their origin. All we have is an explanation that a Darkhallow, done correctly, would create something with powers of a "God" (does that mean Mab like, Molly like, MW like, Hades like - we have no idea). If that being was subsequently killed on Halloween, we have no idea if that became a "mantle" and passed on.
--- End quote ---
1. Perhaps she did, but the guy wasn't tainted by it as far as we know.
2. Hecate's mantle was created by an ascension ritual. ("Into the Jungle")
3. Butcher gives more info about the origin of the fae queens (and Erlking) here: http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,11033.msg494103.html#msg494103
4. The fae queens' -- humans with mantles' -- "original base of power" came from Hecate. Not TWG. Hecate got shanked on the stone table. Hence why the statue of Hecate in the Underworld shows the fae queens.
5. If the original base of power of the fae queens (humans) was from a human (Hecate), and human sacrifice (ascension ritual), then I don't really see how they could have insinuated themselves into atmospheric weather systems before humanity existed. And please, no time travel theories, or TWG will kill a kitten.
namkcas:
--- Quote ---Into the Jungle
--- End quote ---
I have no idea of what that is or why it applied to this topic. I see there is some graphic novel that is called Welcome to the Jungle. I have not read it, so the only info I have is that Harry stopped an ascension rite. Hectate existed pre-Harry so clearly the person in that ritual is not Hectate...even if they claim to be. So, you will have to show something more than that.
--- Quote ---Hecate got shanked on the stone table. Hence why the statue of Hecate in the Underworld shows the fae queens.
--- End quote ---
Again, I have no idea where you have that from. The statue is a statue.
--- Quote ---5. If the original base of power of the fae queens (humans) was from a human (Hecate), and human sacrifice (ascension ritual), then I don't really see how they could have insinuated themselves into atmospheric weather systems before humanity existed. And please, no time travel theories, or TWG will kill a kitten.
--- End quote ---
You are making all kinds of assumptions and additions to the actual words that are written. I don't. For all I know, MW was ALREADY MW and got more powerful (not became immortal) by killing people or other gods. The Erlking is clearly stated as having gone through an ascension ritual. Do we know if ALL rituals are dark? Is it possible - POSSIBLE - that some are not?
megarows:
If you're interested in the lore here, I think reading Into the Jungle would be relevant to your interests. It's why Hecate is significant, and why the statue in SG isn't "just a statue". I don't particularly even like comics, but that's where the lore written by JB for this is, and so you miss that if you skip the comics. Read it, re-read the relevant WoJs having done so, think about the statue in SG, and decide for yourself.
Re: rituals, all the text and WoJ canon thus far is that they are dark. Every single time. I suppose you could consider Harry shanking Lloyd Slate to be a good deed in some ways?
Eldest Gruff:
When it comes to Hecate we've already got three 'conflicting' notions. First Welcome to the Jungle has her ascending this way from a human, or thereabouts iirc. Then Bob offhandedly mentions in DM or BR about big dormant Gods who are still around and brings up Hecate. Now we have SG which has of course given rise to the idea that she is an aspect of power surrounding the six Queens of Faerie, possibly sacrificed on the Table. So...its all conjecture now anyway. Some seem more likely than others.
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