The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Team UMO: a theory, for reference purposes
Quantus:
--- Quote from: the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh on March 17, 2014, 03:25:48 PM ---Not really; Uriel pushing Harry into Mab's arms in Changes is still there, as is the benefit to Uriel and Mab both of the end of GS.
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What then would support the idea that she is an active participant getting getting a quid pro quo in terms of unrelated Intell, rather than just another catspaw scenario?
the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh:
--- Quote from: Quantus on March 17, 2014, 04:53:00 PM ---What then would support the idea that she is an active participant getting getting a quid pro quo in terms of unrelated Intell, rather than just another catspaw scenario?
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Uriel phrasing his reassurance to Harry in ways which, while literally true, led to a change in Harry's position (viz, Harry believing he can balk Mab's orders if he needs to) which is immediately beneficial to Mab (in that without it, it's been demonstrated, Harry finds living as a monster untenable and arranges own death).
As for catspaws... Mab has no free will. Uriel has no free will relevant to tactical details here - the scale at which he has free will is "choose to crash and burn and become a second Morningstar or not". So it seems quite plausible to me that either of them are exactly predictable to the other given a defined initial circumstance; I would not count that as catspaws, exactly, myself, but I can see how it might look like that.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh on March 17, 2014, 06:20:00 PM ---Uriel phrasing his reassurance to Harry in ways which, while literally true, led to a change in Harry's position (viz, Harry believing he can balk Mab's orders if he needs to) which is immediately beneficial to Mab (in that without it, it's been demonstrated, Harry finds living as a monster untenable and arranges own death).
As for catspaws... Mab has no free will. Uriel has no free will relevant to tactical details here - the scale at which he has free will is "choose to crash and burn and become a second Morningstar or not". So it seems quite plausible to me that either of them are exactly predictable to the other given a defined initial circumstance; I would not count that as catspaws, exactly, myself, but I can see how it might look like that.
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I would challenge this part, specifically (the bolded text). For one thing the "did she lie" WOJ clearly (to me) sets Uriel on a higher (Cosmic) tier, one which she apparently does not grasp very well. I think that the Mothers might on that tier and be aware enough for that sort of insight, but not the queens.
Kscodemonkey:
--- Quote from: peregrine on March 17, 2014, 03:31:57 PM ---But even so, what she did doesn't require any sort of trap door. Like Harry said, she can just overlap her curse without needing to penetrate his protection. Stop the energy from ever getting to him, rather than stop him from absorbing it, or whatever.
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My WAG is that she didn't do anything to Lord Raith. I think this is a hint to us that the hunger demon isn't just a metaphor, it is an actual entity. Maybe not a physical one, but a spiritual one, and that Maggie targeted her curse at the entity and not at Lord Raith. That is how come she was able to stop him from feeding when he can't be targeted. She knew she couldn't do anything to him, but correctly guessed that she could cripple the demon.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Kscodemonkey on March 20, 2014, 04:13:08 PM ---My WAG is that she didn't do anything to Lord Raith. I think this is a hint to us that the hunger demon isn't just a metaphor, it is an actual entity. Maybe not a physical one, but a spiritual one, and that Maggie targeted her curse at the entity and not at Lord Raith. That is how come she was able to stop him from feeding when he can't be targeted. She knew she couldn't do anything to him, but correctly guessed that she could cripple the demon.
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fwiw he could still use his wampire powers, just not rejuvenate his reserves.
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