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narphoenix:
--- Quote from: Locnil on June 19, 2014, 06:44:27 PM ---Oops, didn't see that. :-[
Tbh it's still not optimal to focus on power over control though, as control is more important than power when it comes to attacking. And fallout can work against you. And end of the day it doesn't actually give a bonus to anything. If it were up to me I'll add it as another benefit over and beyond the base benefit, as its value is mostly flavour, but well.
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It actually gives a substantial bonus even if you don't change your Refinements around for it. I mean, let's say your base spellcasting is +7 control, Weapon:7 in the element of your choice. But let's say you have an enemy you want to nuke horribly, who's easy to hit but hard to hurt (like someone with big size powers). So, you take a moderate and two mild consequences and cross out your fourth bubble of mental stress. Now you're still throwing off of +7 (maybe +9 because you probably are willing to spend a FP/take a Sponsor Debt to kill this guy), but your attack is Weapon:/18/. If you can make fallout without losing /any/ power, you're keeping it at Weapon:18 without taking Severe/Extreme Consequences to stay in the game like you would with Backlash.
Sanctaphrax:
--- Quote from: Hick Jr on June 19, 2014, 06:29:41 PM ---For me, taking Hellfire meant I had to reallocate all my foci for a situation that I wasn't always spellcasting for (hurting people).
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You know, there's no rule saying your power and control have to be equal.
--- Quote from: Hick Jr on June 19, 2014, 06:29:41 PM ---Tell me if I'm wrong here: Tessa throws a Hellfire-lightning bolt at Weapon:11. Her control roll is only +8. She takes three shifts of fallout, but the spell is still Weapon:11?
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Yes.
--- Quote from: Locnil on June 19, 2014, 06:44:27 PM ---And end of the day it doesn't actually give a bonus to anything.
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Sure it does. It gives a bonus to the power of every spell with a blown control roll, except for the ones where you choose to take backlash.
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on June 19, 2014, 06:51:18 PM ---Discussing it with my players, one of them suggested making that function an invoke on Hellfire's destructive aspect.
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It'd be pretty rare for that to be better than just invoking for a better control roll. That's a really weak benefit.
Also there's no reason why you couldn't invoke an Aspect to negate fallout-related power reduction without Hellfire.
--- Quote from: Hick Jr on June 19, 2014, 06:53:06 PM ---Any spell involving destruction or sin...
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That's every spell cast with Hellfire.
Locnil:
--- Quote from: narphoenix on June 19, 2014, 06:55:57 PM ---It actually gives a substantial bonus even if you don't change your Refinements around for it. I mean, let's say your base spellcasting is +7 control, Weapon:7 in the element of your choice. But let's say you have an enemy you want to nuke horribly, who's easy to hit but hard to hurt (like someone with big size powers). So, you take a moderate and two mild consequences and cross out your fourth bubble of mental stress. Now you're still throwing off of +7 (maybe +9 because you probably are willing to spend a FP/take a Sponsor Debt to kill this guy), but your attack is Weapon:/18/. If you can make fallout without losing /any/ power, you're keeping it at Weapon:18 without taking Severe/Extreme Consequences to stay in the game like you would with Backlash.
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Ah yes, that would be one scenario. I typically design my spellcasters to have control in excess of power, under the assumption I could just boost power at any time, so it didn't occur to me. But for a build that balances the two it would be quite useful.
Locnil:
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on June 19, 2014, 06:57:18 PM ---Sure it does. It gives a bonus to the power of every spell with a blown control roll, except for the ones where you choose to take backlash.
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Like I said above, scenarios like that didn't occur to me, since it's optimal to have more control than power anyway, but I can see how it might be useful.
Hick Jr:
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on June 19, 2014, 06:57:18 PM ---You know, there's no rule saying your power and control have to be equal.
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I'm aware. It just makes things a little easier for me, math-wise, and makes the spellcasting a little more versatile. I'd obviously prefer to have control be four more than power in every case, but doing that without a ton of Refinements generally means that you're only good at attacking.
Hmm. Sanctaphrax is right. The extra benefit needs to be narrowed further. Just "destruction"? Any spell that destroys.
Situations like the one narphoenix outlined are exactly the way the extra benefit is meant to be used.
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