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Setting up a ward how do you get all the shifts?

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Tbora:
Thing is thaumaturgy is not about raw power, given enough prep time to do make the ritual complex enough anyone with just thauma can do it. For example Kim in Fool Moon created a specialized circle capable of imprisoning a Loup Garou, something easily comparable in difficulty to the heart exploiting curse in Storm Front and she was a kitchen witch nothing special or particularly powerful. I am guessing as weak as she was she probably would have had Ritual instead of full on thauma. For a full wizard or sorcerer.... Well it's far easier for them by comparison.

crusher_bob:
IMHO:

Small fry thaumaturgy is stuff up to shift 8 or so; the limit is mostly there for safety, it's about as much power as you'd want to call and not have the backlash blow you up.  Anyone actaully competent at thaumatrugy can do this in a few minutes.

Then comes 'competent' thaumaturgy, up to around shift 20.  It's probably around what competent (but not great) practitioners can throw together in an afternoon.  While probably not good enough to kill you, it can certainly make your life very unpleasant.  The best wizards (e.g. senior council members) can throw something like this up in a few minutes.

Next step is actual scary stuff, death rituals, killer demon summoning, scary construct making, full magical transformations.  Complexity from maybe 30-50.  Most competent practitioners can probably do this in a few days.  The best wizards can probably do it in an afternoon.

Then we step up to plot device level stuff, setting off volcanoes, destroying bloodlines, stuff like that.  Which you normally need plot device like preparations to do.

bitterpill:
A spell caster with Supernatural Recovery and Thaumaturgy and say two extra physical stress boxes you could then pretty instantly add 10 complexity to your wards by taking 5 consequences via a serious blood sacrifice (opening up a vein). The only downside is the inclusion of a blood sacrifise might corrupt the spells nature a make it nastier? (I would say this is a GM caveat situation).

Sanctaphrax:
Personally, I rule that self-inflicted consequences and stress from spellcasting automatically satisfy catches. Because things get a bit silly otherwise.

Anyway, it seems that my opinion about what is a major ritual is slightly unusual or perhaps even wrong. But there haven't been any complaints about the basic idea behind the houserule.

So, would this be more reasonable to you if it increased difficulties by one for every two or three base complexities?

PS: I'm starting to think that requiring the caster to be able to control a shift on the worst possible roll might be too tough.

devonapple:

--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on February 09, 2011, 01:46:37 AM ---Thaumaturgy is as written very easy. I may have gone too far in making it otherwise, I guess.

--- End quote ---

I feel that folks may be inadvertently forgetting that the GM is generally setting the DCs for the Lore Declarations. The rules mention (at least for Divination effects like Harry's tracking spell) to just let certain low-power Thaumaturgy rituals work, without requiring the "minigame" that is the spell construct and empowering phase.

At the other end of the spectrum, GMs who feel that Thaumaturgy is being taken for granted can shift the narrative focus to those Lore Declarations, making them into actual Scenes or Conflicts. If Thaumaturgy is about "the story of the spell," and the GM feels the players are using the Cliff's Notes, the GM can drill down into those scenes and require more character development and risk.

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