The Dresden Files > DFRPG Resource Collection
Harry's Stats plus Assorted Other Stat Revisions (Small Favor through Cold Days)
narphoenix:
Completely ignoring the debate here: do you think that you could stat up Lea? I know the book says unstattable, but most interpretations put our favorite psycho faerie death lady at just above Winter Lady level. Do you think she's stattable?
Sanctaphrax:
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---Sure, a few, but they're usually called out as such.
--- End quote ---
Actually, you often have to infer their existence from the existence of things that negate them.
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---They are. But not when they're full. Not for anything. Why would Thaumaturgy be different? That's a serious question, BTW.
--- End quote ---
Because transforming someone with Thaumaturgy isn't actually an attack, it just simulates attack mechanics for the purpose of determining how complex an effect is.
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---Because even nameless people have all their Consequences to resist Thaumaturgy?
--- End quote ---
What? Why would you assume that?
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---Or, to look at it another way: Your heart exploding like that will kill anyonemeaning it needs to have enough shifts to do that, regardless of how many were actually necessary in this case. If it'd been something someone tough or lucky could survive (like an inflicted heart attack) Harry would've been less impressed even with the same victims dead, and it might've been a lower shift effect.
--- End quote ---
Hang on a minute, weren't you just proposing all take-out-based effects be equally hard to cast?
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---Only willing ones. That's hardly all.
--- End quote ---
Sorry, misspoke there. The general point stands.
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:44:51 PM ---So, uh, how does Lea turn people into hounds, then, by your interpretation? I'm curious.
--- End quote ---
She can cast with enough shifts. Or she has some kind of custom Power.
Deadmanwalking:
--- Quote from: narphoenix on January 11, 2013, 10:48:37 PM ---Completely ignoring the debate here: do you think that you could stat up Lea? I know the book says unstattable, but most interpretations put our favorite psycho faerie death lady at just above Winter Lady level. Do you think she's stattable?
--- End quote ---
No. She is second only to Mab herself in power. She's beyond stats. Individual things she does can be statted (like the dog thing), but as a whole? Not really, no. She's probably on par with the Senior Council in magic and has excessive amounts of other powers for being a Faerie. When you get to the -60 Refresh level and stats all at Great at a minimum, you're pretty much beyond stats.
Deadmanwalking:
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---Actually, you often have to infer their existence from the existence of things that negate them.
--- End quote ---
I suppose, but this isn't one of those.
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---Because transforming someone with Thaumaturgy isn't actually an attack, it just simulates attack mechanics for the purpose of determining how complex an effect is.
--- End quote ---
I disagree. It can kill or inflict Consequences, that makes it an attack. What other criteria are there for something being an attack?
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---What? Why would you assume that?
--- End quote ---
Just always have. Why would you assume the spell rules break all the other game rules in this area?
And my second explanation makes just as much sense. As does the meta explanation that he didn't know how many Consequences those people had and just assumed the worst, an assumption confirmed by his later research.
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---Hang on a minute, weren't you just proposing all take-out-based effects be equally hard to cast?
--- End quote ---
Uh...no, not really. You seem to be the one doing that (saying you always need 32 shifts regardless of circumstances). Taking someone out is enormously variable based on their current condition, willingness, and how good their defenses are. Something that can take anyone out no matter how good all that stuff is? Like that spell? Scary.
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---Sorry, misspoke there. The general point stands.
--- End quote ---
Not really. Willingness really should matter in how easy it is to perform magic on someone.
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on January 11, 2013, 10:55:12 PM ---She can cast with enough shifts. Or she has some kind of custom Power.
--- End quote ---
Well, I can't argue with those, I guess. Still, this seems the kind of thing other Fae of lesser power can likely do with Seelie Magic alone (just for example).
vultur:
--- Quote from: Deadmanwalking on January 11, 2013, 10:58:11 PM ---No. She is second only to Mab herself in power. She's beyond stats. Individual things she does can be statted (like the dog thing), but as a whole? Not really, no. She's probably on par with the Senior Council in magic and has excessive amounts of other powers for being a Faerie. When you get to the -60 Refresh level and stats all at Great at a minimum, you're pretty much beyond stats.
--- End quote ---
Why do you think her skills are all Great+? I don't see why she should have impressive Endurance, Might, or Fists for example, and Harry tricks her in GP (the ghost dust thing) so even her social skills probably aren't universally high.
Killing two Lords of Outer Night was really impressive, but she might have taken a ton of sponsor debt on that one... really, I think a lot of that "indulge yourself" stuff in Changes might have been sponsor debt based.
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