Author Topic: Getting to the Island  (Read 6525 times)

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #30 on: July 20, 2022, 06:03:16 PM »
The island literally saved Mab, without it Harry would have lost and Mab a pincushion of Steel rebar waiting for the Eye to recharge again.

The Merlin likely foresaw the necessity. It’s clear Mab, Uriel, Odin and Hades have been working together for some time. Their little Cabal obviously includes the Gatekeeper and he likely took over from the Original Merlin, when he died on the cabal. If you take the Arthurian era as 4AD and the Merlin lived a couple of centuries after that then the chances of an overlap are quite high.

Offline vincentric

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #31 on: July 20, 2022, 07:14:37 PM »
The island literally saved Mab, without it Harry would have lost and Mab a pincushion of Steel rebar waiting for the Eye to recharge again.

The Merlin likely foresaw the necessity. It’s clear Mab, Uriel, Odin and Hades have been working together for some time. Their little Cabal obviously includes the Gatekeeper and he likely took over from the Original Merlin, when he died on the cabal. If you take the Arthurian era as 4AD and the Merlin lived a couple of centuries after that then the chances of an overlap are quite high.

What book did you read that contained that storyline?

In BG, Harry protects Mab after the she is struck by the rebar from a group of Formor sorcerers\wizards. Butters pulls out the rebar and Mab gets up and confronts Ethniu. Mab then takes the shot from the Eye and is carried to safety by her people.

The other speculation may be true but is unsupported by the written record.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #32 on: July 20, 2022, 09:29:45 PM »
I presume Ethnui after killing Harry and recovering the Eye, would have pinned Mab to the ground with rebar, and at her most defenceless have blasted her point blank with the Eye,

Why how would you kill Mab?

Offline vincentric

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #33 on: July 20, 2022, 11:19:17 PM »
Ok, so you made it all up.

Speculation is fine. We all have our fanfic ideas but you argue using yours as if that were what Jim wrote. It's difficult to have a reasonable discussion when both parties are not using the same starting point.

Offline g33k

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #34 on: July 20, 2022, 11:51:09 PM »
... Why how would you kill Mab?

Convince Harry that it needs to be done.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #35 on: July 21, 2022, 09:02:35 AM »
Certainly, that would work the problem for Harry is that Molly becomes Queen. Mab in setting Molly as a Winter Lady candidate no doubt had this in mind, creating a massive disincentive for Harry to move against her and to protect her when vulnerable. Typical sneaky Mab.

That would need a real good argument to convince Harry. Molly could then have sex with Harry, so Molly may be up for it .

From what we saw in Peace Talks the only way to separate Molly from the Mantle may be to intervene before Molly become Lady in the first place, which means Harry has to Time travel back to Cold Days and save Lily, so Sarissa becomes the Winter Lady, but this would create a new timeline and not save Molly in the original timeline, only create a non-Winter Lady  Molly alongside the Winter Ladt Molly in a different universe, Harry hasn’t save anyone.

Otherwise only perhaps Uriel has the power to reconstruct the original Molly, just before the Mantle because as a full intellectus he would have full knowledge of Molly mind, body and soul just before she received the Mantle and re-create her like a Star Trek Transporter rematerialising from an older pattern  Even Mab, capable of teleportation seems only able to reconstruct things as they are, not as they were. In that scenario Harry removes the Mantle (I think he has figured out how to safely remove his, muting it by going past a threshold uninvited and then a summoning circle crossing the boundary, but the likely result an angry Mab slapping the Mantle back on him) and has Uriel bring Molly back to pre Cold Days. She would lose all the memories of being Winter Lady.

But as uriel often says he can do bugger all due to free will. The other side would need to do something huge for him to intervene to that extent.

Offline Eguzky

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #36 on: July 21, 2022, 01:57:16 PM »
Getting the thread back on track instead of wild guessing that has 0 facts to back it up made by someone who seems hellbent on derailing every thread they post in:

It really boils down to the fact that somethings exists on the NeverNever side that Harry has been told will Kill Him Horribly.
We don't know much about Demonreach except that it's a prison for the worst of the worst. And that means the NeverNever side also has to be pretty darn dark and dangerous.

 - This is not acceptable conduct. If you have an issue with another poster, use the report button. While there are not so many of us Moderators around anymore we can and will get to these things eventually. This forum is to be enjoyed by all, and we have a VERY clear list of rules and policies to help ensure that. Do not bait other users, do not troll them or otherwise belittle them. Because I don't have a lot of time these days, next offence wins you a free 3 week vacation from the boards.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2022, 01:23:05 AM by Yuillegan »

Offline BrainFireBob

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #37 on: July 21, 2022, 04:38:45 PM »
Getting the thread back on track instead of wild guessing that has 0 facts to back it up made by someone who seems hellbent on derailing every thread they post in:

It really boils down to the fact that somethings exists on the NeverNever side that Harry has been told will Kill Him Horribly.
We don't know much about Demonreach except that it's a prison for the worst of the worst. And that means the NeverNever side also has to be pretty darn dark and dangerous.

He's speculating. That's perfectly acceptable for a discussion board of a fantasy series. Long as he's not misquoting the actual text, I see no issue.

Offline Eguzky

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #38 on: July 21, 2022, 04:51:24 PM »
He's speculating. That's perfectly acceptable for a discussion board of a fantasy series. Long as he's not misquoting the actual text, I see no issue.
Sorry. He did the same thing in my thread, where he made random guesses out of far left field with 0 evidence, then admitted he makes baseless guesses, and claimed I was a troll for poking holes in his 'theories' when I said his posts sounded troll-like to me.

 - Edit this post to fit within forum rules i.e. not so passive aggressive.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2022, 01:24:34 AM by Yuillegan »

Offline BrainFireBob

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #39 on: July 21, 2022, 05:32:43 PM »
Sorry. He did the same thing in my thread, where he made random guesses out of far left field with 0 evidence, then admitted he makes baseless guesses, and claimed I was a troll for poking holes in his 'theories' when I said his posts sounded troll-like to me.

I read that too. Didn't see anything out of line there, either. My 2 cents

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #40 on: July 21, 2022, 06:52:50 PM »
Sorry. He did the same thing in my thread, where he made random guesses out of far left field with 0 evidence, then admitted he makes baseless guesses, and claimed I was a troll for poking holes in his 'theories' when I said his posts sounded troll-like to me.

Actually I didn’t admit to making “baseless guesses” I stated that I theorise and speculate based upon the books, mythology, WOJ, science, and what Jim has read/researched. Please do not try to misrepresent me again. Most members of this forum make such speculation. For example in a recorded interview just after Peace Talks Jim was asked “what is the first thing Harry is going to buy with the diamonds” and he joked “ a basketball hoop for the main hall” from that and Peace Talks I correctly posited that Harry would get the Castle as his home. There were naysayers who said I was making too much of a casual comment, that it was referring to the Swartalves Appartment, or Demonreach. Some thought I was right. Turns out I was right, and proved so by Battle Ground.

Trolling isn’t trying to attack my theories, I don’t care about that because it can give rise to new info being brought to my attention or generate new thought, and that is all good. I thank people when they bring me a new datum which supports or disproves a point. It’s trying to attack me personally by calling me a troll, which is of course the go to move of a genuine troll. The fact that you keep trying to force me to defend myself personally is the problem, and to try to en-list others in your campaign. You simply do not seem to be content with ignoring my posts, or try to disprove them and you attack the poster, and seek to encourage others to do the same.



We all have our theories and all are equally valid until proved to be demonstrably wrong by new information, but for any one of us to say ‘mine are valid but yours are baseless guesses’  in the absence of such new information is more than impolite.

Offline Ed0517

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #41 on: July 21, 2022, 09:46:43 PM »
Well, we know The Ladies, Queens, and Mothers of BOTH courts are also Hecate, which is not bound to either court.
This is pointed out in Skin Game when Dresden sees a statue of Hecate, and likens it to all 3 Queens from BOTH courts (Was, Is, & Will Be)

and Hecate is not a Fate. That's Clothos, Atropos, and Lachesis

Offline Ed0517

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #42 on: July 21, 2022, 09:52:06 PM »


It really boils down to the fact that somethings exists on the NeverNever side that Harry has been told will Kill Him Horribly.
We don't know much about Demonreach except that it's a prison for the worst of the worst. And that means the NeverNever side also has to be pretty darn dark and dangerous.

As opposed to Kill Him Nicely?

It might be they fear something worse than death  - corruption. The likes of Uriel might tell him dying "doing the Right Thing" is an honorable death far better than losing his soul to darkness.

Maybe the other end is not in Faerie. Could it be beyond the Gates? 

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #43 on: July 21, 2022, 10:29:19 PM »
Beyond the Gates is outside the NeverNever, so probably no unless we have been misled as to what is Outside.

Killing Harry nicely would be to supply him with unlimited Burger King and Cokes until he dies from heart disease and or diabetes. If corporate Mascots have been around long enough, feeding on enough childrens belief then  like the monster in Day One they exist and may have their own desmesnes within the NeverNever. Harry had better be careful he doesn’t fall into the clutches of The Burger King.

The option would seem to be an escape proof prison in the NeverNever. Tartarus is one option, the prison of the Titans, ironic now that Demonreach inprisons a Titan now. However some myths have Hercules breaking out Prometheus and of Saturn escaping, rendering Tartarus not escape proof, so if there is another escape proof prison in the NeverNever than that would be the preferred link to Demonreach. That’s why I think it’s Mab’s Ice Garden, no one has escaped from there. The break out of Lea failed, ironically as did the attempt to breach Demonreach

Offline BrainFireBob

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Re: Getting to the Island
« Reply #44 on: July 21, 2022, 11:11:20 PM »
There's a novel thought.

Assume you are right. Breaking Lea out of Arctis Tor might allow forging a new vonnection to Demonrreach somewhere else.