Saints

[Griffyn612]

Rashid wasn't influenced because he wasn't there. In Steed's words: He's he only other wizard here that we see less than you.
Besides, I doubt his religious beliefs can accommodate saints.

Islam has Saints, too.  They're called Wali.

[Fcrate]

Not really. Wali means a loyal to -in this context- God pious man, anyone can be a Wali, but it's not any sort of official position, immunity or power.
While some may equate a Wali to a saint, they're not the same.

[groinkick]

Not really. Wali means a loyal to -in this context- God pious man, anyone can be a Wali, but it's not any sort of official position, immunity or power.
While some may equate a Wali to a saint, they're not the same.

Well this is the Dresdenverse.  Jim pretty much laid out what a Saint was.  A wizard who also happens to have devout faith.  Didn't say the person needs to be a Christian.  Just like a KoTC that is an Atheist or Jewish.

[Griffyn612]

Not really. Wali means a loyal to -in this context- God pious man, anyone can be a Wali, but it's not any sort of official position, immunity or power.
While some may equate a Wali to a saint, they're not the same.

According to Wikipedia (my source on the subject, so forgive my ignorance if I'm misunderstanding) Wali are Islamic saints, which "In the traditional Islamic understanding of saints, the saint is portrayed as someone "marked by [special] divine favor ... [and] holiness", and who is specifically "chosen by God and endowed with exceptional gifts, such as the ability to work miracles"."

[Fcrate]

According to Wikipedia (my source on the subject, so forgive my ignorance if I'm misunderstanding) Wali are Islamic saints, which "In the traditional Islamic understanding of saints, the saint is portrayed as someone "marked by [special] divine favor ... [and] holiness", and who is specifically "chosen by God and endowed with exceptional gifts, such as the ability to work miracles"."

That's fine, it's a common misconception even among the Muslims. Mostly only superstitious folks actually believe in that. Maybe the Sofi's too. As per book, there's no such thing as a saint/special powers, and miracles can only be performed by God.  Now, a true believer can ask God's help, pray for it, even demand it, and it will come, it doesn't make it a miracle.

Well this is the Dresdenverse.  Jim pretty much laid out what a Saint was.  A wizard who also happens to have devout faith.  Didn't say the person needs to be a Christian.  Just like a KoTC that is an Atheist or Jewish.

Now that makes sense

[jonas]

Did he? He has used faith magic, yes, but he didn't combine it with his normal magic that I remember.

In FM it was his faith IN magic that let him conjure more of it then he had. He's a Magic Saint, or has the potential to be so.

[Fcrate]

When was that exactly? I don't recall it.

[peregrine]

He charged up his pentacle necklace with his faith before he slung it at the Loup.

Which was sorta what I was getting at, that under a suitably tortured reading, Harry could count.

[Snark Knight]

Well this is the Dresdenverse.  Jim pretty much laid out what a Saint was.  A wizard who also happens to have devout faith.  Didn't say the person needs to be a Christian.  Just like a KoTC that is an Atheist or Jewish.

Yeah, the answer was pretty clear that in-universe it applies to anyone combining faith and magic practices, and the only real difference between belief systems is that Catholicism actually uses it as a title.

Given that the Church system recognizes saints based on testimony from people who asked them to intercede with the Almighty in prayers for miraculous healing after the saint had died, which is completely outside the domain of wizard magic, I think it's fair to say the Catholic definition would only sometimes overlap with the hybrid practitioner definition.

[Fcrate]

He charged up his pentacle necklace with his faith before he slung it at the Loup.

Which was sorta what I was getting at, that under a suitably tortured reading, Harry could count.

Faith? I didn't get that vibe, I just thought he used the amulet to create a circle in the air, focused all what's left of his magic in it, and used a simple air spell to propel it toward the loup garou, just like gunpowder. The inherited silver did the work.

[Griffyn612]

The only thing i recall of Harry and faith is his commentary in Grave Peril.

The silver pentagram within the circle was the symbol of my faith, if that’s what you wanted to call it, in magic.

[groinkick]

Saints are probably pretty bad ass spell casters.  Michael isn't a wizard at all and his Faith magic was able to burn Red Court vamps.  A full fledged wizard using that along with their magic can probably do some pretty nasty magic.

[raidem]

I wonder if Father Forthill is a Saint.

[groinkick]

I wonder if Father Forthill is a Saint.

Hasn't really shown anything like that.  He isn't a wizard which Jim said the Saints are wizards.

[raidem]

How do we know that he isn't.  I think Jim described it as a wizard using faith magic.