Author Topic: Shrouds and mass  (Read 2146 times)

Offline knnn

  • Special Collections Division
  • Posty McPostington
  • ****
  • Posts: 4933
    • View Profile
Shrouds and mass
« on: December 09, 2015, 08:54:58 PM »
We've been told that a Shroud is able to disperse the energy blasts fired by ethereal canons, but I wonder how well they would put up against traditional (i.e. metal cannonball) weapons.  After all, we know that ether-silk passes through the shroud without problem, and the fact the you can feel wind when diving means that air can pass through as well.

P.S.  In our world, bronze cannons were still in use into the 19th century (it was more "springy" than cast iron), so iron rot isn't really an argument.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2015, 09:03:35 PM by knnn »
DV Geek code:

DV knnn v1.2 YR4 FR3 BK++ RP+ JB+ TH WG+ CL(+) SW++++ BC- MC---(+) SH[Murphy+, Molly+]

Find out your Dresden Files "Purity" score: http://knnn.x10.mx/purity2/purity.html

Offline Quantus

  • Special Collections Division
  • Needs A Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 25215
  • He Who Lurks Around
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2015, 09:36:53 PM »
We've been told that a Shroud is able to disperse the energy blasts fired by ethereal canons, but I wonder how well they would put up against traditional (i.e. metal cannonball) weapons.  After all, we know that ether-silk passes through the shroud without problem, and the fact the you can feel wind when diving means that air can pass through as well.

P.S.  In our world, bronze cannons were still in use into the 19th century (it was more "springy" than cast iron), so iron rot isn't really an argument.
Wood cannons werent unheard of either, they just broke down more often (and in a catastrophic way).  I imagine that the Shroud would be unable to stop a physical cannon any more than the silk vests can stop traditional bullets.  But I think the feasibility of cannons drops off sharply when the vessels are no longer locked onto the same plane of elevation, so between the three dimensional nature of airship combat, combined with their superior maneuverability would make them useless in all but very specific ambush circumstances.  Perhaps hiding in the noon-day sun and attempting to fire/drop physical masses onto a ship below?
<(o)> <(o)>
        / \
      (o o)
   \==-==/


“We’re all imaginary friends to one another."

"An entire life, an entire personality, can be permanently altered by just one sentence." -An Accidental Villain

Offline Second Aristh

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 3501
  • Numeromancer
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2015, 10:17:02 PM »
The shroud doesn't seem to hamper the aeronauts moving on the ship, so I would guess that it doesn't do much if anything to physical projectiles.  I don't think a shroud is just a shell of energy, more like a powerful field of etheric energy being emitted from the core crystal.
We shall not fail or falter, we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools, and we will finish the job.--Winston Churchill     

Offline knnn

  • Special Collections Division
  • Posty McPostington
  • ****
  • Posts: 4933
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2015, 01:21:26 AM »
Wood cannons werent unheard of either, they just broke down more often (and in a catastrophic way).  I imagine that the Shroud would be unable to stop a physical cannon any more than the silk vests can stop traditional bullets.  But I think the feasibility of cannons drops off sharply when the vessels are no longer locked onto the same plane of elevation, so between the three dimensional nature of airship combat, combined with their superior maneuverability would make them useless in all but very specific ambush circumstances.  Perhaps hiding in the noon-day sun and attempting to fire/drop physical masses onto a ship below?

1) Didn't the first encounter between the Predator and the merchant ship/Itasca occur at equal elevations?  IIRC they actually pulled out of their dive (i.e. slowed down) in order to shoot their cannons.  In any case, you'd think such things would at least be the spire itself (e.g. on the roof and at Habble Landing).

2) This also doesn't preclude things like rifles/bows raking the enemy decks.

3) Heck, what about ramming tactics?  It seems to me that the protection offered by a shroud could allow a ship to get very close.  A Predator "dropping like a rock" with a bronze ram could really do damage.  Heck, you needn't ram the ship itself.  Merely hitting the top/bottom masts could do wonders toward wounding a ship.
DV Geek code:

DV knnn v1.2 YR4 FR3 BK++ RP+ JB+ TH WG+ CL(+) SW++++ BC- MC---(+) SH[Murphy+, Molly+]

Find out your Dresden Files "Purity" score: http://knnn.x10.mx/purity2/purity.html

Offline Brightbane

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 961
  • Totally obscene.
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2015, 04:23:28 AM »
Is there any evidence that they have gunpowder? I can't bring any to mind. They would have to have access to volcanic hotsprings to get the sulfur or certain caves for the saltpeter. The charcoal is easily to obtain, if horrifically expensive.
Quote
Bob started tittering. "Look out! Look out for that vicious mega-squirrel, boss!" He said, hardly able to speak clearly. "My gosh! that ficus is about to molest you!"

Offline Second Aristh

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 3501
  • Numeromancer
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2015, 05:25:03 AM »
Is there any evidence that they have gunpowder? I can't bring any to mind. They would have to have access to volcanic hotsprings to get the sulfur or certain caves for the saltpeter. The charcoal is easily to obtain, if horrifically expensive.
Yeah, they have gunpowder.  Grimm comments more than once about practicing with a firearm when he's planning on taking down Cavendish.  It's not common based on the life of the gun barrel, but idk about the gunpowder itself.
We shall not fail or falter, we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools, and we will finish the job.--Winston Churchill     

Offline knnn

  • Special Collections Division
  • Posty McPostington
  • ****
  • Posts: 4933
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2015, 01:15:06 PM »
So here's a random question:

Why doesn't he the shroud dissipate the energy of your own guns?
DV Geek code:

DV knnn v1.2 YR4 FR3 BK++ RP+ JB+ TH WG+ CL(+) SW++++ BC- MC---(+) SH[Murphy+, Molly+]

Find out your Dresden Files "Purity" score: http://knnn.x10.mx/purity2/purity.html

Offline Quantus

  • Special Collections Division
  • Needs A Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 25215
  • He Who Lurks Around
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2015, 01:36:50 PM »
So here's a random question:

Why doesn't he the shroud dissipate the energy of your own guns?
Preddy doesnt want it to? :P

Actually, thats a really good question.  Perhaps it's a matter of "tuning" like the old star trek shields, and by having both the guns and shroud sourced in the same Core, they operate on the same frequency and can pass through?  Just spittballing...
<(o)> <(o)>
        / \
      (o o)
   \==-==/


“We’re all imaginary friends to one another."

"An entire life, an entire personality, can be permanently altered by just one sentence." -An Accidental Villain

Offline kazimmoinuddin

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 4366
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2015, 09:33:18 PM »
Due to ships able to rise and fall so much, canon would difficult to aim. If they develop gun turrets able to be adjusted, those could be set up.
k moinuddin

Offline Quantus

  • Special Collections Division
  • Needs A Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 25215
  • He Who Lurks Around
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2015, 09:41:27 PM »
Due to ships able to rise and fall so much, canon would difficult to aim. If they develop gun turrets able to be adjusted, those could be set up.
Shouldnt be too hard.  Those sorts of cannons usually had a screw tilt that was used for range adjustment, all it takes is a crank mechanism to make it a swift adjustment.  And that sort of thing would be just as useful (and perhaps as common) for the etheric cannons as for a physical one, Id wager. 
<(o)> <(o)>
        / \
      (o o)
   \==-==/


“We’re all imaginary friends to one another."

"An entire life, an entire personality, can be permanently altered by just one sentence." -An Accidental Villain

Offline kazimmoinuddin

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 4366
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #10 on: December 10, 2015, 10:10:29 PM »
Can they make homing canon shots? So they just need it going in the right direction.
k moinuddin

Offline Quantus

  • Special Collections Division
  • Needs A Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 25215
  • He Who Lurks Around
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #11 on: December 10, 2015, 10:26:30 PM »
Can they make homing canon shots? So they just need it going in the right direction.
Hmmm, I dont /think/ so.  That would imply a crystal with lateral thrust capabilities, which seems to not exist.
<(o)> <(o)>
        / \
      (o o)
   \==-==/


“We’re all imaginary friends to one another."

"An entire life, an entire personality, can be permanently altered by just one sentence." -An Accidental Villain

Offline Second Aristh

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 3501
  • Numeromancer
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2015, 02:45:18 PM »
Hmmm, I dont /think/ so.  That would imply a crystal with lateral thrust capabilities, which seems to not exist.
Not for airships anyway.  Etherealists seem to be able to make crystals float around in any direction they want.
We shall not fail or falter, we shall not weaken or tire...Give us the tools, and we will finish the job.--Winston Churchill     

Offline Quantus

  • Special Collections Division
  • Needs A Life
  • ****
  • Posts: 25215
  • He Who Lurks Around
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #13 on: December 11, 2015, 03:02:01 PM »
Not for airships anyway.  Etherealists seem to be able to make crystals float around in any direction they want.
Excellent point.
<(o)> <(o)>
        / \
      (o o)
   \==-==/


“We’re all imaginary friends to one another."

"An entire life, an entire personality, can be permanently altered by just one sentence." -An Accidental Villain

Offline kazimmoinuddin

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 4366
    • View Profile
Re: Shrouds and mass
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2015, 10:23:42 PM »
They can alter their fields of attraction and repulsion.
k moinuddin