Author Topic: Social Conflicts with a group.  (Read 1793 times)

Offline mrwakka

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Social Conflicts with a group.
« on: March 12, 2014, 11:53:12 AM »
I had a scenario occur where when meeting with the summer knight the players elected to begin a social conflict in an effort to get him to reveal his plans. With 6 players all jumping in it became obvious he was going to be beaten quickly and so he conceded and left the room (it was a party summer was throwing.)

It seems like social situations put the npc at a distinct disadvantage vs the group, and I am curious how it might be handled by others or if there is some limiting factor I might be missing, short of adding more npc's to the discussion which seems like it would get silly quickly for some minion to get involved in his bosses negotiations. At the same time I cannot imagine someone like marcone getting flustered by some minor players in his city, even if there are several talking to him at once.

We are all rather new to the system, and I haven't been able to find any examples of a lopsided social conflict, nor can I find any advice on how to deal with it in the books. I have been considering a house rule for very powerful/influential npcs that would be called ego and act as something akin to armor, but I am still not sure. Any advice would be welcome

Offline blackstaff67

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2014, 02:39:48 PM »
Layers of underlnigs and other minions can go far to keep your Summer Knight from being forced to give up the goods.  I mean, let's face it, social warfare is what the Fae do par excellence .  Given the Glamours they can weave, all the social skills they bring to the table, not to mention the mortal minions that owe them a solid to intervene for them, and you'll have to stay up all night to best them in a social conflict.
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Offline Haru

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2014, 02:48:41 PM »
Well, look at what makes sense, when you frame the scene. For social conflicts, it just doesn't make sense for everyone talking at once. Instead, you choose one person who is best equipped for the job and let him do it. If he can't get it done, none of the characters will. I wouldn't just let another character try afterwards, if the first one fails, that would be ridiculous. They are all talking over each other, each with a different strategy and each with different knowledge. It just won't work.

And quickly back to framing the scene. If you think that Marcone wouldn't be flustered by some newcomers like that, and I think I might agree there, then that is not an option. Look at it as social immunity, though it doesn't have to be a power, really, it just comes from what is true in the game world. But the player go up against him for a reason. They need something from him, or they want him to back of on something, or whatever it might be. Talk as a group, what would be a reasonable thing for Marcone to give up, and what the players might have to do in return. And then have that be the stakes the social conflict is playing for.
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Offline Taran

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #3 on: March 12, 2014, 04:39:47 PM »
Like Haru said, figure out the stakes.

How much is the Knight willing or allowed to give up?  That's the prize the party is going after.

You have to be fair, though.  Maybe the Knight isn't socially adept.  If that's the case, he may give up the goods.

If they're maneuvering to boost the main attacker, let the NPC defend against all maneuvers.  That way, if he's somewhat adept at social defense, the less socially statted characters are less likely to be able to wear them down.

Also, use compels.  Some of your PC's probably aren't good at social interactions and have aspects that reflect it.  Compel those aspects and let the PC's sabotage their own plans.  Like Haru said, if they start talking over each other, it will be counter-productive so make sure the socially awkward pc's are butting in, being rude and/or aggressive at the wrong/inopportune times.  Maybe escalating the social conflict in a way the pc's don't want...like having a Fae Lord overhear and get insulted...or use an aggressive characters Intimidate skill as a block against the Pc's efforts.  There's lots you can do with compels.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #4 on: March 12, 2014, 08:39:00 PM »
One easy way to make things a bit more even would be to let social attacks target any number of characters. It makes sense to me narratively, since a good argument ought to work on everyone who hears it.

Might get a bit weird in team arguments, though.

Offline UmbraLux

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #5 on: March 12, 2014, 10:37:09 PM »
It seems like social situations put the npc at a distinct disadvantage vs the group, and I am curious how it might be handled by others or if there is some limiting factor I might be missing, short of adding more npc's to the discussion which seems like it would get silly quickly for some minion to get involved in his bosses negotiations.
Fate's action economy is consistently king whether talking about physical, social, or mental conflicts.  Without prior preparation (or a win button) the solo opponent is going to lose.  However, prior preparation makes up for a lot.  It's essentially spending actions ahead of time.  Even when the GM/player doesn't prepare, you can use declarations to simulate the same thing. 

Quote
We are all rather new to the system, and I haven't been able to find any examples of a lopsided social conflict, nor can I find any advice on how to deal with it in the books. I have been considering a house rule for very powerful/influential npcs that would be called ego and act as something akin to armor, but I am still not sure. Any advice would be welcome
Make sure you're setting the stakes to fit the relative powers.  Marcone has no reason (barring legally admissible evidence which hasn't been found) to stake his empire on an argument with Murphy and friends.  He may be willing to trade information, perhaps even at a loss, to the same group.  Any concessions / losses should reflect that.
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Offline g33k

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2014, 12:59:44 AM »
Also note that at a big party-like event, there would seem to be other Summerfae, who might even up the odds by joining into the whole "Social Conflict" thing, engaging the other PC's in ways that prevent them from stacking advantages, etc.  Even reversing the situation!  What do the PC's stand to loose?  Maybe some social-combat "weakling" in the party is giving up their secrets, even as the rest of the party is "cornering" the Summer Knight...  ;-)
 

Offline OwleIsohos

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2014, 01:05:08 PM »
You might also say that there are aspects already on the scene that the Summer Knight can tag to his advantage, giving him boosts to his rolls to even the odds.  He is, after all, at a Summer party, in a place of his power, surrounded by those who are ostensibly his allies - there are bound to be multiple free tags/declarations he can use to boost his rolls or invoke to cause complications for the PCs.

Offline toturi

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Re: Social Conflicts with a group.
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2014, 12:07:25 AM »
My question is what do the players want. Sure, as the GM, you feel you have to provide a challenge. But what do the players want? Do they want to succeed? Are they ok with failure? Are they going to enjoy success more than failure?
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