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Messages - Ms Duck

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31
I see the letter opener as a spanking, really.

Harry got the message loud and clear.

slade was made an example of.

Am I arguing in favor of absolutism? Utterly not, I am of the bleeding heart liberal faction.

But if doing such things is evil, 95% of human governments in history are evil.

32
Actually it is a very confusing word as soon as you get close to it. Sometimes it is just an us versus them label. If you say it is a human point of view do you mean humanity for us?

If you say us = this reality or us = intelligent life then you can get to a definition of evil that includes the Sidhe.

my definition of 'evil' is:

1) causing harm for the pleasure of it

2) having no concern for the harm you cause

Mab fits neither, as she pointed out to Harry about why he chose her in changes.

33
But if your theory about magic and power is correct, that means that Mab needs us as much as we need to live.

nope.

Magic comes from life in the DF, not people alone. Humans are just nice efficient crunchy snacks. We can know this because its very likely Dragons predate humanity.


34
Oh Hollorr, I am so not cool.  DF is my first fandom obsession in many moons... (I have seen Batman and enjoy Green Arrow, but am a strictly a viewer - no deep meanings.)

It would be easier for me to consider a Mab a hero for sacrificing her life and saving mankind, if saving mankind mattered to her.  I think if she needed the dead bodies of every man, woman and child on Earth in order to fulfill her purpose, she wouldn't blink an eye.  I don't think her nature includes any protective impulses for mortals, so saving them might be a by-product of her possible life-sacrifice, but isn't the goal.


but from this you consider the survival of homo sapiens to be more important then the survival of earth itself?

that's  a very... human... point of view.


35
I believe Mab is evil.  I believe that any human in DV who deals with Mab, and doesn't assume she is evil and behave accordingly, is making an error.  I'd be curious if anyone else agrees with me, of course.

But, what I was asking was in response to Ms Duck's statement - - whether Mab, because of her purpose guarding the Gate, should be considered heroic if she dies pursuing that purpose?

--absolutely.

its a WAG, but I think Mab is going to die soon and she knows it. Molly was not intended to be the next winter lady; Molly is intended to be the next winter queen.

that, and arguments about 'good and evil' when dealing with gods tends to be a bit mushy, IMO. it all comes down to the person's perspective, and the person's opinion...

36
also, Mab became Queen of Winter 1,000 years ago. That doesn't say she wasn't Queen of Air and Darkness 1600 years ago, or maybe even Queen of Ghosts 500 years before that...

she may have been sidhe much longer then she was winter queen, ya know :D

37
the difference is this grenade is self aware, and while we can debate morality or soulness has made decisions that limit civilian casualties as well as placed herself in considerable danger at times.

there is some one home there, folks.

 ;)

38
Maybe...the WoJ does say that a human can lose their soul. I'm not sure if that was meant metaphorically though (see my note on the Denarians).

When Bob talks about soul sharing in WN he only mentions Harry sharing his souls with Susan, Murphy, and Lash. None of those are "bad" relationships so he probably wasn't losing his soul...

Bob says that it's soul exchanging so wouldn't that mean that even if interacting with Mortals gave you bits of soul you would swap some back?

Hmmm...

It's not stated anywhere in CD that Mab has a soul. The only mention of it was in the KC WoJ and he says he isn't sure. I'll grant that it's ambiguous.

The WoJ specifically does not state that Mab is unchangeable. In fact it specifically states that beings without Free Will can become something more. That's the whole point of my theory.

I think that the change that Odin went through with the Kringle Mantle is waaay different than the "growing a soul" change. For one it doesn't really make sense it the context of MW's quote. After all she changed (she became Baba Yaga) so why is she dissing Mab for interacting with mortals too much? Also, neither Odin nor MW gained Free Will from their changes. It also doesn't make sense with the WoJ about the beings themselves not changing but our understanding of them changing. Gaining Free Will and a soul is very much a change of the being.

I don't think Mab has to be willing. The process of convincing a human and giving a being without a soul a soul are two very different things. The mortals aren't trying to convince Mab to change. That would be impossible. They are just unconciously giving a soul. No convincing involved at all. 

The WoJ wasn't from Mabs perspective. It's not Mab herself saying that. It is a direct statement from the author that Mab wouldn't give a crap if she had to sacrifice anyone in Winter.

Mab can have feelings. Those feeling will be along the lines of appreciation or sadism. Not things like sentiment or love.

Maeves had feelings yes. They were feelings entirely in line with her Mantle. I didn't see Maeve being kind or sentimental.

I have to disagree with your conclusions here. Sometimes the person most willing to sacrifice themselves and everything they have is the person driven by love.

Mab knows that if she fails, the outsiders will eat everything on earth. she will sacrifice herself and every soldier under her command to stop this.

the difference between a monster and a hero is what your are willing to die for.

39
In Harry's a sharp sword, slade wasn't a club. he was a toothbrush.


40
Just realize.. there is at least a 10% chance harry is now Marcone's great great step granddad...

41
Well Lily wasn't exactly "kick arse" and she got the job. Molly is arguably "kick arse" but she wasn't a first option. Sarrissa didn't really seem "kick arse" either.

I do agree with you though.

Though...why would the Mab described in the WoJ's care if she lost her soul?

because she wants it... and she refuses to give up, that's why.


42
seriously, do you think the woman who became Mab grew more intelligent, ruthless, cunning, and relentless as the mantle took over or was she always one kick arse biotch from heck which is why she got the job?

I think it's the latter.

then the explanation for why she still has part of her soul is simple.. she's too dang stubborn not too.

she just won't give up.. not to nemesis, not to the outsiders, and not to her own nature. She will be what she wishes to be and heck helps whomever gets in her way.

 ;D

43
Ive thought about it, and I have concluded Mab has become more.

she is now Mrs. Dresden.

 ;D

44
We know mortal magic causes all sorts of problems with the person's head. both with the victim and the caster. However, the Fae are able to remove memories and affect anyone within their court or to who they've made a bargain. It's entirely possible that they can do this without causing the same harm to either the victim or themselves. We don't see Fix having headaches because of the compulsion he's under, and we don't see Susan having a constant headache when she's had memories removed.

its first person. Unless they said something, they wouldn't

45
And indeed, they can't; those memories were still right there when Harry unglamoured them.

and Harry's memories returned when Michael did his lay on hands trick

yall avoiding the point at the end where Mab admits she took his rod, ya know.

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