ParanetOnline
The Dresden Files => DF Spoilers => Topic started by: KurtinStGeorge on September 14, 2019, 07:39:36 PM
-
The idea here is that Harry isn't the most introspective person. When Harry finally starts to think things through he won't have many answers, but he should be able to think of some people, and not-people he can ask. So what one question do you think Harry should be asking, and is there someone he should ask? If you think another character should ask Harry a question, that's fine too.
I'll start. I think Harry needs to learn Winter Law. I have a feeling Molly won't be able to tell anything to Harry. There's probably some Winter Queen compulsion about preventing the mortal help from becoming well informed, or Mab could just put a geas on her. Harry should ask Ivy; assuming she's in PT, if she knows if there is a source on Winter Law that Harry could read.
-
Harry should try to find out more about his mother. There is a WOJ that there is something big about Margaret Le Fae that we don't know yet, and it will change a lot when we find out what it is.
APG
-
APG absolutely agree, even if you assume that Harry is pretty busy and obstinate - a detective would surely notice that his mother is quite involved in a lot of things that affect him still...could you find that WOJ?
Kurtin - I agree. Surely there is some lore, or an expert who could help him work out Winter Law. Or Summer Law. Or both.
But really what I think Harry should ask:
1) What is a starborn? He knows he is one and has done zero research on it. Mab, Leah, any faerie, Vadderung, probably the White Council should be able to help put this puzzle together.
2) What is the purpose of the Warden and the history of the role? Whilst off screen, Harry has figured some of it out, we haven't had any exposition on this. And the way Ebenezar talks about it still makes me think there is still more to be revealed.
3). What is beyond the Outer Gates? Who previously defended them? maybe a big no-no for the White Council, but Harry is barely White Council any more. He is involved in bigger issues, as a tool of greater powers. He needs to start talking to Angels, Fae, anyone to get some more information on the Outsiders. Or hell, even summon one.
4) What is the link between the Redeemer and the Outsiders? Skin Game provides a big connection between Christ, the Fae, The Greco-Roman pantheon and the Outsiders. Harry needs to find the point of connection.
5) What is going on with the inbetween with Captain Murphy etc. and who are the bad guys? Carmichael only partially agreed with Harry's statement of Fallen, even though he led him to that answer by pointing out the angel guard. I would be trying to talk to them via ectomancy.
6) What are the origins of the Vamps? Why are they so different yet considered similar? Why are they working together and yet against each other? What is the Outsider connection?
Of course, this will all get answered as it becomes necessary to the plot. So we will have to wait. But if I were Harry, I would slow down on the cases and get to the big questions as a priority. But I am not Harry, and Jim needs to sell books, so wait and see I guess.
-
This^^^
I know from the Doylist perspective, Harry can't know a lot of this stuff b/c if he knows too soon, it gets a bit easier for him, and that's not as fun. But yeah, not being introspective is one thing, but these are some pretty big questions that he's not asking.
Hm, maybe Molly could hint enough without outright telling him. But then, his mantle could provide the info if he asked it.
I'd say, he needs to ask how someone could get Nemfected so he can rule some people out. The best ones to ask would be Lea, Mab, Rashid, maybe the Mothers? If he asks of the fae, it'll come with a price tag of course but it'd be worth it a least.
For what's beyond the Outer Gates, it'd could be the multi-verse. Vadderung or Bob could help with that.
For a lot of these questions, he'd need to offer up something big to get any substantial answers. Course, letting Harry fumble around in the dark is a pretty stupid idea so I don't get why they don't just be a bit straighter with him.
-
Any questions would be a goid start, considering Hardy is wilfully ignorant on basically everything until it tries to kill him.
Hell, iirc in the first book he didn't even know that there were multiple vampire courts...
He's like, a Wizard that took Int as his dump stat.
-
Was his father murdered? If so, who, how, why?
How does Vaderung keep putting his fairy mantle on a shelf and taking off when it is needed?
More generally how his mantle works.
Any information he can get on previous Winter Knights.
What Martha Liberty meant by "you know what he was meant to be."
-
... I think Harry needs to learn Winter Law ...
Yeah; Winter Law... and "care and maintenance (and retirement!) of a Mantle."
Dresden got a lot of magical training, and has Bob for more magic, but he's pretty weak on the whole "Faerie" thing. Bob informed him on-screen about multiplicity of Queens, and about Knights... All new to Harry at the time.
Now he IS a Knight, and has only the Knightly "training" that Mab saw fit to give him.
Mab.
Harry desperately need to get further (and non-biased) info.
...
1) What is a starborn? He knows he is one and has done zero research on it. Mab, Leah, any faerie, Vadderung, probably the White Council should be able to help put this puzzle together.
2) What is the purpose of the Warden and the history of the role? Whilst off screen, Harry has figured some of it out, we haven't had any exposition on this. And the way Ebenezar talks about it still makes me think there is still more to be revealed.
...
THESE.
They are a part of who Harry is; born Starborn, and bound in ritual of blood and power to Demonreach. On the island, the intellectus is inside his head.
I'm kind of shocked that Harry Dresden isn't freaked-out over Something Else that has a piece of the inside of his head.
But most especially the whole Starborn thing... Barely-trained 16-yo Harry Dresden beat HWWBehind. Yet Ebenezer -- wielding the freaking Blackstaff! -- reports that he (and other WC wizards!) would likely have died from Outsider attacks, if not for Micheal showing up with the Sword. Harry needs to know about the whole Starborn bit.
===
Honestly, I think most of the rest of the list are... eh, maybe, nice-to-know stuff; stuff that's grown in significance because of all the fan theorizing, but not necessarily core to the upcoming BAT plotlines.
-
What do other people see when they soul gaze Harry?
I've got this sneaking suspicion that Harry's conversation with his dad was a glimpse of his soul and the Jabberwocky is close at hand.
-
But most especially the whole Starborn thing... Barely-trained 16-yo Harry Dresden beat HWWBehind. Yet Ebenezer -- wielding the freaking Blackstaff! -- reports that he (and other WC wizards!) would likely have died from Outsider attacks, if not for Micheal showing up with the Sword. Harry needs to know about the whole Starborn bit.
I don't think that was a real fight. The flashback in GS makes it pretty clear that the Walker was there to manipulate Harry - it killed the gas station worker just to get Harry motivated to stand and fight, and expressed satisfaction about his reaction. It might not have counted on quite how volatile gas pumps can be to stand next to, but it also passed on plenty of opportunity to kill Harry. Lea even commented about it being about manipulating him toward violence.
I'm still not sure whether it was there of it's own initiative to influence Harry, or sent by someone else to push Harry into a confrontation with Justin, but it wasn't acting as an assassin like Harry thought at the time.
-
I don't think that was a real fight. The flashback in GS makes it pretty clear that the Walker was there to manipulate Harry - it killed the gas station worker just to get Harry motivated to stand and fight, and expressed satisfaction about his reaction. It might not have counted on quite how volatile gas pumps can be to stand next to, but it also passed on plenty of opportunity to kill Harry. Lea even commented about it being about manipulating him toward violence.
I'm still not sure whether it was there of it's own initiative to influence Harry, or sent by someone else to push Harry into a confrontation with Justin, but it wasn't acting as an assassin like Harry thought at the time.
Check out my theories on the question. I think the powers that were using Justin to raise two possible star borns to be enforcers needed only one. Thus when Justin successfully enthralled Elaine, Harry was no longer needed, so HWB was sent to kill him.
-
Having given this a lot of thought over the years: Harry's an investigator, a wizard. Two occupations that strongly imply a desire -- almost a need to know. To get answers.
Yet, none of the most pressing questions in his life seem to get put on the front burner. For most of the series we see Harry's busy week. The other fifty-one weeks he manages to not learn anything, not talk to anyone about these things.
Why?
Jim doesn't waste ideas, and Mab once removed Harry's memory of fire magic, and his blasting rod. And she did it so smoothly that until he was directly forced to acknowledge it, he never even questioned it.
Personally, I think there's an inhibitor placed in Harry's head that redirects him away from or around these kinds of questions. The person who placed it could have been Lea or Eb or Justin; they all had time and proximity and all of them could justify it to themselves one way or another. Heck, imagine the kind of potent subtle wind magics Justin could weave night after night over months or years.
Anyway, that's my take on the why not part of this...
-
This^^^
I know from the Doylist perspective, Harry can't know a lot of this stuff b/c if he knows too soon, it gets a bit easier for him, and that's not as fun. But yeah, not being introspective is one thing, but these are some pretty big questions that he's not asking. ...
I would like it if we found out that in his off time between cases, Harry has been asking questions about some of these issues, but he hasn't found anyone or anything on the spooky side of the fence to give him any useful information. Either Harry can't go to a demon like Chauncey because the price is too high, other beings that wouldn't charge as much don't have useful information to trade or are afraid of crossing more powerful beings by giving Harry the information he needs. That would be more satisfying what we are currently left with.
Just to pick one issue as an example; it's one thing for Harry not to want to know just how dark his mother may have gone before she redeemed herself. I could understand that, but to also avoid thinking about his father's death and who might be responsible, avoiding any attempt to find out more about what being Starborn means, not actively trying to find information on Winter Law and seeming to forget about the relationship he wanted Lash to clue him into between the Black Court and the Outsiders, seems like a bit much to me. It makes Sev Expar's explanation that Mab or someone else has been messing with Harry's mind to prevent him from asking dangerous questions, seem plausible to me. Though as I said above, I would prefer to learn that Harry has been trying to answer the various mysteries he seems to be ignoring, he just hasn't found any useful source of information yet.
-
I agree Harry needs to learn Winter Law. He could swing it as aiming to be a better knight, but the downside is if Mab's version of Physical Therapy involves a shotgun, I imagine a pop quiz would be writing an essay while bullets pop by. Or a bomb goes off.
-
Who is the Wikipedia of Harry's life and purpose? Who should he ask? Everybody in the book that might have knowledge also have their own agendas.
-
Couldn't he ask Toot-Toot about winter law and pay with lots of pizza?
Toot isn't winter, but he must know, doesn't he?
-
Ask Toot what? It's like you asking, "What law might I break?" Might I suggest 10,000 possibilities? Certain things you know, like Toot, are things you know because you are of the culture. In the story itself, asking people about things, like what it means to be a star born, might put you at risk of giving away what you don't know. Which has it's own risks. To quote Mark Twain,
It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
And the people who know about Margaret's evil plans are her fellow conspirators. People you can't ask, like Cowl or Lord Raith.
-
All your questions, and this:
"Who is my grand mother? Do I have aunts or uncles? Eb has siblings?
Who exactly took care of me immediately after my mom dies, until dad took me? And of course, I want all details about mom's final day".
-
Harry is a wizard. He understands and has demonstrated that knowledge is power.
But he only asks pertinent questions when the house is on fire. Apparently - his brain is functional, long-term.
According to WoJ the books are actually Harry's diaries [ like the one of Ebenezer ] so it's not unimaginable that we only get to read the diaries from the few exciting weekends.
Still: the progress of Harry's analysis is too slow and too little.
"Who is my grand mother? Do I have aunts or uncles? Eb has siblings?
Why do I like sheep so much?
Where can I buy a kilt?
The obvious questions posted above.
I mean: I get it: Harry's a hikkikomori who only goes to work to pay the rent. Otherwise he's at home, reading books, tinkering with magic, occasionally being sociable. Right...
So... why don't we see more gadgets? I understand Jim's reasoning, I don't undertand Harry's - his gadgets have saved his hide and other people several times over;
- escape potion
- boost when he jumped out of the car to face the Streetwolves
- protective charm he gave to Lydia
- anti-vampire venom
- bear-charm [ would have been extremely useful in the Shedd Aquarium - even a gamechanger ]
- Little Chicago - is now available to BFS [ yes, the house burned down. The lab was in the sub-basement, a concrete box, and I'm betting it survived ], but the few uses have been worth it.
- panic room - great. Needs more.
What I'm missing based on what happened in the books:
- longitude and latitude coordinates have been in use for centuries before GPS was ever invented. Harry is an old-fashioned guy but doesn't think of checking out a map? [ and yes, for those of you, who aren't aware, paper maps generally have longitude and latitude info in them... or they used to at least ] Maybe the search spell needs vamping up?
- He's a magic nerd/geek but he doesn't jump at the possibility of checking out swords made by Lucio ??? Really? I don't believe that. Not in a million years.
- HEALING ITEMS. Seriously, by now, with a bunch of shapeshifters figuring out healing, how come Dresden doesn't even heave a headache cure around??? Even if it's just a tiny boost. Dresden keeps getting busted up for 10+ years now - every normal person would try to figure out a way how to get out of hospital bed faster and with less trouble. I'm saying this as someone who spent a lot of time in hospital beds. Trust me, after a few weeks you don't care how nice the hospital personnel is. You want to go home.
HIS HAND!!! Gods, just making it better a bit faster should have been motivation enough. That should have been the turning point; the reason why Dresden learns basics of healing magic.
- Harry keeps whining about using his 3rd Eye. Ok, cool. So how come there is no gadget that helps him with that? Seriously! Harry is a snoop. You'd expect him to have a pair of enchanted glasses or a monocle to help him at least see parts of what he'd normally have to use his 3rd eye to see.
- Back to healing magic - Carlos got hurt, Murphy got hurt, Michael got hurt, Shiro died from torture and a curse, Thomas endangered people when he was hurt, Molly got hurt, ... kids got shot and mauled to death by monsters. Again - at least a 1st aid to stop/slow down bleeding, you know, basic treatment that _EVERYONE_ who keeps getting injured learns eventually. If a spell is too complex, again, back to healing items.
- Moneymaker - Dresden should have an item that helps him make money more easily. I'm not saying "cheating" as such. Just another tool to help him get the funding he needs. It's obvious from the books that money is always an issue, so I don't see a reason why he doesn't do what everyone does when they can: make their job a bit easier. You know, like a lie detector, better search spell, stuff like that.
- More holding items like the unicorn hair rope. Even if they don't work as well. Something is always better than nothing. Christ, even cops have handcuffs which would be arguably better than bare hands when dealing with the fae.
...
-
I agree, we here (in the forum, not in this thread) has been discussed magical items for ages. Yes, I understand some of them could be very expensive, but making one magical item every six months or so could be affordable. And I want healing potions too. I am sure Butters could help with the theory :)
-
I think Harry would have a lot of trouble with crafting healing items. I don't know how they could be made to function reliably, with predictable (identical, repeatable) results. You might be able to cheat with it by making it work similarly to watercrafting in Codex Alera—basically, you help the body heal itself rather than close the wound.
I don't even know if healing magic is all that big a thing in Dresden. The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind, but (evidently) it can't do things like mend broken bones (Luccio certainly should have been healed, right?) I mean, the number of injuries to Council wizards who should have access to the best healing magic the White Council has to offer is really, really high. Half the wardens have been shown to be in slings, on crutches, wrapped up with bandages, etc.
Even a necromancer, a wizard-level talent with power over life and death, was only able to prevent a dying man from dying. She was able to anchor his life to his body, right? But the guy still had to go to the hospital, and required tons of medical assistance to stay alive after the spell would run out. So Kumori was able to keep someone alive, but unable to do anything with the injuries.
And I can also totally see something that could work like that being really, really dangerous to mess around with. Cuz you can't see inside someone's body, right? Imagine if Harry tried to close up an internal wound with magic. He'd probably end up ripping more holes open.
Items... maybe. I don't know how they would work. Because, again, the issue is repeatability, right? You need an item that can, for example, slow blood loss from a variety of different wounds. Maybe potions? I don't know. I'd have to see how it would work. But sure, I guess that could be a possibility.
Harry could've used some money help up until Skin Game, agreed. Should've learned some more geomancy from Eb, gone down to a mountain range, and pulled up a gold vein. Or, hell, used it to find freaking oil or something. Instead he was working for fifty bucks an hour (and probably only about 10-20 hours a week) finding people's keys.
There are tons of places where his gear could've been improved. How about an extra enchantment on his duster that worked like his force rings, except they channeled the energy into a kinetic shield instead? Would be really nice if Harry didn't have to constantly get hit with "major league fastballs" every time a thug with a Mac 10 opened up on him. I even thought about doing something simple, like duct taping a bunch of extra force rings to the hubcaps of the Beetle. Let the rotation charge them up. Just drive the car around the block a few times in ten minutes instead of beating a speed bag for a half hour (or waiting three weeks of normal use or whatever).
Since he's the Winter Knight, it'd be kind of appropriate if he could magic up the Dresden equivalent of Aleran coldstones, too. Or toss around those Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)
Or he could just use what he's got. I'm reasonably certain that the gem his mother left him with directions through the Ways is a lot more than just an auditory map. I think there's more information in there, since it appears she used it kinda like a tape recorder. I really, really want to know if there's more information in that gem, and it's barely been touched since it was introduced in Changes. It was, if I remember right, literally the only possession he still had in Cold Days, thanks to Mab keeping it safe for him.
-
Just to be clear, I would never say that Harry should be an Inspector Gadget kind of wizard. I just think that he needs to craft one item or two every several months. And you are right about healing- It seems to be something very difficult in the Dresden verse and I think that only some minor injuries should be feasible (unless you want to risk giving someone a cancer) . But still, Harry seems to be unable to cure even a hit point ( :P) and that seems to be quite extreme.
-
I don't even know if healing magic is all that big a thing in Dresden. The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind
I'm assuming you're intentionally leaving out fairies. Ebeneezer did those stones that stopped the pain and restored the blood flow to Harry's hand in Blood Rites. Elaine did the "Reiki" in White Night.
Instead he was working for fifty bucks an hour (and probably only about 10-20 hours a week) finding people's keys.
He was up to $75 an hour by Blood Rites, but point taken and agreed to.
Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)
Right?
His mom's gift should totally be used more. I'd imagine Mab would take advantage of his having it.
I do think Harry/a wizard should be able to come up with a lot of first aid level magical equipment. Also, combining Bob's alchemy knowledge, Butter's medical knowledge, and whatever Elaine was doing with that Reiki stuff, they should probably be able to come up with some sort of healing potion that does something useful even if not that miraculous. Maybe something gives you the equivalent of at least a day's recovery (but not rest).
Maybe that's mostly the sort of thing LtW does. Instead of taking 6-12 weeks, broken bones heal in 3-6 weeks.
-
He has a limited market for magical items. And anything he can make so can any other wizard. And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.
-
The item I would most like to see Harry create is a staff (or what ever item) that would conjure a frozen turkey to home in on his foes! :o
As for selling an magically crafted item, with the kind of luck Harry has, if he ever did it would come back to bite him in the worst possible way...
-
He has a limited market for magical items. And anything he can make so can any other wizard. And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.
While I agree that crafting random magical items probably isn't the best way to make money for a wizard, there is a market for it in the DF. Harry has bought things from svartalves. Surprisingly (maybe), there is a real world market for charms and blessings. See https://www.texasmonthly.com/the-daily-post/louisiana-witch-doctor-jailed-for-aiding-texas-cocaine-cartels/ (https://www.texasmonthly.com/the-daily-post/louisiana-witch-doctor-jailed-for-aiding-texas-cocaine-cartels/).
-
Harry should be asking the questions that he probably doesn't want the answers to.
-
Just to be clear, I would never say that Harry should be an Inspector Gadget kind of wizard.
Several points here:
- That's the strange part. Dresden is a nerd. A geek. He loves reading fantasy adventure books ffs!
- Another thing: On one hand we hear Harry talk about being prepared almost as often as if he was one of the advisors for Soviet children camps [ the motto was: "Ready at all times!". We don't really know what they were supposed to be ready for. A war, most likely ], we read about him researching magic, because he really loves doing magic... We even read about his attempts to make a flying broomstick.
It really bums me out when I'm reading about a character who's supposed to be smart, yet they keep acting dumb or at the very least, not acting smart. Sure, Dresden doesn't think highly of himself.
But consider how Thomas or Murphy describe him.
Plenty of fairly smart people don't actually consider themselves smart, they only realize that, for some weird reason, other people don't understand some fairly elementary ideas...
And you are right about healing- It seems to be something very difficult in the Dresden verse and I think that only some minor injuries should be feasible (unless you want to risk giving someone a cancer) . But still, Harry seems to be unable to cure even a hit point ( :P) and that seems to be quite extreme.
Let me put it this way: If Billy and the Werewolves can figure out closing surface wounds just like that [ admittedly, Billy's got an engineering degree or something similar IIRC, but he's younger than Dresden and Dresden is basically a kid compared to other wizards ], how come Listens-to-Wind, a shapeshifter, a shaman, a doctor with a LIST of university degrees, with centuries of experience never even considered that? [ I'm expecting some kind of retconning here in the future ]
That's not "difficult healing in the Dresdenverse", that's a worldbuilding/character design flaw. Either Billy and the Werewolves never should have been able to figure it out or Listens-to-Wind is nerfed beyond a bad patch of World of Warcraft levels.
I think Harry would have a lot of trouble with crafting healing items. I don't know how they could be made to function reliably, with predictable (identical, repeatable) results.
Ok, let's start:
Magic does business with physics. Or to quote an expert "Fire, summoned with magic, is still fire! Murph."
Dresden can use magic to manipulate energy. Yes, he calls them "Fire magic","Air magic","Earth magic","Water magic", etc. But once he declares that he's basically just handling physics, it's simply a different application of what he already knows. And I'd imagine it should be hell of a lot simpler to use the magic to guide the energies than it is to conjure up fire. [ and yes, if you're wondering by now, I did study STEM >.> ]
Therefore once Dresden starts understanding magic well enough to craft his 2nd bracelet, he's pretty much also capable to create the same effect as an MRI machine. And since he's receiving a direct feedback via magic, the "resolution" or in other words "the amount of data", shouldn't be an issue. He's literally feeling the magic, how it responds to fluctuations and similar.
The only one who we've met who is confirmed to be capable of anything like it is Listens-to-Wind, but (evidently) it can't do things like mend broken bones (Luccio certainly should have been healed, right?)
Nah, Billy stops bleeding from a knife wound after Marcone throws said knife at him in the "Aftermath". He gets a scar, but the wound does close up. Billy doesn't have much magical power and definitely doesn't have much experience to "feel" the difference the way Dresden does.
The Leanansidhe heals Harry in Blood Moon. Mab repairs Harry's broken back. There are possibly a few more instances when a character is affected in this manner, but they are there.
Even a necromancer, a wizard-level talent with power over life and death, was only able to prevent a dying man from dying. She was able to anchor his life to his body, right?
Yup. Necromancy can't be used for healing. But it is great for making sure the patient doesn't die until he gets healed.
Cuz you can't see inside someone's body, right? Imagine if Harry tried to close up an internal wound with magic. He'd probably end up ripping more holes open.
You're thinking about using magic like using a hammer or an axe, possibly tweezers and similar. Yet we by now know very well that Dresden doesn't require line of sight to cast a spell and depending on the spell, he also receives feedback on whether the spell landed or not [ Proven Guilty, tracking spell on where Harry sent the fetches after knowing that the spell has hit the target over a fairly large distance ]. Therefore applying magic to redirect moving energies, including receiving proper feedback [ magic is the Power of Life, after all ], there's basically 0 likelihood that Dresden would cause cancer. Whether he rips something apart or not depends solely on his level of fine control. And while we know that Dresden keeps saying that he doesn't have very fine control, we're not talking about editing DNA. We're talking about "fusing back together parts that were originally one", so I'm pretty sure that Thaumaturgy would cover a lot on this topic, one way or the other.
How about an extra enchantment on his duster that worked like his force rings, except they channeled the energy into a kinetic shield instead?
Well... this is not nearly as simple as you're making it sound.
What you're talking about is a combination of several spells into a single enchantement with at least two active components:
- a radar-like spell to constantly monitor close surroundings for signs of approaching energies
- a Friend-or-Foe recognition spell that can recognize incoming energy as non-malevolent.
Therefore Dresden would get pretty much worn out after wearing it for some length of time.
But the idea might be pretty sound for training to increase his magic capacity.
Or toss around those Mind Fog dealies (which is apparently not a violation of the Laws of Magic if Butters does it?)
Butters is not a member of the White Council and I'm pretty sure that the laws of magic don't apply to him. Especially since he's not using his own magic, however he's fueling his gadgets. And the laws say that you're not supposed to use magic to do those things. In pure theory, if we got a Doctor Who x Dresden crossover and Dresden would travel in time via TARDIS, he didn't break the laws of magic.
And: Yeah, by now you'd think that Dresden turned his Silver bear charm into a bunch of tiny magic grenades. I mean: The guy was fighting in a war. He's a nerd with a serious hatred towards the Red court. You don't get more Ka-boom than that.
Hell! A whole arsenal of weapons would be more accurate. People living in peaceful parts of the world don't understand that people who live in conflict really start appreciating simple things in life. LIKE SURVIVING!!! And they also tend to err on the side of caution and arm up. Really, really, REALLY arm themselves to the teeth.
He has a limited market for magical items. And anything he can make so can any other wizard. And most of them don't have a full time gig saving the world.
Oh, I'm not suggesting he sells the magic items for profit. I'm saying: craft more tools to make your life easier. You know? Pragmatic approach to life? Something you'd expect from someone who went through the foster system and had to learn to rely on himself first and foremost?
Although, I'm pretty certain that he could be making and selling some protective charms to ward off ghosts and stuff like that.
..whew. Now there's a wall of text.
I apologize for having worn out your eyeballs this much. I promise that after tonight I'm staying away from the forum for some time again ;D
-
I don't think one can craft magical healing items, if one could, Listens to Wind would have them. He doesn't, he learned his the old fashioned way, in medical school.. The Fae are different, they have the power if they want to use it.
-
Course, letting Harry fumble around in the dark is a pretty stupid idea so I don't get why they don't just be a bit straighter with him.
If by "they" you mean the various powers involved in Harry's life (Eb, the Gatekeeper, Mab, Uriel, etc.) I think it's to steer what Harry does and (except in Uriel's case) that they don't want him to be more powerful than he needs to be to do what they want him to do.
The "in the know" members of the White Council aren't sure which way Harry is going to go (I think that's why Eb is so reluctant to tell him anything about being Starborn until his life's on the line), Mab is apparently wary of Harry (there is a WOJ that things were bad in Faerie last time something like this happened and "Mab is keeping her enemies closer"), etc.
Let me put it this way: If Billy and the Werewolves can figure out closing surface wounds just like that [ admittedly, Billy's got an engineering degree or something similar IIRC, but he's younger than Dresden and Dresden is basically a kid compared to other wizards ], how come Listens-to-Wind, a shapeshifter, a shaman, a doctor with a LIST of university degrees, with centuries of experience never even considered that? [ I'm expecting some kind of retconning here in the future ]
Self vs. others, I think. Listens-to-Wind can turn himself into all kinds of animals, he could certainly close his own wounds, IMO.
But doing that kind of magic on others... much harder.
The Second Law probably also has made the White Council very leery of experimenting much with biological magic on others beyond the basics (much as White Council mental training was extremely rudimentary before recent events).
The Leanansidhe heals Harry in Blood Moon. Mab repairs Harry's broken back. There are possibly a few more instances when a character is affected in this manner, but they are there.
These are incredibly powerful entities, far beyond the scale of even the Senior Council. Lea is second to Mab, stronger than the Winter Lady, and she killed two Lords of Outer Night (beings that Odin calls "mostly retired gods") with one spell.
And: Yeah, by now you'd think that Dresden turned his Silver bear charm into a bunch of tiny magic grenades. I mean: The guy was fighting in a war. He's a nerd with a serious hatred towards the Red court. You don't get more Ka-boom than that.
Well, I think the force rings were his version of that. Magic grenades would be too uncontrollable, Harry is extremely wary of the First Law. The force rings let him modulate the force so he can just "pull the punch" rather than deliver a lethal blow against mortals.
Also, there's a WoJ that the items Harry had (pre-Changes when he had a full set) were all he had the time to maintain. He can't just keep adding more stuff and keep all his old stuff working.
-
It occurs to me that at least my first question is now partially answered (thanks to Eb practically shoving it down his throat) and Harry's reaction is "the timing isn't right!" as though that's the reason he hasn't been asking...
Unfortunately, we didn't get the whole story and of course Harry won't bother looking into it until the next character decides Harry should know.
Sadly 2 is unanswered still, and 3 is teased at (elemental chaos etc). But still mostly nothing. A few teases to the rest but by and large still in the dark.
-
The "in the know" members of the White Council aren't sure which way Harry is going to go (I think that's why Eb is so reluctant to tell him anything about being Starborn until his life's on the line), Mab is apparently wary of Harry (there is a WOJ that things were bad in Faerie last time something like this happened and "Mab is keeping her enemies closer"), etc.
Apparently there are many who know exactly what Harry is. Rivershoulders called him star born, and alluded to the fact that the nature of what that means Harry apparently has to find out for himself when the time is right. Eb said the same thing essentially in their battle with the cornerhounds. Mab wouldn't regard Harry as an enemy, remember her main job is to keep the Gates safe from Outsiders.
-
Hell! A whole arsenal of weapons would be more accurate. People living in peaceful parts of the world don't understand that people who live in conflict really start appreciating simple things in life. LIKE SURVIVING!!! And they also tend to err on the side of caution and arm up. Really, really, REALLY arm themselves to the teeth.
I live in a peaceful low crime neighborhood. I have a semiautomatic rifle and handgun for each member of my household suited for self defense and I don't know how much ammo and ammo components. And then there's all the other stuff because I wanted it.
Also, there's a WoJ that the items Harry had (pre-Changes when he had a full set) were all he had the time to maintain. He can't just keep adding more stuff and keep all his old stuff working.
There's also stuff from the books that if he had more money and/or experience, he'd need less time to maintain it. Oh look, he has more of both.
-
I live in a peaceful low crime neighborhood. I have a semiautomatic rifle and handgun for each member of my household suited for self defense and I don't know how much ammo and ammo components. And then there's all the other stuff because I wanted it.
Well, as you said, you wanted it. Other people can be different. (I understand that USA is particular about weapons, and Harry is from USA)
-
My point is just that it doesn't take the situation Harry is in to end up with an arsenal. If I was in a situation like Harry, I'd invest a lot more than I do or he does in weapons. In my case, I don't think I'll ever need to use any of it for anything other than recreation, but it's like having insurance that's fun and resellable.
-
My point is just that it doesn't take the situation Harry is in to end up with an arsenal. If I was in a situation like Harry, I'd invest a lot more than I do or he does in weapons. In my case, I don't think I'll ever need to use any of it for anything other than recreation, but it's like having insurance that's fun and resellable.
Hope they are well locked up, it can end badly..
-
My point is just that it doesn't take the situation Harry is in to end up with an arsenal. If I was in a situation like Harry, I'd invest a lot more than I do or he does in weapons. In my case, I don't think I'll ever need to use any of it for anything other than recreation, but it's like having insurance that's fun and resellable.
Well, Harry is not you. He may react differently.
-
I live in a peaceful low crime neighborhood. I have a semiautomatic rifle and handgun for each member of my household suited for self defense and I don't know how much ammo and ammo components. And then there's all the other stuff because I wanted it.
I've managed to reach 68 and never felt the need to own one. And I lived in poorer neighborhoods. However to each their own. Oddly enough I moved to what would be considered a nicer neighbor and someone got murdered right behind my condo. With a knife. Toodles.
-
I've managed to reach 68 and never felt the need to own one. And I lived in poorer neighborhoods. However to each their own. Oddly enough I moved to what would be considered a nicer neighbor and someone got murdered right behind my condo. With a knife. Toodles.
Then there are the accidents with them and the suicides. They are useful, and they can be fun if one goes in for that, but one should never lose sight that these things are deadly.
-
Returning to the original question:
To Mab, regarding the Winter Mantle: May I please read the manual?
To Uriel, regarding Soulfire: May I please read the manual?
To Hades, regarding the "weapons": May I please read the manual?
Just saying.
-
Returning to the original question:
To Mab, regarding the Winter Mantle: May I please read the manual?
To Uriel, regarding Soulfire: May I please read the manual?
To Hades, regarding the "weapons": May I please read the manual?
Just saying.
Collective answer, "There isn't a manual, you can read the instructions on-line!"
Harry, "Crap! I'm a wizard. I cannot get on-line..."
Collective answer; "That isn't our problem, deal with it!"
-
Apparently there are many who know exactly what Harry is. Rivershoulders called him star born, and alluded to the fact that the nature of what that means Harry apparently has to find out for himself when the time is right. Eb said the same thing essentially in their battle with the cornerhounds. Mab wouldn't regard Harry as an enemy, remember her main job is to keep the Gates safe from Outsiders.
No, Mab definitely sees Harry as an enemy. He welds power that she cannot. He is immune to outsider influence, so if he should wish to, he could summon outsiders. It is one of the reasons why she wanted him as the WK. She can now kill him with her own hands when she has decided that he has served his purpose.
-
No, Mab definitely sees Harry as an enemy. He welds power that she cannot. He is immune to outsider influence, so if he should wish to, he could summon outsiders. It is one of the reasons why she wanted him as the WK. She can now kill him with her own hands when she has decided that he has served his purpose.
I doubt that she sees him as an enemy, she needs him. I think Mab is misunderstood because she is cold, doesn't compromise, and usually shows no mercy. However she has a tough job to do and she has been successful at it for a thousand years.
-
I doubt that she sees him as an enemy, she needs him. I think Mab is misunderstood because she is cold, doesn't compromise, and usually shows no mercy. However she has a tough job to do and she has been successful at it for a thousand years.
Unless Jim changed his tune, I swear he said that Mab sees him as an enemy. An enemy she can use as a weapon, but an enemy nonetheless.
-
Unless Jim changed his tune, I swear he said that Mab sees him as an enemy. An enemy she can use as a weapon, but an enemy nonetheless.
No, I don't think so, I think Mab was in on Harry's conception as a star born. There is a reason why Lea is his godmother, I don't believe that would happen unless Mab consented to it. Do you have the WOJ on that?
-
No, it was in one of the book signing videos on YouTube from years ago. Don't remember which one. Also, being that it was from years ago, he could have changed his tune on the relationship between Mab and Harry.
-
No, it was in one of the book signing videos on YouTube from years ago. Don't remember which one. Also, being that it was from years ago, he could have changed his tune on the relationship between Mab and Harry.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_DcWwAtEiw&feature=youtu.be&t=1673
-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_DcWwAtEiw&feature=youtu.be&t=1673
Actually I think that answer is inconclusive. Titania, yes, he says she is nervous about Harry, but Mab is keeping her enemies close. I'd argue that yeah, that holds true for the books, Titania, she has never gotten over Aurora's death, or that Harry engineered it. Nor apparently is she getting along with Mab, they aren't speaking as of Peace Talks. Mab, I think is a little more complicated, and it is reflected in the books. We know she plays four dimensional chess, and this is how she may be playing Harry, "keep your friends close, but your enemies closer" type thing. However that isn't exactly how she is treating Harry these days as she comes to respect him. I think there was a turning point when she exposed the glimmer of vulnerable humanity in her when Maeve died to him.
But as Kringle said, there is a lot of pride in that creature. No, I doubt that they will ever become friends, Mab doesn't make friends, but I really don't think they are enemies either. Even Harry is coming around, there are glimmers of that in Peace Talks, that Mab isn't all evil or his enemy. Perhaps Molly's influence has something to do with that, and Rashid as well, Mab has a really difficult vital job to do and she doesn't suffer fools.
-
As Lea put it, she (as Mab's right-hand woman no less) is a "Trusted enemy", that's kinda just how Mab rolls. She doesn't do Allies/Friends.
I think of it as the Sauron problem. Sauron lost because in the end he couldn't envision a world where his enemies would want to destroy the Ring, instead of using it, because that's what Sauron would do.
Mab assumes that everyone is an enemy, because she assumes that everyone would act the way that she would, and she would be waiting in the wings for an opportunity to shank the big bitch in the Prison Yard.
-
As Lea put it, she (as Mab's right-hand woman no less) is a "Trusted enemy", that's kinda just how Mab rolls. She doesn't do Allies/Friends.
I think of it as the Sauron problem. Sauron lost because in the end he couldn't envision a world where his enemies would want to destroy the Ring, instead of using it, because that's what Sauron would do.
Mab assumes that everyone is an enemy, because she assumes that everyone would act the way that she would, and she would be waiting in the wings for an opportunity to shank the big bitch in the Prison Yard.
The reasoning works, but Sauron was evil, his view that everyone desired to dominate everyone else, thus desired the One Ring that Ruled Them All, and could be corrupted by that power. Many were, but he lost because a small handful did not desire that power. Mab can be ruthless and cruel, but that is what Winter is, however she isn't evil. I think Harry has viewed her as an enemy, or his enemy because he is afraid of her and never understood her. I think he is still afraid of her, but I also think he is beginning to understand her better.
-
I mean, she's totally evil though? She's not just evil, granted, but she is still (sometimes pointlessly) cruel, power-hungry, utterly ruthless, and entirely willing to do profoundly monstrous things in the name of her cause. Like, if Mab wasn't evil, we wouldn't need to have an entire Faction sitting in the wings with loaded shotguns watching her 24/7.
Not that she's required to be so for my argument anyway. She just needs to view everyone as just as power-hungry and ruthless as her- which she does.
I mean, just look at her views on Harry's relationship with Molly.
If you want to argue that Harry may come to consider her something other then an enemy, then sure, but we're talking about Mab, not Harry.
-
I mean, she's totally evil though? She's not just evil, granted, but she is still (sometimes pointlessly) cruel, power-hungry, utterly ruthless, and entirely willing to do profoundly monstrous things in the name of her cause. Like, if Mab wasn't evil, we wouldn't need to have an entire Faction sitting in the wings with loaded shotguns watching her 24/7.
No, she is Winter, a force of nature, and she is necessary. I wouldn't call her power hungry, she hasn't crossed the line at the Stone Table. Would you have your enemy guarding the gates that keeps realmonsters out? Mab and her army does.
-
No, she is Winter, a force of nature, and she is necessary. I wouldn't call her power hungry, she hasn't crossed the line at the Stone Table. Would you have your enemy guarding the gates that keeps real monsters out? Mab and her army does.
So, because she's "Not as bad as the literal reality consuming eldritch horrors from beyond the stars" she's a good guy? Is that really your argument? Like, yeah, she's a necessary evil, but "Necessary Evil" is a two-part description, you know?
I mean Nick is also Anti-Outsider, but I don't see anyone arguing that he's actually just a misunderstood good guy probably because his Ass isn't as Phat.
Like, remember when Harry tries to call her out for hurting him after he refuses to do one of her favours, and she tells him that she didn't do it to coerce him, she just hurt him for spite?
Remember what she did to her last Knight? That went well beyond the realm of "Necessary" and into torture for tortures sake.
Like, she is literally the Queen of Evil Faeries.
Mab is a lot deeper then she initially appears, but that doesn't make her a Hero. She's a Villain that is pointed in a direction that benefits the universe.
-
The white god terrorized Job and his family, killed everybody on Earth except for some old guy on a boat, killed the firstborn of Egypt and rained fire down on a city killing everybody. He/she then turned a person who disobeyed him by looking back at it into a pillar of salt. Oh, and lest I forget, he/she sends you to burn in hell for an eternity if he/she doesn't appreciate that you blew him/her the bird at the Christmas party. Clearly we need to be careful in the way we use the word evil when we talk about Gods and Monsters.
-
The white god terrorized Job and his family, killed everybody on Earth except for some old guy on a boat, killed the firstborn of Egypt and rained fire down on a city killing everybody. He/she then turned a person who disobeyed him by looking back at it into a pillar of salt. Oh, and lest I forget, he/she sends you to burn in hell for an eternity if he/she doesn't appreciate that you blew him/her the bird at the Christmas party. Clearly we need to be careful in the way we use the word evil when we talk about Gods and Monsters.
Yup, Mab is a force of nature, at times she can be very cruel, but is she any more cruel than the God described in the Old Testament?. I agree, she isn't, nor is she evil, she does what she thinks must be done to keep the world safe from the Outside. That can be cruel, and it can be ruthless, maybe if star born Harry does win in the BAT, she can begin to be merciful, if she survives it. Summer is also a force of nature, she can be cruel also. Would you call Titania evil? She appears sweet and warm but she has shown herself to be every bit as vindictive as Mab ever was. Titania knows that her daughter had to die because she was infected, yet in her grief she tries to get revenge. The Mothers live side by side in harmony, crusty old Mother Winter who plays with meat cleavers and has spit that will burn holes in floors and sweet old apple cheeked Mother Summer, but don't be fooled by the sweetness.
-
Just my 2 cents. I believe Mab began considering Harry an enemy but I think that has slowly changed, and I don't mean because she succeeded in making him his WK but just because spending time with him. Harry has an effect on people and I think in this case Mab is included.
-
Just my 2 cents. I believe Mab began considering Harry an enemy but I think that has slowly changed, and I don't mean because she succeeded in making him his WK but just because spending time with him. Harry has an effect on people and I think in this case Mab is included.
I wouldn't disagree with that, I also think she has had some effect on him, he says as much in Peace Talks. Not in doing evil, but in getting what he wants to achieve. As in he thinks he is doing one thing, but the effect is something totally different and what he really wanted in the first place, it helped him to outwit Lara. He even admitted, "Maybe I've been hanging out too much with Mab.."
-
Yes, I agree about that.
-
Hope they are well locked up, it can end badly..
In transport, use, or the safe. Honestly, it's the things that no one worries about someone getting their little hands on that end causing the most harm. There's a reason big buckets have that picture on them.
Well, Harry is not you. He may react differently.
When it comes to guns, he's more like me than not. Though I admit I'm much more like Murphy here than Harry. Harry has already owned more guns than most people ever will. He carries. He recognizes their utility and knows the rules. He does take interest in weird and neat firearms/ammo.
I've managed to reach 68 and never felt the need to own one. And I lived in poorer neighborhoods. However to each their own. Oddly enough I moved to what would be considered a nicer neighbor and someone got murdered right behind my condo. With a knife. Toodles.
How many times has your door been kicked in ... by monsters?
And that's my point. You don't need constant danger to be prepared for danger. Premise 1: An interest and an excuse is more than good enough. Premise 2: Harry has an interest in magical items. Premise 3: He has an excuse to make a bunch of cool magical items. Conclusion: Harry should have an arsenal.
-
Three teenagers drove through the front wall of my home last year. Does that count?
In any case, Harry did have an arsenal. A sword of the cross, a staff, blasting rod, force rings, that nifty shield bracelet, his coat, a 44 Magnum, a shotgun, a temple dog and Little Chicago. Not to mention a talking skull, various illegal substances and that nifty little summoning circle. Plus his redoubt in the Rent a Shed place.
-
In transport, use, or the safe. Honestly, it's the things that no one worries about someone getting their little hands on that end causing the most harm. There's a reason big buckets have that picture on them.
Never let your guard down, when you think they are at the safest, they aren't. Trust me on that, and not one should ever witness the result.
-
Three teenagers drove through the front wall of my home last year. Does that count?
In any case, Harry did have an arsenal. A sword of the cross, a staff, blasting rod, force rings, that nifty shield bracelet, his coat, a 44 Magnum, a shotgun, a temple dog and Little Chicago. Not to mention a talking skull, various illegal substances and that nifty little summoning circle. Plus his redoubt in the Rent a Shed place.
You need to up your wards. There's a house in my hometown that has reflectors on their fence because of how often cars ended up in their front yard. I can't remember if more than one ended up in their living room.
Unless you have a .50cal, guns are unlikely to be of assistance in that situation.
I'm ready for him to have another better arsenal. Crafted by him. I'm not counting anything given to him.
Never let your guard down, when you think they are at the safest, they aren't. Trust me on that, and not one should ever witness the result.
I've seen the result. Wasn't anyone I ever knew, but it's still not fun. Honestly, I'm much more worried about the non-firearm dangers they introduce themselves to. The oldest tried to antagonize an alligator. There were kids I grew up with who did that sort of thing and turned out fine with all their fingers and toes, but they knew what they were doing. My niece, not so much.
-
I've seen the result. Wasn't anyone I ever knew, but it's still not fun. Honestly, I'm much more worried about the non-firearm dangers they introduce themselves to. The oldest tried to antagonize an alligator. There were kids I grew up with who did that sort of thing and turned out fine with all their fingers and toes, but they knew what they were doing. My niece, not so much.
Well, some children get lucky and we all did stupid things growing up, and were lucky.. Some aren't so lucky, I like the idea of taking the kids hunting, then a kid understands when you shoot something dead, it doesn't come back alive again..
-
Yeah, I think it's best to slowly introduce children to controlled danger. Otherwise they recklessly taunt alligators and think it's fine.
-
@Bad Alias
It was about 2AM and I was asleep 15 feet to one side. However I upped my game and moved into a condo on a cul de sac. And I am on the back side of my building away from the street.
What would he need to make an arsenal? Wait for it,............ his workshop?
-
What would he need to make an arsenal? Wait for it,............ his workshop?
Dun dun dun!
@Bad Alias
It was about 2AM and I was asleep 15 feet to one side.
That had to be exciting.