The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Blood Rites foreshadowing
Mira:
--- Quote from: LordDresden2 on March 05, 2025, 06:10:40 AM ---My only problem with that idea is that it has a lot of moving parts that have to play out just right. Sort of like the theory that Martin wanted Harry and Susan to get together in Death Masks.
Yeah, LR, Lara, Nicodemus, Marcone, Mab, Martin, etc. are all chessmasters, but there are still limits to how far ahead they can calculate and how many moving parts they can juggle. If Justine has been nemfected all along, that would mean lots of opportunities for someone to detect it. Suppose a rival WV offs Thomas and claims Justine? Suppose some circumstance forced her to handle a Sword? If Harry is her target in LR's plot, suppose he happens to be with Rashid at some point when she's near him?
That's a lot of variables that he just can't control.
--- End quote ---
I think it very possible that Justine could go along neminfected and no one notice it. Why? Because like Voldermort, no one was even saying the name. Harry had to force a name, Nemesis, out of Titania and even Mother Summer and Mother Winter do not speak the name, they call it the "Enemy." So it lurks in the shadows unnoticed, even when he is well aware of Nemesis, Harry cannot spot that Justine is possessed by an Outsider until she nearly kills him to gain access to Demonreach. Don't you think it just a bit odd that Justine is "insane" and is set up to be the lover/kine for Thomas by Lord Raith and becomes "cured" because Thomas was feeding off of her emotions and this leveled things out? It just died away not to return when he wasn't feeding?
Here is a very telling point I think. Justine and Thomas had true love, once that happened he couldn't touch her unless she wore a rubber suit to protect him from being burned.. It wasn't until she had sex with another that that changed and then she could have sex once more with Thomas.. However if it was always that simple, why didn't she do it sooner? I mean she waits until the end of Ghost Story when Harry was thought to be dead!
g33k:
--- Quote from: Mira on March 05, 2025, 07:06:36 AM --- ... he couldn't touch her unless she wore a rubber suit to protect him from being burned.. It wasn't until she had sex with another that that changed and then she could have sex once more with Thomas.. However if it was always that simple, why didn't she do it sooner? ...
--- End quote ---
This bothers me, too.
Not just with the Thomas/Justine: why TF is this (obvious) method not part of the toolkit that every whampire knows??!?
They use sex for feeding their Hunger... but also as a critical tool for political power.
They're used to thinking of sex, and sexual permutations, as tools.
They have zero expectations of sexual fidelity: each Whampire has multiple kine, and many kine get passed around amongst the Whamps; gifted, loaned, traded, &c.
They know of "sex outside of love" as the "magic key" to get past the "True Love" protections.
They should know "have willing, friendly sex to break TL protections" and then renew said protections (when they make love to their TL) as the way to move forward.
Mira:
--- Quote ---They know of "sex outside of love" as the "magic key" to get past the "True Love" protections.
They should know "have willing, friendly sex to break TL protections" and then renew said protections (when they make love to their TL) as the way to move forward.
--- End quote ---
Yes, and supposedly Justine and Thomas had true love over several books and short stories because Thomas mentions it. So what gives? Oh here is another one that doesn't quite fit, unless I am not remembering it correctly, in Blood Rites Justine supposedly was willing to sacrifice herself to save Thomas, an act of true love, right? But because of his true love for her, Thomas stopped short of killing her in order to save himself.. So why didn't he just burn up?
forumghost:
--- Quote from: Mira on February 27, 2025, 05:34:24 PM ---I concur with this theory.. It fits with my theory that Justine had been infested from the beginning. Lord Raith knows full well who the half brother of Thomas is, he may even know what Harry is, so Justine infected thrown together with Thomas as a way to control him. Also knowing that Thomas and Harry will get together at some point so eventually a way to get at Harry. And as we saw at the end of Battleground it almost worked.
--- End quote ---
According to Blood Rites, Lord Raith somehow didn't know who the half-brother of Thomas was until he spied them discussing it in his mansion. Otherwise he no doubt would have tried to kill Harry earlier.
--- Quote from: g33k on March 06, 2025, 02:41:23 AM ---This bothers me, too.
Not just with the Thomas/Justine: why TF is this (obvious) method not part of the toolkit that every whampire knows??!?
They use sex for feeding their Hunger... but also as a critical tool for political power.
They're used to thinking of sex, and sexual permutations, as tools.
They have zero expectations of sexual fidelity: each Whampire has multiple kine, and many kine get passed around amongst the Whamps; gifted, loaned, traded, &c.
They know of "sex outside of love" as the "magic key" to get past the "True Love" protections.
They should know "have willing, friendly sex to break TL protections" and then renew said protections (when they make love to their TL) as the way to move forward.
--- End quote ---
Remember, the White Court thought that Thomas was a freak for loving a human in the first place- kinda like how people would look at a man that married a cow.
Love is not, broadly speaking, a thing that the White Court do.
g33k:
--- Quote from: forumghost on April 06, 2025, 06:31:43 PM --- ... Remember, the White Court thought that Thomas was a freak for loving a human in the first place- kinda like how people would look at a man that married a cow.
Love is not, broadly speaking, a thing that the White Court do.
--- End quote ---
I don't know that "freak" is the right term (I only recall that term being the Whampire term for wizards).
Unusual, for sure!
But they know the phenomenon -- protection via Love -- well.
And they know how to bypass it, if they really need to get to someone protected: get one of their more-attractive Kine to seduce the protected victim; if needs be, they can apply their (non-contact) lust-enhancing mojo until the victim is "willing:" being in Love doesn't mean being immune to the Whamp-mojo of heightened arousal.
If you aren't being all emo & addicted to the tragedy of the thing, Justine's solution seems kind of obvious; particularly from the POV of "sex is a tool" Whampires.
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