The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Harry and the semi-immortal shapeshifter
vincentric:
If Harry want to become a freeholding lord, I'm sure he could get Mab and Lara to sign for him. But why bother? He'd already be the Winter Knight and the consort of the White Queen. Why take on the extra work?
The_Sibelis:
--- Quote from: Melriken on May 03, 2023, 06:28:42 PM ---No, the last time around it was a mortal that was put in charge of the defense of the Outer Gates and that mortal was transformed into Fey and created the entire Fey Courts for the purpose.
--- End quote ---
na, Before Mab was the original Winter Queen iirc, who was an actual fae. It's been hinted at that Toots size progression was similar in how the sidhe formed. If we're going to talk abtthe cycle and it's constant inversion tho.. if we consider Mab that last cycle, then a human was elevated to a known position. This time said human should be outright making said position.
--- Quote ---Humans won't be put in charge of the outer gates, whoever ends up in charge of them will stop being human. That probably is Harry... but he won't be human in that case, he will be something else.
The story starts with "My name is Harry Blackstone Copperfield Dresden, conjure by it at your own risk"... he doesn't end up human.
--- End quote ---
Snark Knight:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on May 04, 2023, 08:40:42 AM ---I don't see Wizard of Chicago as a mantle. Why should only Chicago get one? Where is his domain? Marcone's lands? Demonreach is the White council's prison, not Harry's.
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I don't think Demonreach is the White Council's, actually. Just because Merlin made it doesn't mean they've kept up continuous control over it. They failed to prevent one of their worst enemies, Kemmler, from becoming one of the more recent Wardens, and they basically view any of their members taking up the Warden mantle with actual knowledge of what they're doing as tantamount to an act of rebellion and declaration of war on the Council.
Basically the few of them who are aware of Demonreach at all want it kept dormant. It's not much of a claim. Now that they've kicked Harry out, announcing himself as Warden is probably his best claim to being an independent power. Now, is that a good idea? Probably not - it would draw the attention of any nasties who haven't already realized he's the Warden.
g33k:
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on May 04, 2023, 08:40:42 AM --- I don't see Wizard of Chicago as a mantle. Why should only Chicago get one? Where is his domain? Marcone's lands?
--- End quote ---
"Wizard of Chicago" could be a mantle... eventually. It isn't now.
A mantle would have to be created (or form naturally... the genesis of a new Mantle is AFAIK nowhere described, neither in the canonical stories nor WoJ; but I think Harry "raising a banner" in BG is a hint both as to how a "Mantle" might form, and Harry's suitability as a foundational figure).
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on May 04, 2023, 08:40:42 AM --- Demonreach is the White council's prison, not Harry's.
--- End quote ---
No, the relationship between Demonreach & the Warden is its own thing. I don't doubt the WC would love to claim it as "theirs," but it isn't.
My own WAG is that it's the other way around: the prison/well is the critical and most-important element. The White Council was created as an adjunct to the prison, and the Warden. They are, after all, a Council. By the very definition of the word, they are councilors -- advisors; but to whom? To "the Merlin?" I think not: when decisions are made, "the Merlin" gets an equal vote (much as "the Gatekeeper" does).
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on May 04, 2023, 08:40:42 AM --- And i doubt Molly AND Mab can sign for him - it is likely not the individual who signs, it is their realm that they sign FOR. Biden does not sign a treaty for Joe, he signs for the US. Mab signs for Winter. Molly is subsidiary for Mab, she does not sign. The Lady signing as herself is like the Blackstaff signing for himself, not for the White Council.
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Agreed. Any signatory to the Accords can only sign once; you cannot have 2 people from the same signatory.
--- Quote from: Ed0517 on May 04, 2023, 08:40:42 AM --- Harry is likely still considered under two signatories, the WC and Winter. They won't give him another flag. (yes, under the White Council - recall the challenge in the deeps - even the White king said the minor practitioners landed under the White Council's sphere though they were not members of it.
--- End quote ---
Disagreed. Harry is no longer WC, they kicked him out. The WC certainly won't be honoring his signture as a WC rep under the Accords!
They are of course obligated to honor if he signs as Winter (and one of the 3 Winter Queens doesn't repudiate it).
Conspiracy Theorist:
Not going to be a Mantle - it’s a Title, a Mantle is very different - an intangible construct of power. Where would Harry get the power to create a Mantle? The knowledge? Is someone else going to make it for him? He would then be beholden to them.
As I have theorised it is actually more likely that he is able to undertake a sanctum invocation with a nascent genius loci of Chicago. Chicago is one of the great characters of the series, it has already been manifested as as avatar through Little Chicago, and the creation and destruction of that Avatar must have led to something perhaps the creation or waking up of a genius loci. That may also finally explain who fixed Little Chicago - Big Chicago did.
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