The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

Winter Lady Restrictions

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Mira:

--- Quote from: vincentric on October 08, 2022, 03:49:47 AM ---Deception can take many forms, lying is just the most blatant.

--- End quote ---

  Perhaps, but that is the point isn't it? You don't have to lie to be dishonest, which Mab and most Fae are.  The lie of omission is perhaps the worst, because every word said can be the truth, but if an important part is left out, it is not true.  A lie never passes her lips so Mab and other Fae can say they cannot tell a lie, all the while, and we've seen her do it, Mab leaves things out when she bargains all the time.. Ergo if you bargain with her and company, be careful, because you might not be getting what you think you are getting.  In their mind, since the actual lie never crosses their lips, they do not lie, though they do it all of the time by omission.  Mab even admits to it freely with a reminder that she cannot lie, then smugly explains to the poor mortal that they neglected to ask a or b so got screwed in the deal.

LostInTime:
The fae can also tell the truth from a certain point of view. Mab could say that Hitler was a great hero. Despite the commonly held point of view that he was a monster. To an ardent Nazi he was a hero. Truth from a certain point of view.

Fae restrictions in general are, guest rite, tell the truth, equal exchange, iron vulnerability (really a vulnerability to mortal workings), bargains, oaths or exchanges, asking three times is a binding, summoning rituals (binding if you know the fae's true name).

Winter Law seems to (so far) be restricted to not killing mortals uninvolved with the fae, and accepting an enemy's surrender. In return for good treatment that enemy must act as your vassal until they are ransomed back to their lord.

g33k:

--- Quote from: LostInTime on October 08, 2022, 03:05:18 PM --- ... equal exchange ...
--- End quote ---
I think this one isn't reliable.  As noted above, the fae delight in making "bargains" where the mortal gets far less/worse than they expected out of the deal... and often, pay a far worse price.


--- Quote from: LostInTime on October 08, 2022, 03:05:18 PM --- ... iron vulnerability (really a vulnerability to mortal workings) ...
--- End quote ---
Similarly, I don't think the fae are generally vulnerable to "mortal workings" ... Mab as "Ms. Sommerset" had no problem magic'ing her way though Harry's locked door (presumably the knob&c were brass).  Mab rode in a high-tech elevator at Marcone's building, at the beginning of Skin Game.  Lady Molly appears to use a cellphone.

And I suspect the Svartalves -- and maybe a few others -- do not share the general Faerie iron-vulnerability; so you can't count on it.

LostInTime:
They are vulnerable to mortal workings. That's the reason iron and steel are extra-fatal to them. Even so far as paralyzing them when immortal fae are penetrated by it. Way back in Death Masks (?) Harry dumped reality powder of Lea, which was mostly made of depleted uranium powder, and it burned the crap out of her.

The reason why Molly can use high tech is that the mantle has either suspended her mortal magic, transformed it into fae magic, or somehow overriden her Murphyonic field. There is precedent. Harry and Molly used to sit inside a circle to have their magic contained if they wanted to watch a movie with their friends or family. Perhaps the mantle does the same thing, traps her magic inside her body somehow and applies a skin of the mantle's magic over her.

Equal exchange is part of balancing the scales. E.G. Butters removing the rebar from Mab's neck during the Battle of Chicago. He was not bound to do so by contract or treaty. Once she was back on her feet she offered him a favor to balance their scales. Even when Harry, as the Warden of Demonreach, bound Ethniu, he was then able to bind Lady Molly to pay for all the medical aid and funeral for Chicago. Because the Warden is not bound to Winter or a signatory of the Accords. By binding Ethniu, he put Winter in his debt. Ethniu was Winter and Accorded nation's enemy. Winter had to balance the scales with the Warden.

Mab passing through Harry's threshold was a matter of guest rite. Since she was not offering him any harm, she was behaving within guest rite and allowed to enter without permission. Though, as we saw in The Law from Harry's perspective, most of her power was probably left outside.

The Svartalves made Harry's upgraded ring in his workshop. Which was copper, silver and iron, combined into one ring. He had to pay a premium for them to work with iron. I thought he'd lost it in Changes, but it was still there in PT. But, per WOJ, not everything native to the Never Never is vulnerable to iron. (At least not vulnerable beyond the usual, like being cut by a steel sword)

vincentric:
I mostly agree except the exchange of Favors doesn't have to be equal. If you were to use a Favor from the fae on something trivial(say a doughnut) it would be a settled debt. As long as each delivers on what's asked, all is well.

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