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Ferrovax Identity - crazy theory

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Griffyn612:

--- Quote from: Avernite on July 11, 2021, 05:24:30 PM ---(Running) Water also has some anti-magic properties, so Hydrax or Aquax could work.

And Hydrax sounds a lot like Hydra...

--- End quote ---
Water is good, but in the series it's mostly been seen used against wizards. Have we seen it used against anyone else?


--- Quote from: Yuillegan on July 12, 2021, 03:31:48 AM ---Very nice! Yes, upon rereading this I think it might just be the "ax" as the relevant suffix. I might have got a bit too excited earlier.

Salt isn't bad, or silver. But not a lot of uses of both in the series. Fire, Water, Spirit, Metal all seem to be the main ones. 
This works, as it ties back to the idea of elemental Dragons. But Harry puts the five elements as Fire, Water, Earth, Air, Spirit. The Chinese five elements are Fire, Water, Iron, Earth, Air (also meaning spirit). So it's hard to know how they fit.

Perhaps it is something like this?
Ferro: Iron
Sirio: Light/Spirit/Air
Pyro: Fire
Hydra: Water
Unknown fifth Dragon: Earth

--- End quote ---
In the video about dragons, Butcher says these are the big Western dragons, and that the Eastern dragons are off doing their job, or something to that effect. So trying to tie these to Eastern principles might be misplaced.

My take is that very pure things of reality are bad for things of the never-never, and the dragons are like pillars of reality. They are the avatars of things that dangerous to the supernatural, and are therefore different from them, and also a guard against them.

And almost all the guards are dead...

Yuillegan:

--- Quote from: Griffyn612 on July 12, 2021, 12:20:20 PM ---Water is good, but in the series it's mostly been seen used against wizards. Have we seen it used against anyone else?

--- End quote ---
Titania deployed it with great effect against Ethniu and the Eye of Balor. LtW used it against the Naagloshii. Vadderung says part of the reason Demonreach Island is surrounded by water is to reduce the efficacy of magic deployed against it (or something along those lines). Black Court Vampires supposedly cannot cross running water. I think even Harry tried to cross a river to escape the Demon that the Shadowman summons.


--- Quote from: Griffyn612 on July 12, 2021, 12:20:20 PM ---In the video about dragons, Butcher says these are the big Western dragons, and that the Eastern dragons are off doing their job, or something to that effect. So trying to tie these to Eastern principles might be misplaced.

My take is that very pure things of reality are bad for things of the never-never, and the dragons are like pillars of reality. They are the avatars of things that dangerous to the supernatural, and are therefore different from them, and also a guard against them.

And almost all the guards are dead...

--- End quote ---
I am unfamiliar with the video about Dragons. I had a brief look but couldn't find anything beyond when Dragons will next show up and their use as terraformers. Do you have a link?

If that's the case though that Ferro and his compatriots are merely the Western team, what are the Eastern ones up to? I thought though that there were only 3 or 4 Dragons in the whole world (not including the lower-case dragons who are merely beasts and servants created in the "image" of the big D Dragons).

Interesting follow-up idea. If the Dragons are also the guards to reality (or at least the pillars holding back the tide) what happens when they are gone? What happened after Siriothrax died I wonder, and what things have been possible with his death?

Griffyn612:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on July 12, 2021, 02:03:01 PM ---Titania deployed it with great effect against Ethniu and the Eye of Balor. LtW used it against the Naagloshii. Vadderung says part of the reason Demonreach Island is surrounded by water is to reduce the efficacy of magic deployed against it (or something along those lines). Black Court Vampires supposedly cannot cross running water. I think even Harry tried to cross a river to escape the Demon that the Shadowman summons.
I am unfamiliar with the video about Dragons. I had a brief look but couldn't find anything beyond when Dragons will next show up and their use as terraformers. Do you have a link?

If that's the case though that Ferro and his compatriots are merely the Western team, what are the Eastern ones up to? I thought though that there were only 3 or 4 Dragons in the whole world (not including the lower-case dragons who are merely beasts and servants created in the "image" of the big D Dragons).

Interesting follow-up idea. If the Dragons are also the guards to reality (or at least the pillars holding back the tide) what happens when they are gone? What happened after Siriothrax died I wonder, and what things have been possible with his death?

--- End quote ---
https://amp.reddit.com/r/dresdenfiles/comments/50f12n/dragon_names_spoilers_all/

I'm linking to the Reddit post because their link jumps to the part about dragons.

In summary, he says there were three left on Earth and Michael killed one of those. Someone asks about Eastern dragons and Butcher says the Eastern dragons are doing their cosmic job, and the Western/European dragons were the disgruntled workers that got involved in mortal affairs and tied up on Earth.

Yuillegan:

--- Quote from: Griffyn612 on July 12, 2021, 06:26:16 PM ---https://amp.reddit.com/r/dresdenfiles/comments/50f12n/dragon_names_spoilers_all/

I'm linking to the Reddit post because their link jumps to the part about dragons.

In summary, he says there were three left on Earth and Michael killed one of those. Someone asks about Eastern dragons and Butcher says the Eastern dragons are doing their cosmic job, and the Western/European dragons were the disgruntled workers that got involved in mortal affairs and tied up on Earth.

--- End quote ---
It's a bit confusing because Jim almost contradicts himself, then recovers. Having seen Jim get a bit confused over his own stuff a few times I'd be willing to bet that he was a bit confused then too. Which isn't to say that what he said isn't true. But it sort of contradicts other WOJ on Dragons.


--- Quote ---2009 WoJ forum post:
6. ferrovax – is this because he’s the OLDEST dragon? (i thought it was an empty boast) or because he’s a dragon?
Ferrovax feels absolutely no need to boast.  It’s because he /is/ a Dragon, large D, an elemental force of the cosmos.  He isn’t some kind of Smaug hanging around a nice apartment.  He’s a Dragon in a more Asian sense of the concept, a semi-divine being who was once given authority over various portions of the mortal universe, and who was responsible for their orderly procession.  There /are/ Smauglike dragons (though not nearly as many now as there have been in the past, thanks George!) but they are essentially nothing but emissaries and servitors created in the image of the real thing.
Regardless of big D or little d, dragons almost universally resent humanity for usurping the balance of power in the world.
--- End quote ---


--- Quote ---#189 “Was Sirothrax a major dragon like Ferrovax or a minor dragon?”
He was the real deal, though he was in some ways the weakest of the remaining great dragons.
Ferrovax wouldn’t have given a damn about some nobody minor dragon being slain. :)

The other dragon still walking the earth is named Pyrovax
Once & Future Podcast @~60m
Dragons are the kind of forces that you put in charge of things like..
“It’s time for another ice age, you- go handle that.”
“We really need this continent to be split by a giant river, arrange it.”
“Ok.”
That’s the kind of thing that Dragons would be doing
--- End quote ---

The link you posted occurred a few years after those questions were answered, so being the latest information it's more likely to be true. But it seems strange that Ferro and Sirio and Pyro are both semi-divine beings in the more Asian sense of being Dragons (as in capital-D Dragons) yet also are the workers and Western Dragons...and yet there are also lower tier servant (lowercase-d) dragons who are just emissaries and workers themselves but are mostly just beasts. It just seems like too many concepts have been confused.

Myself, I think the questioner (I forget her name) confused him. I don't know where she got the idea that Ferro and Pyro were Western dragons - because prior to that video as far as I know there was no indication of that. So either she was privy to information most fans didn't have (maybe Jim told her something) or she was confused herself and asked Jim a poor question which caused him to give a confusing answer. I don't know what the case is though.

Also, his terminology that there is only three before Michael killed one left is interesting (and further evidence of contradictory information on the death of the dragon). Could it be that there were quite a lot around at one time. Not four or five or six but perhaps a multitude?

Griffyn612:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on July 13, 2021, 01:04:41 AM ---It's a bit confusing because Jim almost contradicts himself, then recovers. Having seen Jim get a bit confused over his own stuff a few times I'd be willing to bet that he was a bit confused then too. Which isn't to say that what he said isn't true. But it sort of contradicts other WOJ on Dragons.

The link you posted occurred a few years after those questions were answered, so being the latest information it's more likely to be true. But it seems strange that Ferro and Sirio and Pyro are both semi-divine beings in the more Asian sense of being Dragons (as in capital-D Dragons) yet also are the workers and Western Dragons...and yet there are also lower tier servant (lowercase-d) dragons who are just emissaries and workers themselves but are mostly just beasts. It just seems like too many concepts have been confused.

Myself, I think the questioner (I forget her name) confused him. I don't know where she got the idea that Ferro and Pyro were Western dragons - because prior to that video as far as I know there was no indication of that. So either she was privy to information moist fans didn't have (maybe Jim told her something) or she was confused herself and asked Jim a poor question which caused him to give a confusing answer. I don't know what the case is though.

Also, his terminology that there is only three before Michael killed one left is interesting (and further evidence of contradictory information on the death of the dragon). Could it be that there were quite a lot around at one time. Not four or five or six but perhaps a multitude?

--- End quote ---
I'm not seeing much conflict between the video and the previous comments. Maybe he said at some point that there were four and only four Big D Dragons, but I think it's just how we interpreted what he really said.

In all, there are likely a bunch of Dragons, Asian or not, that are still being Cosmic Avatars. They're doing their job.

A handful, specifically four (or five) were disgruntled workers among the other worker Dragons, and they descended to Earth in earthly forms. Those were Ferro, Sirio, Pyro, and the unnamed fourth. And possibly Lucifer.

For all we know, Dragons might be Angels, or Angels might be Dragons. The earthly Dragons might be the Dragon equivalent of the Grigori or the Fallen. (I'm not saying they're either, just the Dragon-pantheon equivalent)

So only two remaining on earth doesn't preclude others not being on alive but not on earth.

As for European vs Asian, it could be that the Four were responsible for European regions (like Grigori had specific tasks on Earth) and they kinda sorta transubstantiated, but the Asian and other Dragons kind of tsked and went about their business.

...

Or, be hedged his answer to avoid accusations of euro-centric mythologies being predominant in the series, and tried to give an out so as to not offend anyone.

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