The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers

!!SPOILERS!! Battle Ground Thoughts and Recap !!SPOILERS!! READER BEWARE

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Arjan:
 Four werewolves survived. They escorted Harry after the battle.

TheCuriousFan:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on September 30, 2020, 12:47:16 AM ---b) As it seems likely there are multiple Starborn running around there are a number of possible candidates:
Elaine (almost certain now considering Justin's involvement...more so if she were Kumori), Marcone (seems like another reveal), Nicodemus (would explain a lot of his game), Rashid (for obvious reasons). Perhaps others. Part of me thinks all these beings have the potential to be something else and it's about Choice. Drakul certainly hints that the White Council intended for Harry to be a weapon for them (perhaps a sacrifice too). Interestingly, I would say that humour and insouciance are traits that all known Starborn seem to share (Drakul, Harry and Listen). Maybe that's a clue.
--- End quote ---
Marcone was 40ish in Storm Front, he doesn't fit.


--- Quote ---5. The Eye. Was mostly very impressive although hardly a nuke. More like the energy of a nuke focussed. Arguably far more dangerous but it would have been nice to see an OMG moment. Everyone likes a big boom. Also, Harry lying about who ended up with it and using it to manipulate Marcone was stupid on Harry's part. He won the round but he will pay for it. If he had been prepared to try and buy the castle off Marcone he might have dodged the eventual repercussions. But it can kill Immortals apparently. Mab was concerned it could finish her. So now we have two ways Immortals can kill: conjunctions and super-magical power. Which makes a certain amount of sense.

--- End quote ---
On the other hand, leaving the castle with Marcone means he's gotta work his way in through the uber wards after Marcone has worked them out in their eventual confrontation.


--- Quote ---I also think we have had some confirmation about Lord Raith's protection. Eb describes mordite as being "the most evil stuff from the Outside" (which is curious, considering it's all bad out there...right?) But in that he is also talking about how once it is alloyed into Titanic Bronze it consumes energy instead of life. Seems exactly like Lord Raith's protection. Which isn't to say he was wearing Titanic Bronze of course. More like, beings of the same origin as mordite could provide such protection. Why Eb didn't think of this when he attempted to kill Raith is curious (mostly as Jim likely hadn't invented it yet) but still.
--- End quote ---
Don't think to hard about those attempts, judging by the Blood Rites defences Eb could have walked through them in his sleep.


--- Quote ---But I think Harry has further darkside to go yet. I mean, Fidelacchius did hurt him. All that stuff about absolute good or evil. Seems to me Harry is going very dark side, if the Sword is any barometer.
--- End quote ---
That was when he was completely into going for revenge, it was just uncomfortably warm for him earlier.


--- Quote ---But it was scared of Alfred, so that's something. It also revealed a little about the Outsider's end game (which many have guessed at) - Empty Night. The dissolution of all Creation into silence and nothingness. And Nemesis seemed to think that it's closer than ever despite Harry's victory. Also, so much more pain for Thomas. Guy can't catch a break.

--- End quote ---
Nemesis, like everybody else, expects a massive war of humans vs everybody else to begin soonish.

Yuillegan:

--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on September 30, 2020, 06:37:35 AM ---Marcone was 40ish in Storm Front, he doesn't fit.

--- End quote ---
Don't hold on too heavily to that idea. Unless you assume all Starborn are born within the same hour or so. Elaine could be starborn. Listen actually IS starborn and I don't think anyone thinks he is exactly the same age as Harry, to the same few hours. Or do we think Drakul also happens to share bdays with Harry? No, I think it's more complicated than that. Eb left out crucial details. Not the least of which he never said which conjunction, just that it happens every 666 years. Maybe that's just one type of starborn. Maybe you can be born under other conjunctions.


--- Quote ---On the other hand, leaving the castle with Marcone means he's gotta work his way in through the uber wards after Marcone has worked them out in their eventual confrontation.
--- End quote ---
True, but I think Harry has underestimated Marcone. Not to mention that Marcone and Namshiel may well have left traps or backdoors into the castle. Stuff Harry might never find.


--- Quote ---Don't think to hard about those attempts, judging by the Blood Rites defences Eb could have walked through them in his sleep.
--- End quote ---
Not sure what you mean here...unless you're saying Eb only half-heartedly attempted to avenge his daughter. He said he tried three times and no magic hit him. My guess is that while Eb could have ripped up the White Court establishment outside Chicago, taking out the White Court is a whole other problem. One that might not be suited to brawn. I mean, they're still kicking around and growing in power despite everything else. Also, where do all these Raith sisters keep coming from? They seem to get killed fairly often.


--- Quote ---That was when he was completely into going for revenge, it was just uncomfortably warm for him earlier.
--- End quote ---
Uncomfortably warm? You're thinking PT. In Battle Ground he actually sticks his arm into it to try and counter Butters and gets a massive burn.


--- Quote ---Nemesis, like everybody else, expects a massive war of humans vs everybody else to begin soonish.
--- End quote ---
Perhaps, but it's curious what specifically made it so certain. My guess is that it has some form of prescience that allows it to see which moves bring it closer to it's goal. I mean, Ethniu lost. It didn't get to the Island. They didn't breach the Gates (as far as we know). Yet it still thinks it is closer than ever. You could be right, the eventual war between Man and the Supernatural might make things easier. But it sounded more specific than that, at least to me.


--- Quote from: SintraEdrien on September 30, 2020, 04:54:21 AM ---Just to note, as soon as I saw the Huntsmen explained, I thought "Chronicles of Prydain!"
Personally, I thought that this book plus Peace Talks together equalled about 1.5 books. It also seems to me that Jim was trying to answer a bunch of questions, leave a bunch of threads for future works, show off new characters as well as cameo some older ones (what happens to Andi/Marci?), and also slip in a few "Take That!"s to some of us readers- in short, I think he was trying too much. Still, a fascinating read, and a nice tie-in to the X-mas short story from so long ago.

--- End quote ---
Yes, there were a nice few Welsh references and Prydain references. Good to know what happened to Arawn Death-Lord too, clears a few theories. He did more I believe because it became split. I think originally it was actually going to be smaller (combined). The Eb vs Harry fight wasn't meant to happen until later in the series, for example. Overall though, I am pleased with the amount of content.

Arjan:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on September 30, 2020, 07:27:56 AM ---Don't hold on too heavily to that idea. Unless you assume all Starborn are born within the same hour or so. Elaine could be starborn. Listen actually IS starborn and I don't think anyone thinks he is exactly the same age as Harry, to the same few hours. Or do we think Drakul also happens to share bdays with Harry? No, I think it's more complicated than that. Eb left out crucial details. Not the least of which he never said which conjunction, just that it happens every 666 years. Maybe that's just one type of starborn. Maybe you can be born under other conjunctions.
True, but I think Harry has underestimated Marcone. Not to mention that Marcone and Namshiel may well have left traps or backdoors into the castle. Stuff Harry might never find.
Not sure what you mean here...unless you're saying Eb only half-heartedly attempted to avenge his daughter. He said he tried three times and no magic hit him. My guess is that while Eb could have ripped up the White Court establishment outside Chicago, taking out the White Court is a whole other problem. One that might not be suited to brawn. I mean, they're still kicking around and growing in power despite everything else. Also, where do all these Raith sisters keep coming from? They seem to get killed fairly often.

That was when he was completely into going for revenge, it was just uncomfortably warm for him earlier.
Uncomfortably warm? You're thinking PT. In Battle Ground he actually sticks his arm into it to try and counter Butters and gets a massive burn.

--- End quote ---
The guiding angel in the sword decides how much damage it does based on the targets spiritual state. That can change depending on the situation.

The burn was just a warning. In the end Harry had to make his choice himself.

--- Quote ---Perhaps, but it's curious what specifically made it so certain. My guess is that it has some form of prescience that allows it to see which moves bring it closer to it's goal. I mean, Ethniu lost. It didn't get to the Island. They didn't breach the Gates (as far as we know). Yet it still thinks it is closer than ever. You could be right, the eventual war between Man and the Supernatural might make things easier. But it sounded more specific than that, at least to me.

--- End quote ---
In lovecraftian stories beings can return “when the stars are right”. The outsiders are preparing for that moment as is Mab. Nemesis doesn’t mind sacrificing pawns as long as she can get new ones if it weakens winter at that exact moment.

--- Quote ---Yes, there were a nice few Welsh references and Prydain references. Good to know what happened to Arawn Death-Lord too, clears a few theories. He did more I believe because it became split. I think originally it was actually going to be smaller (combined). The Eb vs Harry fight wasn't meant to happen until later in the series, for example. Overall though, I am pleased with the amount of content.

--- End quote ---

TheCuriousFan:

--- Quote from: Yuillegan on September 30, 2020, 07:27:56 AM ---Don't hold on too heavily to that idea. Unless you assume all Starborn are born within the same hour or so. Elaine could be starborn. Listen actually IS starborn and I don't think anyone thinks he is exactly the same age as Harry, to the same few hours. Or do we think Drakul also happens to share bdays with Harry? No, I think it's more complicated than that. Eb left out crucial details. Not the least of which he never said which conjunction, just that it happens every 666 years. Maybe that's just one type of starborn. Maybe you can be born under other conjunctions.

--- End quote ---
If there's a time based opening I'm pretty sure it'll be one that's a lot shorter than a decade and a half otherwise there's tens of millions of them.

--- Quote ---Not sure what you mean here...unless you're saying Eb only half-heartedly attempted to avenge his daughter. He said he tried three times and no magic hit him. My guess is that while Eb could have ripped up the White Court establishment outside Chicago, taking out the White Court is a whole other problem. One that might not be suited to brawn. I mean, they're still kicking around and growing in power despite everything else. Also, where do all these Raith sisters keep coming from? They seem to get killed fairly often.

--- End quote ---
My point was that Eb specialises in the kind of magic that Blood Rites showed gets around the defence without a problem, just don't think too hard about the backstory one liner lest you start poking holes in it.

--- Quote ---That was when he was completely into going for revenge, it was just uncomfortably warm for him earlier.
Uncomfortably warm? You're thinking PT. In Battle Ground he actually sticks his arm into it to try and counter Butters and gets a massive burn.
--- End quote ---
That's what I meant, Harry in general is safe from the sword most days. Harry in that specific moment in BG was pretty close to going full darkside and so got burnt.

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