The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
!!SPOILERS!! Battle Ground Thoughts and Recap !!SPOILERS!! READER BEWARE
morriswalters:
The question is moot if you never have the child in the first place.
Arjan:
--- Quote from: Rigil Kent on September 30, 2020, 11:09:39 PM ---Inari Raith asks if she doesn't count. :P
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Those are very specific circumstances. You can not reliable recreate them.
Yuillegan:
Yeesh we have fallen down a rabbit hole.
1. I think Mab was specifically saying she can't marry Lara because...they're both women. I know, I know - very controversial. But I do think she was actually saying that. Not that I think either of them are worried about a gay relationship tbh. But the whole thing about the Ladies MUST be vigins. The Queen perhaps has a limit around marriage, perhaps altogether, but perhaps because it must be a King. The fact that she used the word "compatibility" lead me to think this. It didn't sound like she couldn't get married altogether, just not to Lara. And I think that's to do with Lara being a women. Perhaps a Vampire too. I may well be wrong of course, but I think that's what she was getting at.
2. I can totally see Harry having a WCV for a son. Especially if Thomas dies. A sort of opportunity to do it better. Harry does seem to follow his mother's footsteps.
--- Quote from: Mira on September 30, 2020, 02:24:06 PM ---Exactly, or is it more of a Mission Impossible thing? In other words they want Harry to continue what he is doing, they just don't want the fall out from it. Kicking him out of the Council gives them plausible deniability.
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Very interesting idea. And totally the kind of screwy thinking some of them have. Especially considering Jim said recently they really needed the power of Demonreach.
--- Quote from: vultur on September 30, 2020, 08:00:22 PM ---Well he has a lot of identities... we know Kringle and Beowulf at least.
But historically Odin was identified with Mercury, Thor with Jupiter (Zeus).
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Indeed. I think I might be wrong about the Zeus thing. Jim talked a bit about Zeus in a recent interview and it seems like he views him as a very different being to Vadderung. I did know about the Mercury/Hermes connection and often wondered if Vadderung was also once Thoth (who is also equated with Mercury and Hermes). It's not unreasonable to expect more than one God to use a lightning bolt type weapon.
--- Quote ---This seems to have very interesting implications, yeah. Per WOJ Drakul is something entirely inhuman trapped in human form. Since Starborn seems to imply being born, maybe his human form was an actual human being rather than an 'assumed' form (like Uriel's temporary human form in SG).
Maybe a starborn wizard way-back-when messed up a summoning and ended up being completely possessed?
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Indeed. Hard to reconcile the thing. Also seems to fit the old idea that Drakul is a scion more. Yeah, perhaps Drakul is what Starborn can become if things go really south. The "Destroyer" thing that Morgan mentioned comes to mind.
--- Quote ---Well, as for lost knowledge... it seems from "Backup" that those beings that are genuinely forgotten can't act in the mortal world anymore. So beings only mentioned in completely lost books probably aren't relevant.
I agree they'd be unlikely to know the exact powers and weaknesses of really obscure beings.
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It's just a pet peeve of mine. I just think it's poor writing giving humans all these macguffins when we know how hard life is. We can barely keep the planet going most of the time. It's just absurd when people come of with the exact right piece of knowledge in a week. Who knows, maybe Jim will get the balance right. If they are about the Watchers level in Buffy that's about alright.
--- Quote ---Think it's a time scale issue. It hasn't fully happened at the end of BG, but the process has been set in motion. But the lack of any electronic documentation is going to be a real issue in terms of the public believing this - at first. Especially with the whole 'hallucinogenic gas' bit.
It's still going to happen, but it won't be immediate. There will be lots of different stories flying around for quite a while - confused eyewitness accounts, the official story, the Paranet version pieced together from eyewitness accounts and some background supernatural knowledge, and lots of mundane conspiracy theories (aliens, secret government experiments, etc.)
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And Mab even spoke to all of Chicago right at the start of BG with her magic voice. Who on Earth would forget that? I get that it can't all happen at once. But you barely need to look at history to see how the world reacts to violent events, especially those in the US, to see how crazy things would become. I hope Jim doesn't take too long with it.
My feeling is Jim is trying to write himself out of a corner. On the one hand, he wants Maggie to have this normal life and Dresden to go back to the good old days of being a private detective and Wizard outcast and they can just be comfy in the Castle. However, the world he has created has escalated well beyond all that. Harry doesn't have a normal life. He can't. If you look at people who live similarly chaotic and important/centre-of-everything lives they don't have time to be a normal person. Harry isn't a normal person. I think it would be far more interesting for, and more believable, if Harry sent Maggie off to boarding school or whatever. Frees Harry up to do his saving the world thing. Maggie then has time to grow into a resentful child that Harry has to deal with, and try and make it up to. I like that Dresden WANTS to be a good parent etc. But it's just not very realistic, and it means Jim has to contort the story in more and more ridiculous ways just to make it work. If you stripped it down to Harry working as an FBI or CIA etc agent after 9/11 and working directly on the case, do you really think he would be home in time for dinner? No, of course not.
--- Quote from: Arjan on September 30, 2020, 07:57:11 AM --- The guiding angel in the sword decides how much damage it does based on the targets spiritual state. That can change depending on the situation.
The burn was just a warning. In the end Harry had to make his choice himself. In lovecraftian stories beings can return “when the stars are right”. The outsiders are preparing for that moment as is Mab. Nemesis doesn’t mind sacrificing pawns as long as she can get new ones if it weakens winter at that exact moment.
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Sure, the good or evil part can change. That's the benefit of Free Will. But Harry is going darkside, and has been a long time. Look at how all his friends are reacting to him. Look at how the semi-bad guys and really bad guys are. We are all most blind to ourselves and Harry has blindspots a mile wide.
I agree that's what the Outsiders are up to. Nemesis seems to consider itself a He, as in He Who Walks Beside. Wouldn't get hung up though on the gender of a being from beyond reality. ;)
--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on September 30, 2020, 08:25:35 AM ---If there's a time based opening I'm pretty sure it'll be one that's a lot shorter than a decade and a half otherwise there's tens of millions of them.
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I know, it's a pretty big hole. But clearly there is more too it otherwise they all share the same birthday. And don't forget, Justin thought Elaine was one too it seems. So clearly it's not as crystal clear as we are being lead to believe. Trust me, Jim's building up a big sucker punch. In one of his most recent Q&As he said the whole starborn thing has been going on for longer than even most supernatural folks can remember. He seemed to imply (in my eyes) that it may well predate mankind and have started since Lucifer Fell. I mean, the 666 years isn't just a random number.
--- Quote ---My point was that Eb specialises in the kind of magic that Blood Rites showed gets around the defence without a problem, just don't think too hard about the backstory one liner lest you start poking holes in it.
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What magic does Eb specialise in that allows him to kill targets immune to magic? I mean, even his biggest hits on Ethniu did nada. And unless you think he somehow was allied with Lord Raith and meant his daughter to die, I don't see at all why Eb wouldn't try and kill Raith for the murder of his child. Look how upset he got when he saw Harry's daughter was out in the open.
--- Quote ---That's what I meant, Harry in general is safe from the sword most days. Harry in that specific moment in BG was pretty close to going full darkside and so got burnt.
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I agree that Harry's darkside-o-meter went up at that point which likely contributed to the burn. The fun of Free Will I imagine. But, Harry is going darker. There is no doubt about that.
--- Quote from: ClintACK on September 30, 2020, 11:01:54 AM ---I don't think the Sword *burned* Harry at all.
Harry wasn't just set on revenge, in his hate and despair he'd turned over control entirely to the Winter Mantle. The Sword just burned out the Mantle for a moment, leaving Harry to feel all the pain he'd accumulated in the battle -- including a left arm that was charred to the elbow from overuse of the shield bracelet.
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Read the section again. It clearly burns him. Even his mantle does nothing for the pain. It didn't burn out the mantle, it's just the mantle does nothing for certain types of pain. Loss. Guilt. Loneliness. I think the physical burn is just an indicator of how bad his spirit was getting. It wasn't from the shield bracelet, which was just his wrist. He even talks about how the burn goes down his forearm.
Bad Alias:
--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on September 30, 2020, 06:37:35 AM ---Nemesis, like everybody else, expects a massive war of humans vs everybody else to begin soonish.
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I think Harry's going to turn this on it's head.
--- Quote from: TheCuriousFan on September 30, 2020, 08:25:35 AM ---If there's a time based opening I'm pretty sure it'll be one that's a lot shorter than a decade and a half otherwise there's tens of millions of them.
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It could be something where everything is in alignment over the course of a decade but only for a short time each year or something. I doubt it, but maybe.
TheCuriousFan:
--- Quote from: Yuillegan on October 01, 2020, 04:51:07 AM ---What magic does Eb specialise in that allows him to kill targets immune to magic? I mean, even his biggest hits on Ethniu did nada. And unless you think he somehow was allied with Lord Raith and meant his daughter to die, I don't see at all why Eb wouldn't try and kill Raith for the murder of his child. Look how upset he got when he saw Harry's daughter was out in the open.
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Flinging rocks at people, if flinging keys works just fine to get around the defence then rocks work even better. I was saying don't think about it too hard because in the end it's one line of backstory that hasn't aged well.
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