The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Souls and Ghosts.
Yuillegan:
In one of the latest DragonCon panels on Ghosts, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTq8RMv19Ek&feature=youtu.be, Jim discussed Ghosts, and obviously, Souls. around 24:50
He discussed the nature of people is by quoting C.S. Lewis "You are a soul, you have a body" (which Uriel says to Harry as well). He goes on to describe Souls as being "is something important. A soul is something vital. Something that exists beyond the bounds of Time and Space. It's here for a little while and then its gone like a flicker of sunlight. You can't really capture it; you can't catch it and you can't store it. It's beyond that - its part of the foundational energy of the universe. It's an echo of creation. And as a result it doesn't really get mired down in things like that."
So ghosts then differ as they are "some kind of remnants [of the person], some kind of memories that seem to get left over" "It's like water poured into a footprint - it's still in the shape of the original foot but its not energy" They aren't trapped but created as sort of a byproduct of a person's death. Some ghosts can change and become something else (but that would be an exceptional ghost). Most just continue in their endless cycle of being themselves.
There is a slight discrepancy in that Bob thinks Harry burns off his Soul when he uses Soulfire. But the way Jim puts it here, is that mortal concerns shouldn't really affect Souls.
But the more interesting implication is the sheer importance of a Soul. Something that comes from the beginning of Creation, that is Timeless and foundational. And vital. I would propose that it is vital to reality that Souls exists and have Choice. Perhaps why the Angels take it so seriously. Not to mention, it helps explain the incredible properties of Soulfire. Often called "the Life Fire" or "the Fires of Creation" - which makes sense considering it is fueled by the very energy of creation. Pure creative energy, I suppose. Perhaps this is why mortals have such a unique edge against the supernatural.
But then why then are Angels able to use Soulfire? They don't have Souls, that is a uniquely mortal thing... Except perhaps it isn't totally.
My WAG is then that perhaps Angels have something like a Soul, similar yet limited. The prototype version. But because they are so big and powerful, they could not have "Free" Will. They were allowed Will (in order for them to be at least somewhat autonomous) and had a degree of Choice (as Uriel displayed when he gave up his grace, or when the Fallen fell - different acts of course but required Choice). But they weren't given the full range of Choice as they had too much power or something like that. So naturally, some Angels then resented when Humans get the full range of Choice. What does that mean? I cannot be sure, but I suspect that it means Mortals have access to the Source or something like it, basically allowing them to Choose their own shape and destiny (dictated not by their wishes, but their Choices). An Angel cannot fully choose it's own shape or destiny. It may appear to alter things, but that is always in accordance with the plan. They have the illusion of Choice. Not sure I can delve into the mechanics much beyond that - but you get the idea I hope.
Bad Alias:
I took his statement that souls don't get mired down in things like that to mean that souls don't get "stuck" here on earth as ghosts.* I do think that mortal concerns will affect souls, but that physical concerns won't. What I mean by that is that you couldn't damage someone else's soul by a physical action. What could damage (or enhance) that soul is how the person chose to respond to the physical action. In the videos just released, Jim repeatedly talks about how choice is a really big deal in the Dresden Files, and I think that links in here. If choice doesn't matter to the soul, why/how does anything matter?
Both Bob and Harry admit that Bob doesn't really understand the faith side of the supernatural. Harry specifically applies this to Bob's understanding of soulfire. I think Jim did too. We've also been told that becoming a fairy not only could destroy Molly's soul but is likely to. I think a soul can be destroyed in the DF, not just damned, or Jim is intentionally misleading us.
*This doesn't seem to work with Harry's experience in Ghost Story. Captain Murphy's task force seemed to be more than ghosts and Harry was given the opportunity to stay on. Maybe the task force were the ghosts who become something more. Maybe Harry staying on would be the exception that proves the rule. Maybe Uriel knew Harry wouldn't stay on, but that seems problematic to me.
Bad Alias:
--- Quote from: Kindler on September 05, 2019, 07:27:16 PM ---
--- Quote ---Q: I’ve been wondering, is a magic-users longevity/ability to repair themselves due to their use of magic, or is it because they are able to access magic at all?
A: It’s because they /use/ magic.
Q: Charity Carpenter was able to use magic at one point; will she have an extended life?
A: Not unless she takes it up again, which would be extremely difficult and which she doesn’t want to do.
Q: And is the longevity tied to strength levels, as in do stronger wizards live longer?
A: Indeed. In the Dresden Files universe, magic is the essence of creation itself. Constant exposure to it through use changes the person who uses it in a number of ways, not all of them as obvious as physical recovery and longevity. The more exposure, the more dramatic the changes.
--- End quote ---
Source: http://wordof.jim-butcher.com/index.php/word-of-jim-woj-compilation/woj-on-magic-in-the-dresden-files/
Ctrl + F Longevity. All three of these questions are right after the other.
--- End quote ---
Over in the Candidates for future Nemfection thread, Kindler posted the above WoJs. I immediately thought of this thread and the similarities to the description of the soul and magic re: the forces of creation.
morriswalters:
--- Quote ---But then why then are Angels able to use Soulfire? They don't have Souls, that is a uniquely mortal thing... Except perhaps it isn't totally.
--- End quote ---
--- Quote ---“Oh, come on, Harry. All you mortals get all hung up over your precious souls. You’ve never seen your soul, never touched it, never done anything with it. What’s all the to-do?”
“So what you’re saying is that this hand construct was made out of my soul,” I said.
“Your soul and your magic fused together, yeah,” Bob said. “Your soul converted into energy. Soulfire. In this case, the spirit energy drawn from your aura right around your right hand, because it fit the construct so well, it being a big version of your right hand and all. Your standard force-projection spell formed around the matrix of soulfire, and what had been an instantaneous exertion of force became a long-term entity capable of manipulation and exertion to the same degree. Not really more powerful than just the force spell, as much as it was more than simply the force spell.”
I wiggled my tingling fingers. “Oh. But my soul’s going to get better, right?”
“Oh, sure,” Bob said. “Few days, a week or two at most, it’ll grow back in. Go out and have a good time, enjoy yourself, do some things that uplift the human spirit or whatever, and it’ll come back even faster.”
I grunted. “So what you’re saying is that soulfire doesn’t let me do anything new. It just makes me more of what I already am.”
“A lot more,” Bob said, nodding cheerfully from his shelf. “It’s how angels do all of their stuff. Though admittedly, they’ve got a lot more in the way of soul to draw upon than you do.”
“I thought angels didn’t have souls,” I said.
“Like I said, people get all excited and twitchy when that word gets used,” Bob said. “Angels don’t have anything else.”
“Oh. What happens if I, uh, you know. Use too much of it?”
“What’s five minus five, Harry?”
“Zero.”
“Right. Think about that for a minute. I’m sure you’ll come to the right conclusion.”
--- End quote ---
Take this for what it's worth. Since Jim uses Bob as an unreliable talking head. Something I tend to tire of.
peregrine:
Yeah. Angels don't have souls. Angels are souls.
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