The Dresden Files > DFRPG
Why are powers so much stronger than stunts?
Sanctaphrax:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 29, 2019, 11:56:41 PM ---I'm talking purely mechanically here. Point is, someone with the regular set of consequences, once they have all their stress boxes and regular consequences filled up, the smallest attack will finish them. Someone with this, can take three substantial hits before going down. It just doesn't feel right to me.
--- End quote ---
Why not?
That's the whole point of spending Refresh on durability.
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 29, 2019, 11:56:41 PM ---That last one kind of removes a lot of the point of the recovery power, I feel. And they all feel like patches more than anything; as mentioned before, I tend to be of the opinion that the more patches something needs, the less wise it is to allow it.
--- End quote ---
It's a patch, and needing a patch isn't ideal, but it's small and you only need the one.
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 29, 2019, 11:56:41 PM ---And if it's a +3 catch, it's going to end up not applying a lot. I mean, look at Black Court Vampires -- they're an extreme example, but they can barely walk a dozen feet without running into something that counts as their Catch.
--- End quote ---
That's a +4 Catch, and a remarkably bad one.
Most +3 Catches require real effort from an opponent who has it in for you personally. Either they need to do a bit of research to discover that you're vulnerable to something they can easily find, or they need to put some work into finding someone with the thing you're vulnerable to. And either way, they may need to attack in a way that doesn't suit their skills in order to take advantage.
It'll get pierced from time to time, but so what? It's just 1 Refresh worth of stuff.
Mr. Death:
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on May 30, 2019, 04:36:00 AM ---Why not?
That's the whole point of spending Refresh on durability.
--- End quote ---
Because there's no precedent for it. Every other stunt or ability that grants extra consequences exclusively adds Mild consequences. Dresden's treatment of injury is more realistic than other systems, and it's one of the things that keeps it grounded and interesting -- a sucking wound to the chest or having your guts torn out should be the limit on how much punishment you can take and keep fighting.
--- Quote ---That's a +4 Catch, and a remarkably bad one.
Most +3 Catches require real effort from an opponent who has it in for you personally. Either they need to do a bit of research to discover that you're vulnerable to something they can easily find, or they need to put some work into finding someone with the thing you're vulnerable to. And either way, they may need to attack in a way that doesn't suit their skills in order to take advantage.
It'll get pierced from time to time, but so what? It's just 1 Refresh worth of stuff.
--- End quote ---
In a long enough campaign, it's going to come up more and more especially as the heroes gain notoriety and the villains start to figure out what works and what doesn't.
Sanctaphrax:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 30, 2019, 02:14:37 PM ---Because there's no precedent for it. Every other stunt or ability that grants extra consequences exclusively adds Mild consequences.
--- End quote ---
That seems like a fully general argument against ever doing anything new.
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 30, 2019, 02:14:37 PM ---Dresden's treatment of injury is more realistic than other systems, and it's one of the things that keeps it grounded and interesting -- a sucking wound to the chest or having your guts torn out should be the limit on how much punishment you can take and keep fighting.
--- End quote ---
This is a Power; it's allowed to be magical.
And hey, there's always Compels. I hear they solve everything. Can always Compel someone to suffer consequences for their consequences.
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on May 30, 2019, 02:14:37 PM ---In a long enough campaign, it's going to come up more and more especially as the heroes gain notoriety and the villains start to figure out what works and what doesn't.
--- End quote ---
True. But it'll never stop being a fantastic deal for 1 Refresh.
Plus, the more and more often part can earn you FP, sometimes. Depends on the situation and your GM.
Mr. Death:
--- Quote from: Sanctaphrax on May 31, 2019, 05:40:33 AM ---That seems like a fully general argument against ever doing anything new.
--- End quote ---
No, just against new things that seem to fall way outside what we normally see.
The average 2 refresh power does things in 1s and 2s; it adds 2 stress boxes, or you get a two stress attack you couldn't do before (like Claws and Breath Weapon), or you get a new trapping for a skill (like Glamours). The ones that do more than that (like channeling) come with a usage cost.
So a 2 refresh power that adds a 4-shift effect and a 6-shift effect without a cost or a weakness seems way outside of what's normally in the range of a 2 refresh power.
--- Quote ---This is a Power; it's allowed to be magical.
And hey, there's always Compels. I hear they solve everything. Can always Compel someone to suffer consequences for their consequences.
--- End quote ---
Even magic has its limits; those limits are often based on the refresh spent. This proposed power seems to me to go beyond the normal limits for refresh v. effect.
--- Quote ---True. But it'll never stop being a fantastic deal for 1 Refresh.
Plus, the more and more often part can earn you FP, sometimes. Depends on the situation and your GM.
--- End quote ---
Nonetheless, it is still a concrete, exploitable weakness in the power, which this power doesn't have.
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