The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Is there anything Mab can't command Harry to do? (Getting out of the WK idea.)
KurtinStGeorge:
In "Changes," Harry tells Mab he will become the Winter Knight if she heals him so he can rescue his daughter and "give me your word that you will never command me to lift my hand against those I love." So I'm not talking about that caveat in their agreement.
I want to know if anyone on the forum who has read about the mythology of the fae knows of something, anything the fae aren't allowed to do to, or ask of mortals, even if it isn't specifically about Mab or any of the fae with names that might signify Mab. I have this odd idea how Harry might get out of the Winter Knight gig.
When Harry agrees to be the Winter Knight Mab says to him, "Once you are my Knight, once this last quest of yours is complete, you are mine. You will destroy what I wish you to destroy. Kill whatsoever I wish you to kill. You will be mine, blood, bone, and breath. Do you understand this?" That sounds awfully complete, but the term "blood, bone, and breath" sounds more like a term of art; Mab bragging about being Harry's new boss, rather than an actual terms that he must fulfill. It seems to me the destroying and killing part are the crucial orders Harry has to carry out. Plus, I find it more than just odd that Harry doesn't automatically get to learn Winter Law or have an easily obtainable source; like a book or tutor, to learn it from. It's almost like Mab doesn't want Harry to know anymore about Winter Law than she needs him to know.
So I'm thinking, what if Mab really wants Harry to do something, but it's not something he's obligated to do as the Winter Knight. If Harry thinks he has to do Mab's bidding, it doesn't matter, he does the job, Mab is happy and (if he survives) Harry remains the Winter Knight. However, if Harry learns that Winter Law doesn't apply to this particular job, he could say, "I will do it as a favor Mab, if you ask me." Then; if Mab is forced to ask Harry to do this task as a favor, I think Harry's old deal with Mab supersedes the current one. As a reminder that deal goes like this; "From time to time, I will make a request of you. When you have fulfilled three requests, your obligation to me ceases." I don't think there was anything said when Harry became the Winter Knight that nullifies that.
I think many of us have had the thought that if Harry finds a way out of the Winter Knight job, Mab can still ask one more favor of him. That not only seems logical, it's something we can all predict will happen. If I'm right about why Harry doesn't have an easy way to learn Winter Law, then not only is the idea that Harry might be able to turn the tables on Mab a viable one, it's something Jim might want to do in order to subvert our expectations, but do so in a good way. (Not like we have seen in a once uber popular, now crippled, maybe dying movie franchise that I will not name.)
Mira:
I think there is a loop hole and while she can command him to do anything she cannot force him to do
everything she commands. I believe both Eb at the end of Changes and Uriel at the end of Ghost Story told him that but I need to go back and read the exact quotes.
morriswalters:
In Summer Knight Mab makes Harry stab himself in the hand to make a point. Should she choose to do so she can run him like a meat puppet.
Mira:
--- Quote ---In Summer Knight Mab makes Harry stab himself in the hand to make a point. Should she choose to do so she can run him like a meat puppet.
--- End quote ---
However at that point Harry didn't have full understanding he believes that she can make him do anything. That is why he suicided in the first place with a little nudging from Lasciel..
But here is what Eb told him in Changes page426 hardback
--- Quote ---"She might lean on you pretty hard. Try to put you in a box you don't want to be in. But don't let her. She cannot take away your will. Even if she can make it seem that way. He sighed again, but that's the one thing the dark beings and powers can't do. Take away your ability to choose. They can kill you. They can make you do things---but they can't make you chooseto do'em. They almost always try to lie to you about that. Don't fall for it."
--- End quote ---
Here is what Uriel said in Ghost Story page 475 The famous seven words..
--- Quote ---A voice---a very calm, very gentle, very rational voice whispered in my ear, "Lies, Mab cannot change who you are."
--- End quote ---
Further down on the same page Harry says to Mab;
--- Quote ---"No," I said then, weakly. "No. Maybe I'm your knight. But I'm not yours."
--- End quote ---
So yeah, perhaps Mab can command Harry to do anything she wants, however she cannot force him to do any of it, it is still his choice. It seems to be a matter of will, and as we know Harry has few equals or superiors when it comes to that.. He defeated the shadow of one Fallen that way, is Mab stronger than a fallen angel?
nadia.skylark:
--- Quote ---So yeah, perhaps Mab can command Harry to do anything she wants, however she cannot force him to do any of it, it is still his choice.
--- End quote ---
I think the issue is that Mab can force him to do things, but she can't force him to choose to do them, and it's the choice that is important. At least, that was what I understood from the end of Ghost Story.
Given Mab's limitations and the reason why the faerie Knights exist, however, I doubt that Mab could force Harry to kill a mortal unassociated with the Courts or outright lie. That might be a way for Harry to fulfill his third favor to Mab, but on the other hand I have a hard time thinking of a situation where Mab would need to force Harry to lie outright or where Harry would refuse to kill someone as Mab's Knight but would do so to fulfill a favor.
The answer may end up lying in Mab's promise not to order him to harm anyone he loves after all--if Elaine is infected with Nemesis, for instance, Mab would want her dead but could not command Harry to kill her.
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