The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
The 5 gods of Lovecraft
jonas:
--- Quote from: Avernite on June 24, 2018, 06:11:55 AM ---Well, I'm not the one claiming that I posit something equivalent to a sound scientific theory. As such my opinion is a fair enough argument, it just doesn't make my resulting pronouncement about the story a scientific theory.
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when did I use the word science? Are you doing science? NO? Still a sound deductive theorem and by all means I go more and more ammo for this one, just waiting in my subconscious mind to be retrieved by need... A theorem btw, is something that you can point back to as continual springboard into future cases of similar data patterns... I have a solid theorem. Made stronger by every person I have to debate on it, :) thanks duuude.
--- Quote ---So far as we know it's precisely the Outer Gates and the Gatekeeper (backed by millions of Fae soldiers) that keep the creatures from manifesting left and right by stopping them at or outside the Gates. No guesswork about them having an agent on the inside necessary.
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Thar's not the same thing, at all. It's not Fearbringer taking over Scarecrow by mirage, It's not Scarecrow saying He's been serving the Queen of Air and Darkness(Not the Winter Queen note) since before human memory, cause human memory would be what keeps him, or any being from Oblivion, except perhaps an outsider trying to get back in Mmm? SO there is unequivocal proof in HIS, a fae's wording, he cannot have lied, unless he was Nemfected, which would simply prove the other half of my theorem correct. :)
....every good point I make nobody ever concedes to, the simply move on to a new straw man to throw up when they can't 'win' the original points in contention. You can't examine the fallacy before your face!?
To be my Last Laugh, BET ;D
*Oh, just for giggles but you know Yeats Second Coming that's referenced repeatedly in the DF? It's in the Nyarlahotep Cycle, a compendium of works about or based on Nyarlahotep....
Avernite:
--- Quote from: jonas on June 24, 2018, 07:02:11 AM ---when did I use the word science? Are you doing science? NO? Still a sound deductive theorem and by all means I go more and more ammo for this one, just waiting in my subconscious mind to be retrieved by need... A theorem btw, is something that you can point back to as continual springboard into future cases of similar data patterns... I have a solid theorem. Made stronger by every person I have to debate on it, :) thanks duuude.
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At this point I suppose we must conclude you have no clue what a scientific theory is, and so the resulting argument would fit better outside this forum - it clearly isn't that you understand but have a trove of supporting data to support your assertion.
--- Quote ---Thar's not the same thing, at all. It's not Fearbringer taking over Scarecrow by mirage, It's not Scarecrow saying He's been serving the Queen of Air and Darkness(Not the Winter Queen note) since before human memory, cause human memory would be what keeps him, or any being from Oblivion, except perhaps an outsider trying to get back in Mmm? SO there is unequivocal proof in HIS, a fae's wording, he cannot have lied, unless he was Nemfected, which would simply prove the other half of my theorem correct. :)....every good point I make nobody ever concedes to, the simply move on to a new straw man to throw up when they can't 'win' the original points in contention. You can't examine the fallacy before your face!?
To be my Last Laugh, BET ;D
*Oh, just for giggles but you know Yeats Second Coming that's referenced repeatedly in the DF? It's in the Nyarlahotep Cycle, a compendium of works about or based on Nyarlahotep....
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Or maybe Scarecrow is saying that current humans do not remember everything any human ever remembered - so that what he's saying is "I was there with the early humans, whom you puny people don't even remember".
jonas:
--- Quote from: Avernite on June 24, 2018, 08:51:25 AM ---At this point I suppose we must conclude you have no clue what a scientific theory is, and so the resulting argument would fit better outside this forum - it clearly isn't that you understand but have a trove of supporting data to support your assertion.
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what? You sure your not attacking the person here? Getting in to dangerous territory with your inability to address the issues. attack the argument, not the person... if you even can :) Supporting data does tend to support, doesn't it lol?
--- Quote ---Or maybe Scarecrow is saying that current humans do not remember everything any human ever remembered - so that what he's saying is "I was there with the early humans, whom you puny people don't even remember".
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Since before human memory. Those early humans also remember things now forgotten to Oblivion, intentionally. This isn't even a rebuke to the idea.... your idea confirms he'd be amongst the Obliviated....
*oh and uhh...
--- Quote ---Theorem= a general proposition not self-evident but proved by a chain of reasoning; a truth established by means of accepted truths.
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yea. See my Truths made real by establishment of other Truths... that some tend to conveniently ignore. I propose a general perspective of the DFverse based on these principle truths that I can point to in book and woj evidence to support ;p
Avernite:
--- Quote from: jonas on June 24, 2018, 05:06:20 PM ---what? You sure your not attacking the person here? Getting in to dangerous territory with your inability to address the issues. attack the argument, not the person... if you even can :)
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I am attacking your abuse of the concept of a scientific theory, not the issues or you.
--- Quote ---*oh and uhh... yea. See my Truths made real by establishment of other Truths... that some tend to conveniently ignore. I propose a general perspective of the DFverse based on these principle truths that I can point to in book and woj evidence to support ;p
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And that is not at all like a scientific theory like the theory of evolution. They may have once started at a similar level, as a hypothesis grounded in data, but without predictions proven true (which we'd need more books for) your idea cannot proceed further.
Now, snipping back:
--- Quote ---Supporting data does tend to support, doesn't it lol?Since before human memory. Those early humans also remember things now forgotten to Oblivion, intentionally. This isn't even a rebuke to the idea.... your idea confirms he'd be amongst the Obliviated....
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Uhh, why? He has served since before humanity can remember, but at no point does he say there was a time humanity didn't know him. Just that current humanity doesn't remember that time.
Humanity in 2000 BC knew him, Humanity in 1 AD knew him, Humanity in 2000 AD knew him, but Humanity in 2000 AD doesn't remember 2000 BC (mix and match dates as needed).
jonas:
--- Quote from: Avernite on June 24, 2018, 08:51:53 PM ---I am attacking your abuse of the concept of a scientific theory, not the issues or you.And that is not at all like a scientific theory like the theory of evolution. They may have once started at a similar level, as a hypothesis grounded in data, but without predictions proven true (which we'd need more books for) your idea cannot proceed further.
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Actually smarty pants, Prove Gravity exists... you can't, it's still a theory. You can see the visible results from it, you can deduct the results of it's influence but you can't prove gravity exists because you can't visibly produce it(and before you wanna argue me on this, go argue the science guy on Tedtalks whose speech i'm ripping off instead, thanks)
on to the cutting at my edges and ad hominem things...
--- Quote ---attacking your abuse of the concept of a scientific theory
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But I didn't say scientific, this isn't science it's reading comprehension. So saying i'm abusing scientific theory's is actually just to try to insult me(cut those edges you ;) it's gonna be hard for you to use reverse psychology on someone who enjoys psychology after all)
--- Quote ---you have no clue
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that's ad hominem, and false, as I've proved already, but you insist on troping the same argument thinking it matters...
--- Quote --- isn't that you understand but have a trove of supporting data to support your assertion.
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this statement is simply asinine of itself here.
--- Quote ---A random wild guess that may or may not even fit the books is nothing like a scientific theory, sorry.
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Random wild guesses cannot, by their nature, be supported by a trove of date, your sorry feels similar to someone saying,"I don't mean to be rude, BUT." I'm actually going to be and this is my excuse me lately. Simply meant to cut again...
--- Quote ---Now, snipping back:
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See, and that's your assumption, AND your admission of self guilt, it's your intention. I'm simply defending my position.... successfully I might add ;)
--- Quote ---Uhh, why? He has served since before humanity can remember, but at no point does he say there was a time humanity didn't know him. Just that current humanity doesn't remember that time.
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You do know how the Oblivion war works right? If humanity forgot him there would be a disassociation between him, and the him who is remembered. Which is why, for instance, Mab had the brothers Grimm reassert their prime identity by distributing knowledge on them.
--- Quote ---Humanity in 2000 BC knew him, Humanity in 1 AD knew him, Humanity in 2000 AD knew him, but Humanity in 2000 AD doesn't remember 2000 BC (mix and match dates as needed).
--- End quote ---
That's Oblivion then ain't it... If here and know they don't remember whom he was then, then he's not that person anymore.
Now, quite apart from my ability to theorize, if your going to attempt to bother me on a personal level you'll need to bring a lot more game to the table...
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