Elaine pentacle amulet

[edf]

No, he never mentions giving it to her. I don't think it came from Justin either.   My guess is that they do get passed down through family lines and may even stretch back to a group that originally had them created for a reason.

I was just listening to Turn Coat and Lara Raith had a rather interesting choker with a blood red ruby in it. Perhaps similar to the one Harry got in Changes? I don't recall her wearing that before, so it seems to be part of her combat attire.

[Griffyn612]

I thought there was a WoJ that Harry have Elaine the pentacle, but I could be mistaken.

[nedserD C B yrraH]

I was just listening to Turn Coat and Lara Raith had a rather interesting choker with a blood red ruby in it. Perhaps similar to the one Harry got in Changes? I don't recall her wearing that before, so it seems to be part of her combat attire.

Or it could be the one Papa Wraith had in his ear when we first met him.

[groinkick]

I thought there was a WoJ that Harry have Elaine the pentacle, but I could be mistaken.

In the early books you mention that Elaine has the same pentacle as Harry.  Is that significant or have you changed your mind on?

No it's significant.  There is a reason for that.  Harry and Elaine come from the same philosophical background as far as magic is concerned... Or at least so he believes in any case.  I guess we will have to see if Elaine thinks the same way.  Who here has read White Knight so far?  Yah, Elaine doesn't think exactly the same way as Harry when it comes to the use of magic, but at the same time though they are not exactly on a totally different page either.  It's significant that they both have the same symbol.  It says something about what they think and what they believe.


He may have given it to her but it doesn't really sound like he did. I'm not sure.

[Griffyn612]

In the early books you mention that Elaine has the same pentacle as Harry.  Is that significant or have you changed your mind on?

No it's significant.  There is a reason for that.  Harry and Elaine come from the same philosophical background as far as magic is concerned... Or at least so he believes in any case.  I guess we will have to see if Elaine thinks the same way.  Who here has read White Knight so far?  Yah, Elaine doesn't think exactly the same way as Harry when it comes to the use of magic, but at the same time though they are not exactly on a totally different page either.  It's significant that they both have the same symbol.  It says something about what they think and what they believe.


He may have given it to her but it doesn't really sound like he did. I'm not sure.

That's not the one I was thinking of.  I don't think I'd read that one.

[Quantus]

That's not the one I was thinking of.  I don't think I'd read that one.

Ahh, come on, I posted that one like four replies in to the thread. 

( )

[Griffyn612]

Ahh, come on, I posted that one like four replies in to the thread. 

( )

Don't you know I don't read entire threads.  Just cherry-pick posts here and there.  Ain't nobody got time for that. 

[Quantus]

Don't you know I don't read entire threads.  Just cherry-pick posts here and there.  Ain't nobody got time for that. 

Bah, I say.  Bah. 

[Fcrate]

Don't you know I don't read entire threads.  Just cherry-pick posts here and there.  Ain't nobody got time for that. 

That's cold. I commiserate with you Quantus

[Kindler]

I see two possibilities.

First, the philosophical background comment concerns Harry's mom and Elaine's parents/parent. The pentacle doesn't make sense as representative of Harry's philosophy, as he didn't pick it; it was inherited. If anything, he based his philosophy on his understanding of what it represents. Does that make sense to anyone else? If it held any innate philosophical meaning, it would be based on the one who makes it. So, if Elaine's amulet is inherited, then I think it'd say more about her parents—maybe that they were allied, or familiar with, Margaret (for reference, I always call Harry's mom "Margaret" so I can keep references to her separate from Harry's daughter, Maggie). Couple the pentacle with her potential to be a Starborn, and I think it's a fair guess that her parents knew what Maggie was trying for, and did the same—either as allies, or rivals. It's no accident that both Harry and Elaine were orphaned, too; I think it's likely that they were both orphaned because of their births—essentially, because of who their parents were and what they were trying to do.

But Harry really learned his philosophy from Ebenezer; Elaine didn't have that kind of apprenticeship. She went from being abused by Justin to working for Summer, and I somehow doubt that the Fae taught her much like Eb taught Harry.

On the other hand, I can see it as Elaine emulating Harry, dating back to their time together with Justin. Elaine has modeled her life on the only purely positive thing in it (that's alive, anyway): Harry. Harry understood her—they were both orphans, both fostered by an abusive mentor, both orphaned again when that mentor tried to dominate them, both in dutch to the Fae (though Summer and Winter separately), and each other's first everything. Elaine, like Harry, didn't have much to latch on to for stability, so they latched on to each other. Hell, even after Elaine came back to this plane, the first thing she does (assuming she isn't Kumori) is set up shop as a wizard private detective, just like Harry.

Anyway, I think it's perfectly plausible to speculate that Elaine made her amulet based on Harry's when they were together, trying to mimic the one thing in her life that was stable, present, and happy.

[wardenferry419]

I, still, have a sneaky feeling that Justin was Elaine's real father and not adopted father. The amulet is Harry's link to his mother and Elaine's amulet is her link to Justin.

[Fcrate]

But Elaine was adopted after Harry was. Are you suggesting that he had her hidden somewhere?

[groinkick]

But Elaine was adopted after Harry was. Are you suggesting that he had her hidden somewhere?

Could be that the mother had taken her, even hidden away from Justin with her and when he found her....  You can imagine what he'd have done.

[Kindler]

Could be that the mother had taken her, even hidden away from Justin with her and when he found her....  You can imagine what he'd have done.

Yeah, it's possible she was raised by a single parent, away from Justin, who eventually tracked her down.

That possibility aside, I find it very hard to believe that Justin wouldn't use his biological paternity as leverage against Elaine in his manipulation; orphans are starving for familial affection. If Justin told Elaine that he was her father, he very, very likely wouldn't have ever felt the need to even try to thrall her.

[Avernite]

I see two possibilities.

First, the philosophical background comment concerns Harry's mom and Elaine's parents/parent. The pentacle doesn't make sense as representative of Harry's philosophy, as he didn't pick it; it was inherited. If anything, he based his philosophy on his understanding of what it represents. Does that make sense to anyone else? If it held any innate philosophical meaning, it would be based on the one who makes it. So, if Elaine's amulet is inherited, then I think it'd say more about her parents—maybe that they were allied, or familiar with, Margaret (for reference, I always call Harry's mom "Margaret" so I can keep references to her separate from Harry's daughter, Maggie). Couple the pentacle with her potential to be a Starborn, and I think it's a fair guess that her parents knew what Maggie was trying for, and did the same—either as allies, or rivals. It's no accident that both Harry and Elaine were orphaned, too; I think it's likely that they were both orphaned because of their births—essentially, because of who their parents were and what they were trying to do.

But Harry really learned his philosophy from Ebenezer; Elaine didn't have that kind of apprenticeship. She went from being abused by Justin to working for Summer, and I somehow doubt that the Fae taught her much like Eb taught Harry.

Uhm, Harry learned his philosophy from Ebenezar, sure - but partly so did Margaret, his mother, even if she clearly veered off quite a bit from Ebenezar's ideas. Hence there's a pretty good chance her pentacle means exactly what Harry thinks