The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Queen Succession Rules
raidem:
We know that generally speaking the rules for succession goes as follows: Lady=>Queen=>Mother. I, in another thread, wondered about the circumstances of the events in which the last time both Queens of Winter and Summer died, but for the purposes of this thread, I'm just focused on Summer since Mother Winter has remained constant and Mother Summer has abdicated at some point.
So, here it goes. What would happen if all three Summer mantles at the same time became vacant. Mother Summer abdicated, Queen and Lady died all at the same time. The succession rules then are temporarily moot. I would imagine each mantle then would seek out vessels based on a particular priority list which has a series of considerations. The priority list could include appropriate reflections relative to the mantle, potential of the individual, proximity, and others. I don't think they would necessarily have to wait for the Lady to first get a vessel to ascend, thereby freeing the others to choose.
What do you guys think? What are some other issues of succession you can come up with?
Note: This thread sprang from another thread where I proposed a situation where the Murphy Family Reunion gets transported 1000+ years into the past. This event would be potentially similar to when Milwaukee vanished in the Unseelie Incursion in 1994 and was replaced with forests untouched by civilization. I tied it in with Murphy's eventual ascension to Mab, Mother Summers (Mrs. Spunklecrief) abdication, Mother Murphy's ascension to Mother Summer, Murphy's sister ascension to Titania, and the morphing of many members of the Murphy clan into the sidhe or other members of the NeverNever, etc.
Arjan:
the Lady mantles search for suitable vessels and pass them through.
raidem:
So your saying the Mother and Queen mantle would have to wait for the Lady to choose prior to the Mother and Queen being filled. I could see that being the case.
There is one precedent that could argue against that. Namely, we have WOJ that the original Queens of both Courts established there base of power using the Stone Table. So, they together were 'originated' at the same time therefore there was one occasion in which the Mother was never the Lady nor the Queen. For all we know, the requirement of the Mother may require she to be a Mother or a Grandmother, and the Queen a Mother, and the Lady not either. The last case we have is a strong argument based on Molly's short story where there is a prohibition for the Lady to procreate or attempt to procreate without either ascending, which in this case wouldn't be a problem, or unmaking the Lady mantle.
First off, I'm referring only to the mantles not the person in this paragraph. I think the more likely case is that the Mother would seek out it's appropriate vessel. The Queen seeks out it's vessel. And, the Lady seeks out it's vessel. All this occurs concurrently not consecutively with the Lady being the conduit to the greater ranks.
Arjan:
But I think the restrictions could have been brought into place after the original maiden, mother, crone mantles had been split into their winter and summer halves.
raidem:
Just a note, I often type then post then add to so as to ensure my comment is at least posted. So, you may respond prior to my complete comment being viewed. :)
I believe there were two original maidens, mothers, crones that shared power that was once unified. I believe there was a WOJ that suggested Winter and Summer triads establishing their base of power rather than the three you suggest. There was a suggestion too that the original Fates were divided into halves but I think that is a bit separate than the individuals participating in creation of base of power with stone table.
Oh, you said mantles not individuals. I think if you go further back in time than what I was talking about above you come to the point you describe below:
--- Quote ---But I think the restrictions could have been brought into place after the original maiden, mother, crone mantles had been split into their winter and summer halves.
--- End quote ---
I still don't think that the Queens would allow there to be that vulnerability to the succession. During that time of the succession, there would be no Mother, Queen until a successive Lady process could work out. You could save some time by short cutting that restriction and allowing some flexibility in the rules. Another vulnerability would be that if the Outsiders could simply contain or compromise this Lady during that time somehow, they'd stalemate an entire court however briefly til she broke free. I'm thinking she'd could be getting all three mantles at once maybe?
That actually brings us to the next question. Can one of the Queens hold another Queen mantle?
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