The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Nicodemus wants to be God
groinkick:
--- Quote from: Ananda on November 21, 2017, 01:29:07 AM ---My point about her sincerity was that she was speaking honestly and openly about herself and her goals. She is not a witless puppet, but a willing participant in giving her life to help save the universe. That she may not have all information is rather beside the point. There and then, she is selfless and willing to sacrifice for the greater good.
--- End quote ---
Here is why I think the highlighted section may be wrong. Nicodemus believes God is going to lose. He said words to the effect that because God believes in love, he's going to lose. Nicodemus has some sort of end game. His end game may be to either rise to a god himself, or to ally with someone who will be a god, or is already a god. It's also possible he has a plan that will force Hades to give up his daughter.
What I'm saying is I don't believe she is actually sacrificing herself for some greater good. I believe that the plan is Nicodemus will come back for her, and she will rise again, and be by his side. Her sacrifice will be a temporary one, and for their own power, and not some greater good.
wardenferry419:
--- Quote from: Arjan on November 21, 2017, 04:21:49 AM ---Historically as far as I remember those punishments were only for a few special cases and the greek gods were never described as all good. For the rest it was just a grey and boring place.
for the real eternal sadism you have to go to later religions.
--- End quote ---
I think Deirdre warrants special case consideration. But, yep, I agree with Arjan completely.
Ananda:
--- Quote from: Arjan on November 21, 2017, 04:21:49 AM ---Historically as far as I remember those punishments were only for a few special cases and the greek gods were never described as all good. For the rest it was just a grey and boring place.
--- End quote ---
I’m familiar with the greek pantheon (my favourite plays are from Aeschylus). I was addressing the other posters’ glib take on doling out eternal torture and the practical reality of engaging in it in this fantasy world. It’s very easy to say someone deserves this or that, but, if one thinks what she is saying through, then such casual pronouncements might be more haltingly made or, better yet, not be made at all.
For the greek gods, Niobe is proof enough of what capricious and terrible beings they could be in the myths. I thought the portrayal of Hades was far too congenial.
--- Quote ---for the real eternal sadism you have to go to later religions.
--- End quote ---
Definitely.
forumghost:
Eh, Hades was always much more... professional? as far as Greek Gods go. He was mostly too busy making sure the trains in Hades ran on time to stir up trouble the way his brothers did.
Now if Harry had ran into say, Poseidon, then I would expect shit to start flowing downhill at a rapid pace.
Ananda:
--- Quote from: groinkick on November 21, 2017, 05:10:01 AM ---Here is why I think the highlighted section may be wrong. Nicodemus believes God is going to lose. He said words to the effect that because God believes in love, he's going to lose. Nicodemus has some sort of end game. His end game may be to either rise to a god himself, or to ally with someone who will be a god, or is already a god. It's also possible he has a plan that will force Hades to give up his daughter.
What I'm saying is I don't believe she is actually sacrificing herself for some greater good. I believe that the plan is Nicodemus will come back for her, and she will rise again, and be by his side. Her sacrifice will be a temporary one, and for their own power, and not some greater good.
--- End quote ---
You’re talking about Nic. I’m talking about Deirdre. She is her own person. I think you’re conflating the two.
Deirdre became aware of the universe’s peril. Deirdre acquired information regarding a way to avoid said peril. Deirdre decided she would sacrifice herself to enact the method. Deirdre committed to and engaged in a selfless act to save the universe.
Nic may have his own counsel, method and motive, but that’s Nic, not Deirdre. Think of the potential for irony if she came back with the jesus mantle and they were at odds, thus proving “The best laid schemes o’ Mice an’ Men Gang aft agley”.
On the topic of Nic, he may be right that the god mantle holder’s plans are incorrect. Maybe he would do a better job in that role? However, more irony potential, the mantle may be one that moulds the holder such as the winter court roles and thus, in the long term, Nic would become what he fought against through his own actions.
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