The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
Murphy in Peace Talks (WoJ spoilers)
KurtinStGeorge:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on August 24, 2017, 01:47:06 PM ---I don't know how far she assumed she'd keep them; when it comes to the Swords, "the foreseeable future" is murky as hell. Most likely, she was waiting for some kind of sign. In the end, though, Amoracchius was exactly where it needed to be, and Fidelacchius ended up new and improved and in the hands of a new Knight.
--- End quote ---
Allow me to explain what I meant in more detail. Murphy's attitude was rather inflexible. She appeared to have no doubts. She didn't say that she had concerns that needed to be assuaged or that the matter of the swords might be explored at a future time. Murphy could have even told Harry that he had told her where the swords were hidden, she had taken possession of them when Harry disappeared, and until she received a sign someone else was meant to hold them, she would assume she was meant to. Isn't this what you suggest she may have been thinking? Also, it's not a question of how events eventually played out, it's how Murphy handled the situation. A person can make the right move, but do so for the wrong reasons or perhaps I should say, do so in an offensive or capricious way.
huangjimmy108:
--- Quote from: Mira on August 10, 2017, 05:52:50 PM ---I don't think that would work at all. Mainly because Murphy has always been a front line type of fighter, prided herself on that fact. That was a lot of her charm, not just steadying Harry, but pulling his cookies out of the fire on several occasions.. I doubt she'd ever be happy as a desk jockey...
--- End quote ---
She does take pride in it, but as long as you are a normal human you must retire eventually.
Any professional i.e: a cop, a soldier, an athelete etc, no matter how much they take pride in their profession and skills, they will have to stop in the end due to old age if not for anything else.
In other words, this pride issue Murphy is facing is an issue every single normal person will have to face. If everyone else has to face it, so does Murphy. It is only fair.
If she is crippled when she is 25, maybe it will be a hard blow. The flower will be wilted before it's even bloom, so to speak. But Murphy is in her mid fourties. Sure, the retirement was forced on to her a few years early, but considering the circumstances she couldn't continue as she had much longer anyway, or she'll likely be digging her own grave, and I strongly suspect Murphy herself realize it. With her injury, she can now retire with a clear conscience.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: huangjimmy108 on August 25, 2017, 11:40:55 AM ---She does take pride in it, but as long as you are a normal human you must retire eventually.
Any professional i.e: a cop, a soldier, an athelete etc, no matter how much they take pride in their profession and skills, they will have to stop in the end due to old age if not for anything else.
In other words, this pride issue Murphy is facing is an issue every single normal person will have to face. If everyone else has to face it, so does Murphy. It is only fair.
If she is crippled when she is 25, maybe it will be a hard blow. The flower will be wilted before it's even bloom, so to speak. But Murphy is in her mid fourties. Sure, the retirement was forced on to her a few years early, but considering the circumstances she couldn't continue as she had much longer anyway, or she'll likely be digging her own grave, and I strongly suspect Murphy herself realize it. With her injury, she can now retire with a clear conscience.
--- End quote ---
Ya, having come from such a saturated Cop family, I have to think she is well familiar with the eventual transition. Whether she liked it or not, she knew it was coming and likely prepared herself at least to some degree.
For that matter, I suspect she got out in the field a lot less than we might suspect, being in charge of SI. She was always there when /Harry/ got called in, and we know she was there for major operations without him. But in the day-to-day and week-to-week of managing a department, she wouldnt have been needed to be behind a desk more days than not.
Mr. Death:
--- Quote from: KurtinStGeorge on August 25, 2017, 08:22:06 AM ---Allow me to explain what I meant in more detail. Murphy's attitude was rather inflexible. She appeared to have no doubts. She didn't say that she had concerns that needed to be assuaged or that the matter of the swords might be explored at a future time. Murphy could have even told Harry that he had told her where the swords were hidden, she had taken possession of them when Harry disappeared, and until she received a sign someone else was meant to hold them, she would assume she was meant to. Isn't this what you suggest she may have been thinking? Also, it's not a question of how events eventually played out, it's how Murphy handled the situation. A person can make the right move, but do so for the wrong reasons or perhaps I should say, do so in an offensive or capricious way.
--- End quote ---
Harry's own behavior matters and influences how Murphy approaches things. She had to be inflexible there -- putting it as you say, Harry would've been able to argue. ("You told me where the swords were hidden and I took them when you disappeared," "Well, I'm back now, I say give them back.") She wasn't looking for an argument. She doesn't have to tell him everything she's thinking and feeling -- she has a goal in the conversation, and she's acting toward that goal.
There's a lot going on in that conversation beyond just the Swords and Bob. Murphy is, in her own way, testing Dresden. She's dealt with things that looked and sounded like Dresden before, and this could be even worse than an imposter -- the actual Dresden on Mab's leash. She knows Dresden about as well as anyone in Chicago can, so she pokes him and sees how he reacts.
By the end of the conversation, I think she's convinced that he is still Harry Dresden -- but she can also see that he's in a very dark, rough place at the moment. You can even see where the shift happens -- after he punches the wall then sags in disgust at himself, she's suddenly very understanding and tender. I think, in that moment, she realizes what Harry could have done, what he very nearly did -- but that he didn't.
When you think about it, confronting the Winter Knight alone, unarmed, when you're like half his size? That's either gutsy as hell or very trusting that he's not actually going to hurt you.
--- Quote from: DonBugen on August 25, 2017, 03:11:19 AM ---So I'll get to the big meaty response in 12-18 hours, but I just wanted to give a refutation and an observation.
Clearly, Sanya gets his divine instruction from bourbon , not vodka. :p
--- End quote ---
Hey, in God, all booze is equal.
--- Quote ---Second,
I've thought so. And I also think it's telling that in the first time that Michael offers Dresden the sword in skin game, he doesn't offer it as a custodian - he offers Dresden to use it as a wielder, to save his daughter. And Harry says no. I think that it's in this moment that Harry really proves that he could, one day, be a wielder. It's not like he's faithless. Remember that he can burn red Court vampires with his amulet through the power of belief in magic. In this "God is Three Blind Men and an elephant" universe, I think that counts for something.
--- End quote ---
I imagine for Harry, it's also hard to remain truly faithless when he's literally spoken personally to an Angel on several occasions.
As for Harry as a wielder... in the right circumstances, maybe. I don't think he's cut out for a permanent position, though. I don't see him wanting to save the Denarians any more than Murphy is. Maybe even a little less willing.
Mira, do you intend to respond to my or KurtinStGeorge's posts? We both asked you some questions, and I think we'd both like them answered.
Arjan:
--- Quote ---When you think about it, confronting the Winter Knight alone, unarmed, when you're like half his size? That's either gutsy as hell or very trusting that he's not actually going to hurt you.
--- End quote ---
Yes, that. She took serious risks there for him.
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