The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
WK Mantle or Lawbreaker taint?
Mr. Death:
I'm probably off on this, but I'm as allowed to get in a good WAG as anyone. And I fully expect the same level of scrutiny I show y'all, so bring it on.
Consider the following:
1. Per Word of Jim, effect is as important -- sometimes more important -- than intent when it comes to breaking one of the laws. I.e., if you mean to kill someone with a fireball, but miss, you're impacted less than if you mean to just trip someone with a wind blast and they fall and break their neck.
2. Harry already has Black Magic taint from using magic to kill; possibly not only Justin, but the deaths at Bianca's house.
3. When he cast the Red Court Explode spell, it affected half-vampires.
4. Some of those half-vampires were really old, and their losing their half-vamp-ness caused them to immediately die.
5. Ergo, Harry caused the deaths of humans en masse when he cast that spell.
So, post Cold Days, what are the chances that his sudden murderous tendencies aren't just the Winter Knight mantle -- what if it's also the Black Magic taint from killing dozens of humans with that spell messing with his head?
Discuss, prove me wrong.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on June 29, 2017, 08:02:58 PM ---I'm probably off on this, but I'm as allowed to get in a good WAG as anyone. And I fully expect the same level of scrutiny I show y'all, so bring it on.
Consider the following:
1. Per Word of Jim, effect is as important -- sometimes more important -- than intent when it comes to breaking one of the laws. I.e., if you mean to kill someone with a fireball, but miss, you're impacted less than if you mean to just trip someone with a wind blast and they fall and break their neck.
2. Harry already has Black Magic taint from using magic to kill; possibly not only Justin, but the deaths at Bianca's house.
3. When he cast the Red Court Explode spell, it affected half-vampires.
4. Some of those half-vampires were really old, and their losing their half-vamp-ness caused them to immediately die.
5. Ergo, Harry caused the deaths of humans en masse when he cast that spell.
So, post Cold Days, what are the chances that his sudden murderous tendencies aren't just the Winter Knight mantle -- what if it's also the Black Magic taint from killing dozens of humans with that spell messing with his head?
Discuss, prove me wrong.
--- End quote ---
I would argue that Point #4 falls into the same category as lethal Wards, where there was not magic specifically targeting a person Mortal with lethal intentions. I think the key mentioned in that WOJ (a recent one not in the index, Im looking) even if there is an eventual death, there was never a specific Choice made to "Kill". He didnt Kill them, he freed them from a magical parasitic force that was trying to consume their Souls; after that Nature took its course (and it's Due), but Id argue that isnt on him.
Aminar:
Intent might not matter much, but belief might. Guilt might? And I don't think Harry feels nearly as guilty about killing those people as his murder of Susan. Who wasn't mortal and thus doesn't really count for lawbreaking. But might because of how he feels.
Either way, the murderousness is winter. He describes it in tandem with the lust(which wouldn't be from lawbreaking) too often. I feel like that would be an unpleasant and cheap twist beneath Jim's talent. A gotcha moment.
Smaug with OCD:
I would buy this argument. Though, I would like to further posit that the murderous urges are the mantle, and his ability to dismiss killing with magic so easily is due to taint. For example, when he kills the guy in the Hunt during the chase scene, and when Harvey dies*. And, for support, I would like to throw in Molly and Harry's conversation in Denny's during Ghost Story. Molly says something along the lines of "It's easy... it shouldn't be so easy..."
*Yes, he gets upset about Harvey, but he shrugs it off pretty easily compared to beginning-of-the-series Harry.
Snark Knight:
--- Quote from: Quantus on June 29, 2017, 09:24:54 PM ---I think the key mentioned in that WOJ (a recent one not in the index, Im looking) even if there is an eventual death, there was never a specific Choice made to "Kill". He didnt Kill them, he freed them from a magical parasitic force that was trying to consume their Souls; after that Nature took its course (and it's Due), but Id argue that isnt on him.
--- End quote ---
That's why I don't really find the "effects matter more than intentions" WOJ sensible. The explanation of warlock soul tainting is that to cast nasty spells, you have to convince yourself it's right, and causing the warping of ethical standards. How can that be sensibly applied to unanticipated collateral damage?
But in terms of the elimination of the Red Court and the subsequent deaths of most of the Fellowship half-turned losing their protection against aging, no, I don't believe Harry could have acquired any warlock taint from that. Why? Because he didn't cast the spell - the Reds' sorcerers did that themselves; he and Susan just hijacked its targeting by giving it her blood instead. It didn't take any act of magic (the Red King tried to send one of his warriors to sacrifice Maggie, and Susan would have stabbed herself but for losing control of her hands during the transformation) at that point.
Now, that's not to say it didn't have fairly hideous moral repercussions anyway - but it didn't inherently change the specific dimension of how Harry interacts with magic in an addictively mind-altering way.
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