The Dresden Files > DF Spoilers
New Blackstaff discussion
groinkick:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on June 28, 2017, 02:25:46 PM ---1. He killed the people who went after his wife (and thousands of others who happened to be nearby; I think it was the volcano he made erupt).
2. He killed the people who went after Harry
3. He killed 200 mercenaries working for the people who were trying to kill Maggie.
The first is obviously personal. The second he admits was completely personal. The third is something that the Merlin had specifically told Harry he didn't want done.
We don't know what the other hits were, but of the ones we have, none seem to have been ordered by the White Council.
And even if they did give orders, Ebenezer self-admittedly has full autonomy to ignore them.
--- End quote ---
Ok you're quoting a book that hasn't even been written. You can't use that as evidence. Unless you want to link WOJ that flat out says the only reason he targeted a group was because they were targeting his wife, and no other reason.
He targeted the Red Court, and Ortega who was behind the attack. He didn't hit Ortega until after the attack on Archangel that killed a huge number of council members including a Senior Council member. If that isn't an act of war I don't know what is. You have used Eb's words as evidence. Here are some more. He said the attack was for Simon.
He killed 200 mercenaries working for the Red Court who the White Council was at war with. They were trying to unleash a bloodline curse that would assassinate a Senior Council member. He was also helping leading an attack against the senior leadership of the Red Court. Would he have done all this if it was purely to save his granddaughter? Probably, but that's not evidence because the attack in question was hugely important. So important that Odin showed up. Did Odin get involved just for Maggie too? What about TWG? A KoTC was there, was TWG only there for Maggie as well?
Mr. Death:
--- Quote from: groinkick on June 28, 2017, 05:31:36 PM ---Ok you're quoting a book that hasn't even been written. You can't use that as evidence. Unless you want to link WOJ that flat out says the only reason he targeted a group was because they were targeting his wife, and no other reason.
--- End quote ---
It's not going to be in a book as far as I know. It was WOJ. I don't have the link, but I'm looking for it. I know it's out there. Maybe I need to summon Serack...
--- Quote ---He targeted the Red Court, and Ortega who was behind the attack. He didn't hit Ortega until after the attack on Archangel that killed a huge number of council members including a Senior Council member. If that isn't an act of war I don't know what is. You have used Eb's words as evidence. Here are some more. He said the attack was for Simon.
--- End quote ---
I just quoted and bolded the bit where he says he did it directly because Ortega was coming after Harry again.
He didn't hit it after Archangel. He hit it a solid year or more after Archangel, and his stated immediate reason was that Ortega was coming to kill Harry. It's right there, still on the page.
--- Quote ---He killed 200 mercenaries working for the Red Court who the White Council was at war with. They were trying to unleash a bloodline curse that would assassinate a Senior Council member. He was also helping leading an attack against the senior leadership of the Red Court. Would he have done all this if it was purely to save his granddaughter? Probably, but that's not evidence because the attack in question was hugely important. So important that Odin showed up. Did Odin get involved just for Maggie too? What about TWG? A KoTC was there, was TWG only there for Maggie as well?
--- End quote ---
Everyone else's motives aren't really germane.
What we have is the Blackstaff participating in an operation that's Grey Council -- an organization that Ebenezar formed explicitly to go around the White Council. And an operation that the Merlin himself said shouldn't be happening.
You can't point at Ebenezer's secret attack with his secret organization that he's kept secret from the White Council and is going against the stated will of the White Council as an example of Ebenezer following the orders of the White Council.
Rasins:
--- Quote from: Mr. Death on June 28, 2017, 07:00:37 PM ---What we have is the Blackstaff participating in an operation that's Grey Council -- an organization that Ebenezar formed explicitly to go around the White Council. And an operation that the Merlin himself said shouldn't be happening.
You can't point at Ebenezer's secret attack with his secret organization that he's kept secret from the White Council and is going against the stated will of the White Council as an example of Ebenezer following the orders of the White Council.
--- End quote ---
Well, now that's not entirely the case.
If you'll recall, when Harry was talking to the Merlin in the Worry Room, along with Luccio and Molly, Langtry said that they were going to hit the Rampires so hard, that they were going to take them out, "root and branch".
That sound pretty much like they were planning on doing something really big and taking out all of the Rampires. That sounds an aweful lot like an all out offensive or a black ops mission. Given the talks going on with Arianna in Edinburgh, I'd say it was a Black Ops mission. And I'd bet that Ebenezar is the head of the Black Ops for the Council.
On to the other subject.... The blackstaff has been given the office to defy the will of the Council when they see fit. This does not mean that He cannot go along with the will of the council, even though the will of the Council may need to be secret. It just means that they cannot ORDER him to do something and expect him to blindly fulfill the order.
The example given in text was his NOT killing Harry when he was apprenticing him.
Now, was the hit on Ortega in Casa Verde a sanctioned Council attack, or a personal one ... Who knows? But we do know that Ortega was the war general for the Rampires, so he's a prime target. In reality, there is no reason why it couldn't have been BOTH, sanctioned AND personal.
Quantus:
--- Quote from: Rasins on June 28, 2017, 07:52:19 PM ---Well, now that's not entirely the case.
If you'll recall, when Harry was talking to the Merlin in the Worry Room, along with Luccio and Molly, Langtry said that they were going to hit the Rampires so hard, that they were going to take them out, "root and branch".
That sound pretty much like they were planning on doing something really big and taking out all of the Rampires. That sounds an aweful lot like an all out offensive or a black ops mission. Given the talks going on with Arianna in Edinburgh, I'd say it was a Black Ops mission. And I'd bet that Ebenezar is the head of the Black Ops for the Council.
--- End quote ---
OK, Ive seen this theory come up from lots of different folks, and I have to say I hate the argument to the very core. A Boast about a vague future goal Abstract Declaration Victory does NOT allow you to claim credit!
It's like if the US President were to say "Im Going to Defeat North Korea" and then a few days later china Bombed it off the map, and then suddenly the White Houses Supporters start trying to claim the credit. Except in this example China would exist and have originally been formed specifically to avoid US involvement.
Mr. Death:
The White Council is capable of fielding hundreds of Wardens.
If you're going to wipe out an enemy "root and branch," you send those hundreds. Not 12 guys.
Or you drop a satellite on them when they're all sitting in the same spot.
Dropping in on Chichen Itza like that only makes sense if the goal was to get Maggie Jr. out and it did not have official White Council support. While the Merlin would support wiping out the vampires, he didn't care one bit about Maggie Jr. and wouldn't want to use up resources and favors on an attack with such a minuscule chance of success, and whose success ultimately depended on a bunch of factors the Merlin couldn't have counted on.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version