The Dresden Files > DF Reference Collection
Has Mab become something more? [CD Spoilers]
Rasins:
--- Quote from: 123456789blaaa on March 06, 2013, 06:02:48 PM ---The WoJ wasn't from Mabs perspective. It's not Mab herself saying that. It is a direct statement from the author that Mab wouldn't give a crap if she had to sacrifice anyone in Winter.
Mab can have feelings. Those feeling will be along the lines of appreciation or sadism. Not things like sentiment or love.
Maeves had feelings yes. They were feelings entirely in line with her Mantle. I didn't see Maeve being kind or sentimental.
--- End quote ---
I don't see it that way. I believe that she DOES give a crap, but that if it were necessary she wouldn't have any problem with it. Not the same as not caring about it. Then when you involve family, feelings are really different. She was OBVIOUSLY upset about having to have her daughter killed. Not that she wasn't going to do it, but she didn't want to do it. It was necessary and it served as a statement to the supernatural community. Both that she was even willing to do what needed to be done, even against family, and that her knew Knight could handle it.
matolilyfu:
--- Quote from: Ms Duck on March 06, 2013, 07:11:32 PM ---I have to disagree with your conclusions here. Sometimes the person most willing to sacrifice themselves and everything they have is the person driven by love.
Mab knows that if she fails, the outsiders will eat everything on earth. she will sacrifice herself and every soldier under her command to stop this.
the difference between a monster and a hero is what your are willing to die for.
--- End quote ---
I'm having trouble with your line of thinking here, (although Ms Duck, you have my utmost respect). I think Mab guards the Gate because it is part of what she is. There is nothing to even hint she cares in the slightest for Earth or mortals - both are inconsequential, except for rare occasions when she can utilize one mortal or another toward her purpose. The outsiders are a threat to the fae as much as humankind, but I genuinely don't know if that matters to Mab. She is who and what she is and does what she has to do in whatever ways she deems appropriate, (those ways, imo, are often objectionable).
I followed other threads where posters argued that Mab shouldn't be considered evil, because she isn't human and evil is a human concept. I have trouble not thinking of Mab as evil, because I am human and think in those terms. But as I am not above self-contradiction, I cannot imagine thinking of Mab as heroic, (another human concept), even if she were to die and by doing so saved Earth and humankind. Is it heroic to die and happen to save something that means nothing to you at the same time?
--- Quote from: Arjan on March 06, 2013, 07:24:51 PM ---You doubt Mother Winters word? She can not lie you know ;D
--- End quote ---
Titania can't lie either and she said Mab believes in reason, logic and calculation and MW said Mab is a too much of a romantic. I get sooo confused.
Rasins:
--- Quote from: matolilyfu on March 06, 2013, 09:39:19 PM ---I followed other threads where posters argued that Mab shouldn't be considered evil, because she isn't human and evil is a human concept. I have trouble not thinking of Mab as evil, because I am human and think in those terms. But as I am not above self-contradiction, I cannot imagine thinking of Mab as heroic, (another human concept), even if she were to die and by doing so saved Earth and humankind. Is it heroic to die and happen to save something that means nothing to you at the same time?
--- End quote ---
You mean kind of like equating Mab to a grenade. It's purpose is to blow something up and kill. If in doing so, it ends the war, is the grenade a hero?
Typically no.
At the same time, a grende while extremely dangereous, it it not evil. It just IS.
matolilyfu:
--- Quote from: Rasins on March 06, 2013, 09:43:34 PM ---At the same time, a grende while extremely dangereous, it it not evil. It just IS.
--- End quote ---
A grenade has one purpose - it go BOOM. It makes no determination of the appropriate time to go boom. It makes no determination of the appropriate place to go boom. It makes no determination of the appropriate way to go boom. A grenade just IS, but Mab IS, while making determinations.
Mab had to prove to Harry that his debt had been transferred to her, so she caused him to stab himself in the hand with a letter opener. Then (SK) -
--- Quote ---"Your hand yet pains you?" she asked.
"What do you think?"
Mab placed her gloved hand on my wounded one, and a sudden spike of sheer, vicious cold shot up
through the injury like a frozen scalpel before lancing up my arm, straight toward my heart. It took my breath, and I felt my heart skip a beat, two, before it labored into rhythm again. I gasped and swayed...
"I did that just for spite."
--- End quote ---
Then regarding the punishment of Lloyd Slate (Changes) -
--- Quote ---"For a time, I was contented to torment him to the edge of sanity. Then I set out to see how far over the edge a mortal could go."
--- End quote ---
Yes, I know he committed treason. Yes, I know she needed to deter others from acting against her. But...
I have a difficult time getting the warm and fuzzies for Mab, imaging she's regrowing a soul, or even amassing a big bunch of respect for her, when I consider many of the "appropriate" methods she employs to achieve her purpose.
Ms Duck:
the difference is this grenade is self aware, and while we can debate morality or soulness has made decisions that limit civilian casualties as well as placed herself in considerable danger at times.
there is some one home there, folks.
;)
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