Author Topic: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience  (Read 16569 times)

Offline Deadmanwalking

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Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« on: January 19, 2013, 10:28:45 PM »
So, when statting several truly ancient creatures in OW, the creators of the game have notes like 'All other skills should be considered Fair'. For true ancients, this seems a reasonable way to do things, and hardly unbalancing, considering how rarely lower-ranked skills will come up. However, it runs into a bit of a problem: What if you want to play something that old?

Not necessarily something powerful mind you, just old. Old enough to have that kind of...breadth of experience. I think this is a perfectly reasonable concept, and have been thinking about how to properly reflect it mechanically. I have an idea...but it seems like it might not quite work and I'd like some thoughts on it. Obviously, barring really weird situations, this power could only be purchased at character creation. So:

Inhuman Experience [-2]
Description: You have lived longer and seen and done more than mortals are capable of. Hell, you've seen and done more than many immortals. You are either several centuries old or at least a century and very active indeed.
Musts: None, but you must usually have some power enabling you to live an extended period of time, at least centuries, such as Wizard's Constitution, Living Dead, or Inhuman Recovery.
Skills Affected: Almost all of them.
Effects:
Seen And Done So Much: Your skill default, the part below your pyramid, is raised from Mediocre to Average. In addition to the Refresh cost of this power, you must invest 10 skill ranks into this 'lower strata' to pay for this breadth...but your remaining skill costs are reduced appropriately (ie: buying a skill to Fair is only one skill rank, a skill at Great only 3). You must still obey the standard skill pyramid rules on purchased skills and your pyramid cap is unaffected. If you possess, or come to possess more than 40 'base' skill ranks (before this power's reduction), one in four must go towards maintaining this power at it's current level. So if you have 48 skill ranks, this power's cost will rise to 12 skill ranks total.

Supernatural Experience [-4]
Description: You have lived longer and seen and done more than many supernatural creatures are capable of, and more than most immortals ever bother with. You are either something like a millennium old or at least a few centuries and very active indeed.
Musts: None, but you must usually  have some power enabling you to live an extended period of time, at least several centuries and more likely at least a millennium, such as Living Dead, or Inhuman Recovery. Wizard's Constitution is not usually sufficient for this level.
Skills Affected: Almost all of them.
Effects:
Seen And Done So Very, Very Much: Your skill default, the part below your pyramid, is raised from Mediocre to Fair. In addition to the Refresh cost of this power, you must invest 20 skill ranks into this 'lower strata' to pay for this breadth...but your remaining skill costs are reduced appropriately (ie: buying a skill to Good is only one skill rank, a skill at Superb only 3). You must still obey the standard skill pyramid rules on purchased skills and your pyramid cap is unaffected. If you possess, or come to possess more than 40 'base' skill ranks (before this power's reduction), one in two must go towards maintaining this power at it's current level. So if you have 48 skill ranks, this power's cost will rise to 24 skill ranks total.

Mythic Experience [-6]
Description: You have lived longer and seen and done more than almost any being on the planet. You are either several millennia old or at least a millennium and very active indeed.
Musts: None, but you must usually have some power enabling you to live an extended period of time, at least one thousand years and more likely several thousand, such as Living Dead, or Inhuman Recovery. Wizard's Constitution is not usually remotely sufficient.
Skills Affected: Almost all of them.
Effects:
Seen And Done It All: Your skill default, the part below your pyramid, is raised from Mediocre to Good. In addition to the Refresh cost of this power, you must invest 30 skill ranks into this 'lower strata' to pay for this breadth...but your remaining skill costs are reduced appropriately (ie: buying a skill to Great is only one skill rank, a skill at Superb only 2). You must still obey the standard skill pyramid rules on purchased skills and your pyramid cap is unaffected. If you possess, or come to possess more than 40 'base' skill ranks (before this power's reduction), three in four must go towards maintaining this power at it's current level. So if you have 48 skill ranks, this power's cost will rise to 36 skill ranks total.

And a downside, available at all levels (though more appropriate the older you are):

Not Keeping Up With The Times [+1]
While you may've seen and done a great deal, none of it involved these newfangled computers and car things. Unlike your other skills, your Driving remains at Mediocre, and your Craftsmanship, Guns, and Scholarship, while they do rise, and may indeed be any rating, are considered to be Mediocre for purposes of dealing with modern technology such as computers, actual surgery, or automatic weapons.
.
.
.
So...thoughts? I'm really unsure on the costs, basically. I know what I want the powers to do...I'm just not so sure on the execution.

EDIT: Upped the skill point cost from a flat 10 (which is how it started out) to the current sliding scale. Just for the record.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2013, 09:09:27 AM by Deadmanwalking »

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2013, 10:38:30 PM »
You know, I've been wanting to do something like this for ages. But I was never really able to come up with a cost I could call fair.

So yeah, I'd like to help here.

I can't tell by looking whether those costs are fair. But I can make characters with those Powers, and we can see whether they're balanced.

So I'll do that sometime soon.

PS: I'd remove the Musts, if I were you. They exclude some character concepts that a lower skill floor would be appropriate for.

Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2013, 10:43:17 PM »
Musts are always a little iffy. What concepts did you have in mind? I mean, I guess there are ex-immortals...but I could fix that by adding an 'or have had at one point' or something like it.

And I ran some hypotheticals through my head at various power levels and felt like I might be over-costing things...but I keep coming back to how awesome having everything at, say, Fair or Good is. It's hard to pin down.

Offline Sanctaphrax

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2013, 10:50:05 PM »
I was thinking of somebody like the Archive, who has oodles of knowledge from some external source. Or somebody possessed by a whole bunch of ghosts with varying skills. Or somebody who's got magical super-luck that makes them succeed at everything.

Or somebody like Marcone. Marcone's OW write-up has an incredible number of skill points...in order to be a playable PC without a Power like this, he'd need a preposterous amount of Refresh.

There are also some heroes who are just ridiculously good at everything for no good reason. See: Batman.

Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2013, 10:53:09 PM »
Okay, you've talked me into it. Edit will be done momentarily.

EDIT: And changed from a requirement to a recommendation.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2013, 10:55:31 PM by Deadmanwalking »

Offline narphoenix

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2013, 11:52:20 PM »
Your skill rank costs are off. There are 25 skills. Inhuman Experience should require spending 25 skill ranks, Supernatural needs 50, and Mythic needs 75.
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Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2013, 12:01:16 AM »
Your skill rank costs are off. There are 25 skills. Inhuman Experience should require spending 25 skill ranks, Supernatural needs 50, and Mythic needs 75.

Right...if they had no Refresh cost. The listed cost is what you have to pay in addition to the Refresh cost. So a Submerged character who bought Supernatural Experience would have 15 skill points to spend.

It's meant to be an actually purchasable and usable ability, after all.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2013, 12:32:19 AM by Deadmanwalking »

Offline narphoenix

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2013, 12:23:12 AM »
Oh. I see.
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Offline Mrmdubois

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2013, 01:16:51 AM »
I love this idea for a Power.  I always liked playing skill monkeys.

Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2013, 01:51:06 AM »
Yeah, I'm a bit in love with it myself. It's getting it to work right that's the trick...

Offline narphoenix

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2013, 02:20:03 AM »
Also, you may not want the refund to include all of driving. What about those who can drive chariots and stuff?
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Offline blackstaff67

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2013, 02:21:33 AM »
weird situations, this power could only be purchased at character creation. So:



And a downside, available at all levels (though more appropriate the older you are):

Not Keeping Up With The Times [+1]
While you may've seen and done a great deal, none of it involved these newfangled computers and car things. Unlike your other skills, your Driving remains at Mediocre, and your Craftsmanship, Guns, and Scholarship, while they do rise, and may indeed be any rating, are considered to be Mediocre for purposes of dealing with modern technology such as computers, actual surgery, or automatic weapons.
.
.
.
So...thoughts? I'm really unsure on the costs, basically. I know what I want the powers to do...I'm just not so sure on the execution.

Ah, the GURPS equivalent of "Hidebound."  I was wondering if anyone would ever bring that up.  Pretty sure that applies to several members of the White Council in addition to some other powerful critters
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Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2013, 02:28:54 AM »
Well, strictly speaking, I'd just give most of them no ranks in any of those skills that seemed inappropriate and maybe Compel them not to use Scholarship on some stuff. You only really need the drawback on those who would otherwise have every skill at something beyond Mediocre.

Offline Haru

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2013, 02:35:00 AM »
You are basically giving 15 skillpoints for 2 refresh here. If you look at Mimic Abilities, it can give you 2 skills of a target for 2 refresh. If you say that skills cap at fantastic (which, going from the sample characters seems reasonable), that would be 12 skillpoints for 2 refresh. Which means you are in roughly the same territory, and the additional 3 points can easily be justified by saying, that they are not maxing skills out like Mimic is doing.
So the cost seems fine for now, it might seem too little if you actually test it. You could easily adjust this to a more "jack of all trades" power, if you require 15 skill points per 2 refresh locked down instead of 10, so the rest of the skills would not go up that much.

How do you want to treat skillcaps? Inhuman experience + feet in the water would allow for a superb skill easily, since it would actually only be a great one in price. If you've lived long enough, like the power suggests, you would have certainly have had the time to become a real pro in at least one profession. Seems a good fit to allow that with the power.

I would not exclude driving as well, mostly because it also includes navigation in a city and knowing the streets and such, which you can easily do without driving a car, especially, if you've walked those streets long enough to literally have left grooves in the pavement. You can still have it be mediocre for everything that involves moving a modern vehicle.
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Offline Deadmanwalking

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Re: Brainstorming a Power: The Benefits of Experience
« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2013, 02:45:41 AM »
How do you want to treat skillcaps? Inhuman experience + feet in the water would allow for a superb skill easily, since it would actually only be a great one in price. If you've lived long enough, like the power suggests, you would have certainly have had the time to become a real pro in at least one profession. Seems a good fit to allow that with the power.

It explicitly doesn't change maximum skills. I think doing so is...a bad idea. At least at the current cost.

I would not exclude driving as well, mostly because it also includes navigation in a city and knowing the streets and such, which you can easily do without driving a car, especially, if you've walked those streets long enough to literally have left grooves in the pavement. You can still have it be mediocre for everything that involves moving a modern vehicle.

You can use other skills for that stuff except actual driving, though. And I felt like at least one skill should be actively removed.