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vultur:
Soulfire's canon writeup doesn't actually mention any evothaum, which makes it not really worth -3 to a spellcaster (It's still worth -5 to a nonspellcaster, since it includes all Thaumaturgy, but if you already have that...)

Although, the "downgrade all toughness powers by 1" is impressive... but still, there should be some evothaum.

I don't think it necessarily needs all thaumaturgy as evothaum, just somewhat broader than say Seelie/Unseelie is good. Maybe wards, healing and conjuration? Those fit its themes well IMO.

Sanctaphrax:

--- Quote from: Hick Jr on June 18, 2014, 06:13:21 PM ---2. I strengthened it because Hellfire's extra benefit is sort of terrible. Should I cost it up to [-5]?
--- End quote ---

Maybe. I'd prefer reducing the bonus a little, though.

Thematically, I think it's more appropriate for Hellfire to be hard to control. So I don't think the extra shifts should be auto-controlled. Tighten up the list of spells they apply to (attacks only, maybe?) and I think that'd be fair-ish for an extra benefit.

Another idea: Hellfire could let you take fallout without reducing the power of your spell. That'd make it optimal for the user to focus on power over control, and for them to inflict ridiculous amounts of damage to their surroundings when fighting. Might be abusable if unlimited, though.


--- Quote from: Hick Jr on June 18, 2014, 06:13:21 PM ---3. Soulfire is unquestionably the most powerful sponsored magic, but what about it seemed too powerful?
--- End quote ---

Everything together. Full thaumaturgy, full evothaum, an extra-good Extra Benefit, and it satisfies a common catch to boot. Magics get bumped up to -5 just for having an exceptional Extra Benefit, never mind all that other stuff.

Anyway, whether the evothaum is actually there or not is debatable. Thematically I feel like it fits, but balance-wise is tricky. The writeup says that Soulfire provides the full range of thaumaturgical spells, and I'm not quite sure how to parse that. I feel like evothaum might be part of that range, but it might not be.

Hick Jr:
The "hard to control" thing is incredibly clunky mechanically, though. It forces you to drop another Refinement or focus slot into control unless you want to have constant fallout. If the bonus was refocused so it only applied to spells involving pain, harm, doom, or destruction, would that be a [-5] Sponsored Magic? It's basically a broad stunt, so I wouldn't terribly mind reducing it to an auto-controlled +1 bonus.

I don't really understand what you mean by "fallout with no Power reduction". It kind of sounds like what I want out of it, but I'd need a little more clarification before making a final decision.

You know, I never even noticed that Soulfire doesn't grant evothaum. I think it should be wards, healing, conjuration, and maybe some kind of angelic counterpart to diabolism?

Sanctaphrax:
Doesn't seem any more clunky than any other power/complexity bonus, to me.

By fallout with no power reduction, I mean you could take shifts of fallout to mitigate a poor control roll without weakening your spell.

Hick Jr:
For me, taking Hellfire meant I had to reallocate all my foci for a situation that I wasn't always spellcasting for (hurting people).

Tell me if I'm wrong here: Tessa throws a Hellfire-lightning bolt at Weapon:11. Her control roll is only +8. She takes three shifts of fallout, but the spell is still Weapon:11?

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