Solutions to nerf Fly

[Discipol]

Since one can just fly a zone upwards and shoot downwards until the enemy is dead, also making one immune to melee attacks, Fly is OP at just -1 cost.

My friend had the brilliant idea to add another skill called Flight for one that purchases Fly. Of course, assisted with some trappings, like fly-by attacks and perhaps using another skill to limit the Flight skill.

For example:
Athletics, for angelic wings.
Conviction for Green Lantern sort of flight source.
Craftsmanship for jet pack (say an item of power).
Lore for some sort of passive magic effect (something I would expect from Leanasidhe).
Etc...

I am adding the need to raise Fly to -2.

Your thoughts?

[admiralducksauce]

Flight might be a bit overpowered, but you can counter it a bit.

Guns are pretty easy to come by, especially for villainous minions.  Put the sword down and use an assault rifle.

Flying makes you a target, a target that pretty much everyone on the ground can fire at.

Flight doesn't actually let you move any faster.

[Discipol]

Add Inhuman Speed or more, pump Athletics to 4. It ignores obstacles and ground related maneuvers like, dunno, quicksand.

[The Mighty Buzzard]

Simple, remind them that a consequence taken while flying could very well leave them unable to fly.  No need to nerf it when a minor consequence could very well leave them taking a severe or extreme consequence (or even be taken out) from the subsequent fall.

[Discipol]

Flying implies considering 3d zones and falling damage calculations. If the player risks the GM keeping score of all that, he should expect to die Seriously, warning a player sounds like "I am limiting how much fun you have due to ambiguous rules".

[Arcteryx]

Guns are pretty easy to come by, especially for villainous minions.  Put the sword down and use an assault rifle.

Don't need a gun when you've got Ye Old Lightning Bolt^tm If you don't have the Speed powers, keeping up the flying would be a supp. action with a -1 penalty too. But tactically... yeah, someone made the point, flying folks make tempting targets. Keep it up often enough and your opposition will either start bringing in their own aerial support, or have a solution to help mitigate it.

I don't really see a need to bump up the cost any... just reasonably address it within the game's story.

[Discipol]

Its -1. Suppose all pcs get it. All melee enemies with no guns or magic are toast.

[The Mighty Buzzard]

Flying implies considering 3d zones and falling damage calculations. If the player risks the GM keeping score of all that, he should expect to die Seriously, warning a player sounds like "I am limiting how much fun you have due to ambiguous rules".

More like warning them ahead of time not to get cocky and think it makes them invulnerable so they don't piss and moan if gravity kicks their ass.  I'd feel a bit of a dick doing it without warning but I have no problem burying someone's character because they did something astoundingly stupid after I've given them a heads up on possible consequences.   YMMV

[ARedthorn]

Flying implies considering 3d zones and falling damage calculations. If the player risks the GM keeping score of all that, he should expect to die Seriously, warning a player sounds like "I am limiting how much fun you have due to ambiguous rules".

No- but warning them that they might have to make some sort of concentration check/equivalent any time they take a consequence would be both appropriate and provide a challenge.

I do like the idea of forcing some sort of new athletics trapping for flight as a stunt- those who don't take it can still fly, just not well.
Increasing the base cost to -2 on top of that, less so. Your concern about stacking flight with inhuman speed and high athletics is fair- don't get me wrong, but by that point, they've paid for it, and probably dumped so many of their points into it, that it may be their character's defining trait. Stomping on that by increasing cost even further is just as bad as applying your own house rule that limits function.
Making all that nifty power risky though... that's both system and Dresden appropriate.

And if a player STILL abuses it, truthfully, you have the kind of player that could abuse anything if they wanted to, and probably will... so your options are to either completely rewrite the system, kick them out of your game, or plan for it.

EDIT:

Its -1. Suppose all pcs get it. All melee enemies with no guns or magic are toast.

If all your PCs get it, then I, as GM would assume they were expecting a more aerial campaign, and would give them that. That means more aerial enemies who can overcome that limitation, and some potentially very fun dogfighting style scenes. Again- it's for you to plan around it- to both make sure anything they purchase is useful & fun, and occasionally dangerous & fun. It's easier, as GM, to do this from the head of the table than from the rulebook, IMO.

[Discipol]

+4 Athletics is both springing on ground, dodging bullets, etc.

Flying as a new skill would eat all those +4 points.

[polkaneverdies]

Your main complaint seems to be that opponents who can only attack if they are close are at a serious disadvantage. You are right and they should be at a major disadvantage for limiting their own options so severely. This is only exacerbated when they are fighting someone with a supernatural power that allows them to create that separation.
 If you don't want your pcs to get off that easily then have them fight guys with assault rifles, or spell slingers, or whampires with the at range upgrade, or super strength guys who can throw a bus at them.
 You are trying to nerf a power so that one limited class of folks can face them on a more equal footing. The problem is it shouldn't be equal because the flyers are attacking them in their offensive weak spot.

[EdgeOfDreams]

Not all fights occur on a flat, featureless plain with no ceiling.  Flight becomes substantially less meaningful indoors, in heavy fog (can't see more than a zone away), underground, etc.

Inhuman Speed + Wings and taking a high Athletics score is a 3-refresh combo that allows a player to OFTEN (not always) avoid melee attacks and overcome zone borders, as well as be pretty hard to kill in general.

Inhuman Toughness + Inhuman Recovery, a high Endurance score and 1-point catch is a 3-refresh combo that allows a player to take massively more punishment in a fight and head into the next one almost or completely healed, not to mention being potentially nigh-immortal in terms of age, disease, etc.

Evocation and taking decent Discipline and Conviction is a 3-refresh combo that allows a player to throw fireballs, cause earthquakes, and create shields of pure energy.

Thaumaturgy and taking decent Lore, Discipline, and Conviction is a 3-refresh combo that allows a player to summon spirits, craft magic items, exorcise demons, track his enemies, call down curses, and build magical traps.

Honestly, by comparison, I don't see a problem with Wings.

[Sanctaphrax]

Wings is definitely a bit overpowered. It obviates several types of challenge, provides immunity to falling damage, gives the user a significant advantage in combat and beats up Spider Walk for lunch money.

So it's probably worth 2 refresh. 3 is a bit much, but not out of the question. No need for a new skill.

PS: The overpowered-ness of Wings is pretty easy to ignore in play, like many balance problems. I wouldn't expect it to break a game.

[Discipol]

Here take this +100 Vorpal Sword. Now melee the flying archer to death.

[gojj]

While it is true that flight does make you immune to ground based maneuvers it make you vulnerable to whole new ones, like if the day is exceptionally windy those on the ground would be annoyed but not particularly hampered while the airborne person could get swept around. And in order to attack anyone you'd need to fly into their zone anyway so you'll either be vulnerable till your next turn or take the -1 to fly up again. And if you had a way of attacking from a few zones away (gun, breath weapon) you would be rather conspicuous flying around unloading a pistol or breathing fire. Basically the person with flight could easily get compelled to fly to high and have some frightened mortal call the cops, drawing unwanted attention. I know these downsides are nearly all situational but I feel they add up enough to justify the -1 cost. Personally I feel that Crafters and those with the full Incite Emotion tree have a better chance of being OP than flyers.