An unusual veil

[Belial666]

Is it possible to make a veil that instead of hiding something, makes it impossible to watch?

I.e. instead of making something invisible, to make it glow so powerfully that it is impossible to look at? The base effect would be the same - others would be unable to tell exactly where the caster is. The drawback is that the caster is definitely NOT incospicuous. The advantage is that the "veil" is not an illusion - it is very real light that blocks vision by blinding it so powers that see through illusions would not help.

[Papa Gruff]

Yes it is. It even gets mentioned in the novels. Watch out Turn Coat spoilers!

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In "Turn Coat", in one of the instances when Harry enters his apartment to find Morgan, Mouse, Molly and Lucio all tangled up, Capt. Lucio states, that Molly blinded her. Molly defends herself by stating that she didn't blind Lucio, but veiled everything that wasn't her. Then Lucio tells her of for it, stating that it is an unreasonably complex way to do it. Molly answers in saying that it isn't complicated for her to do it (witch is absolutely astonishing if you ask me).

So it seams that you can blind some one by veiling things from them. In game terms I'd treat this as flavor. It would just be a blinding maneuver through evocation like every other. The description is what counts here. I don't see any advantage for doing a blind through a veil, nor do I see a disadvantage.

[mostlyawake]

I've seen a fire shield that worked by making the caster so freaking bright he hurts to look at for targeting, and incinerates the incoming bullets.  So it seems like you could make that into a veil pretty easily.

[babel2uk]

In the section on Spirit in the rule book it flat out says that you can use spirit to create blinding light. I'd say that what you're talking about is more along the lines of a Spirit maneuver on the object than a veil. After all, as you said, you're not actually making invisible, you're just making it painful or impossible to look at - which would seem to be accomplishable by simply placing 'Blinding Light' as an aspect on the object and the GM compelling everyone in the vicinity based on that aspect.

[Belial666]

Yeah, but would the GM compel said aspect? An aspect does not have to be compelled.

On the other hand, instead of a veil, I could make it a block against perception.

[babel2uk]

Yeah, but would the GM compel said aspect? An aspect does not have to be compelled.

Well, I'd kinda expect the GM to have a very good reason not to compel that aspect against any NPC with eyes that was attempting to do anything that required looking at the object. If they're blind firing at it then they're acting as though they're compelled, if they're ignoring the aspect they'd better have bought the compel off. It's like having the aspect of 'pitch black' on a scene and having NPCs ignore it with no valid reasoning. If an aspect like this isn't being compelled then the GM isn't doing their job.

On the other hand, instead of a veil, I could make it a block against perception.

From YS page 252

an evocation based veil, for example, is often done as a block, but what it blocks isn’t damage, it’s perception

But I think I see what you mean - rather than using a maneuver to place Blinding Light as an aspect on the item, you'd just do a standard block with the flavour that it's a bright light. The difference being of course that once someone beats the block the light vanishes, where as placing an aspect on it potentially has a much longer duration.

[Belial666]

I don't mind if the evocation block would vanish - just if it is doable. My character has Soulfire so she's doing it as a thaumaturgy at the speed of evocation instead and thaumaturgy veils/wards don't go away if breached.

[MyNinjaH8sU]

Maybe check out the Rules for Glamours? The veil there doesn't go away, and efforts to detect it are opposed with Disciple/Deceit. Maybe something to work from?

[Becq]

A variation on this concept would be the SEP Field ("Someone Else's Problem" Field), found in Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy, replacing cloaking devices.  You remain plainly visible, but nobody notices you because a tiny bit of their brains determines that you are someone else's problem, and therefore refuses to acknowledge you in any way.

The problem with this, though, is that it is probably a violation of the Laws, given that you are altering not what they see, but how they react to what they see.

As to the effect you're describing, it sounds to me as though you could get the effect you want by nailing the target with a Consequence ("Temporary Blindness").  This would be easily modeled by a damaging Spirit (light) attack.  Or an AoE version thereof.  You could then use your free compel to keep them from seeing you (or anything else) long enough to get away.

[Ophidimancer]

A variation on this concept would be the SEP Field ("Someone Else's Problem" Field), found in Hitchiker's Guide to the Galaxy, replacing cloaking devices.  You remain plainly visible, but nobody notices you because a tiny bit of their brains determines that you are someone else's problem, and therefore refuses to acknowledge you in any way.

The problem with this, though, is that it is probably a violation of the Laws, given that you are altering not what they see, but how they react to what they see.

If such minor mental effects were violations of the Laws of Magic, then so would Harry's

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Potion of Unnoticeability in Fool Moon.

  I rule that mental nudges and suggestive emotional effects don't count as enthrallment, because they don't control they just suggest, and thus don't break the Fourth Law.

[Drashna]

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Specifically, that potion made Harry so dull to everyone, that nobody even noticed him.  While it's not exactly a veil, it's also not exactly entering somebody's mind.  It's definitely a "grey" potion.

Oh, and as for blinding light: changes spoiler

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Molly's "One Woman Rave" spell. That's pretty much the entire point of it. Confusion and distraction.

[Ophidimancer]

A veil is a Block against perception, and that potion blocked notice.  I'd say it is a veil.  Veils don't always necessarily mean invisibility.