The Lightsaber Spell.. :o ::)

[ironchicken]

Sorry, my understanding was the OP wanted to evoke a sword in combat.

Conjuration and summoning are Thaumatergy and can't be used in an action scene, its too slow. If the OP wants to stop before he knows he is going to fight and create or summon that's fine but if he intends to draw in an action round its a huge spell outside the scope of normal evocation.

I think the best way to have a weapon like a light sabre is an enchanted item. Figure out the casting cost for a conjuration and then spend that many item slots.

Thaumatergy spell, Iwould say:
3 shifts for creation of a basic weapon 1
+2 shifts for weapon 3
+ a number of shifts for each special effect (agree with GM). This could be things such as fulfilling catches.

So if your Lore were 5 you could use a single conjured item slot to have an item that summons a blade of fire weapon: 3 once per session.

Extras on top of this just use more slots.

Draw and use.


 

[finnmckool]

That seems fair. It only takes 3 total shifts for a weapon 3? I thought it was a double pay thing (6 shifts gets you weapon 3) or is that an armor thing I'm thinking of?

[Deadmanwalking]

That seems fair. It only takes 3 total shifts for a weapon 3? I thought it was a double pay thing (6 shifts gets you weapon 3) or is that an armor thing I'm thinking of?

Actually, with Conjuration, it's no more shifts for Weapon: 3 than Weapon: 1...you're just conjuring a real weapon, and it needs to be sized appropriately to it's damage. But yeah, you're thinking of Armor.

[ironchicken]

DMW is correct about conjuration being conjuration. I was thinking more a standard sword is weapon 1 or 2 and adding damage would add shifts.

In addition the sword would be made of ectoplasm and therefore I am not sure would satisfy any catches. That might cost more shifts.

[finnmckool]

Ah well, since I'm not conjuring a literal sword so much as a physical shape to contain fire wouldn't that change things a bit? This is, again, kinda the crux of the thing. The whole "sword" meme is really throwing off the perception of the result. It's a fuego spell in a tube you can hit people with. So the damage would be dependant on the power you put into it on creation I would think.

[CMEast]

Ah well, since I'm not conjuring a literal sword so much as a physical shape to contain fire wouldn't that change things a bit? This is, again, kinda the crux of the thing. The whole "sword" meme is really throwing off the perception of the result. It's a fuego spell in a tube you can hit people with. So the damage would be dependant on the power you put into it on creation I would think.

Indeed, my suggestion below assumes an ectoplasmic handle with a blade of fire. Ritual is capable of producing fire and ectoplasm so I see no reason why this couldn't work.

----------------

Whether the OP is using an enchanted item for this, or whether it's a ritual he casts to create the weapon, both requires a high Lore and so we'll assume a Lore of 5.

1) A ritual. 2 shifts for complexity and 3 for power to create a Weapon:3 sword. It can be an elemental blade, like fire or spirit, or ectoplasm if you like, so it can satisfy a fire catch but it couldn't satisfy a silver or cold iron catch. It's default duration is one scene or 15 minutes, whichever is shorter. You can add additional shifts for more damage (increasing the heat of the blade or whatever) or duration, or to add an aspect like 'burning blade', but then the ritual will take additional preparation, right now it is only 5 shifts of complexity so you could do it in 5 minutes. This would be more useful if you had sponsored magic.
Benefits - it is easy to replace, doesn't take up item slots, it's form can change to satisfy catches. Can be used for defence against weapon and fist attacks.
Drawbacks - takes time to create, it's a relatively low weapon value without lots of shifts

2) An Enchanted item.
An innocuous looking silver rod, about the size of a mobile phone and wrought with cunning runes, when activated a beam of fire leaps out of one/both end/s
Let's assume two enchanted item slots as you can't do much with half a focus item.
A Weapon:5 attack, three times a session.
A Weapon:4 attack, five times per session
A Weapon:6 attack, once a session.
You choose what kind of damage it will do at creation i.e. it's a fire blade. The actual item might just be the hilt and so it's a small object, easily hidden. Once you're out of free uses you can still activate it, but it requires one mental stress each time.
Benefits - can be used without preparation, it's easier to contruct. With a lore of 5 you can get it up to weapon:10 with additional slots, does more damage, might look like a sword but isn't one and so can be used at a distance (think force throw with it flying back to you, or just launching the blade only), can use discipline to hit
Drawbacks - takes up slots, form can't change, can't be used for defense*

*stick another slot in for a block and you can, like so:
2 enchanted slots -
  Weapon:4 attack, three times per session
  Defensive Block:5, once per session.
Again, you can take inspiration from the jedi as the blade leaps to defend you from bullets, spells and in close combat.

[finnmckool]

Oooo I like the enchanted item!

The defensive block, while cool, is something I'm thinking of handling in a different manner for another character I have in mind. You see the ability to block stuff with a lightsaber is really more about reflexes than item itself, it seems to me. So I'm kicking around a hyper-aware "Jedi Reflexes" version of defense, a la Elaine. Someone mentioned a "Jedi Knight" build earlier in this thread so now I'm gonna come up with a "sorcerer" who's got all this skill but no frame of reference. He's a nerd, so he builds all his magical mojo around the notion that he must be a Jedi. Hilarity ensues. Until he whoops someone's ass. Because he's a Jedi, and they're badass. The little nerd that could.

So you get a limited skill set that'll grow into a major, focused talent.

[Deadmanwalking]

A Weapon:4 attack, five times per session

This version should only be 4 times per session, dropping Strength only adds one use (unlike adding Item Slots, which do indeed add two).



The Conjuration version as an Enchated Item would be a mere 3 shift effect, and thus have 5 uses per day (assuming Superb Lore), and last the scene, but is only Weapon: 2 or 3. I see no reason the incidental effects wouldn't remain valid, though. Ectoplasm can clearly be any temperature, so a blow-torch like item using superheated ectoplasm should work fine.

[finnmckool]

If it lasts longer than one exchange shouldn't I be able to "spin" it into a defensive thing in certain scenarios, ie: attacks normally blockable by a "lightsaber" type item? Fire attacks of equal or lower level, projectiles of less damage, melee weapons, etc if I make an appropriate skill check, like weapons?

[CableRouter]

If it lasts longer than one exchange shouldn't I be able to "spin" it into a defensive thing in certain scenarios, ie: attacks normally blockable by a "lightsaber" type item? Fire attacks of equal or lower level, projectiles of less damage, melee weapons, etc if I make an appropriate skill check, like weapons?

Projectiles?  Not really. In "Star Wars", Jedi defend at the speed of plot by being able to see the future and having the universe itself put their lightsabers where they need to be.  There is no way in the world that a creature short of Mythic Speed is going to have the necessary reflexes to stop bullets and laser beams with a sword.  And even if you could see the future, you still won't be fast or precise enough in combat to get the blade where it needs to be.  At typical combat ranges a handgun bullet will need about .03 seconds to reach it's target after being fired.  You can't move a sword far in .03 seconds and if the attacker double taps, you'd need to be able to stop time to get the sword in place to stop the second bullet.  Even something like a thrown baseball would get to you in under a third of a second from 30 feet, cut that time by 1/3 if a pro is throwing the ball.

As for fire, most ranged fire attacks seem to be of the gout of flame variety, trying to stop a 1' wide burst of flame with a 2" wide sword would be an painful exercise in futility.

As an actual sword, sure, I'd allow you to block melee attacks as usual.

[finnmckool]

Those are fair points, though I still want the guy to have Jedi reflexes (or close to) as a defense, a la Ellaine (as I mentioned). He may not be able to deflect projectiles from a machine gun, but I think I'll give him one very well aimed bullet. But little to do with the blade itself.  However your objections have little to do with the make up of the blade itself, so while they're noted in general, I still think that means it's possible, just not likely. Or only possible under specific proscribed circumstances.

[luminos]

Unless you are paying the complexity price to be able to do all of those things (blocking gun shots with a sword would either by a exceedingly high complexity ritual, or just flavor text for a seperate defensive spell), you can only really use the enchanted item sword for what the enchanted item is built for.  If its a conjuration, then it only does sword things.  If its an attack, it only attacks and doesn't get duration.   etc. etc. etc.   What it sounds like is that you want it to do a bunch of things based mainly on the Rule of Cool, which is awesome, but isn't supported by the mechanics in a way you are willing to work with.  There are very good reasons for those mechanics, because if its able to do the things you want it to, then why would anyone want to do anything else?  What would be the point of playing a vanilla mortal if a magic user gets everything he can dream up without regards to the balance created by pre-existing mechanics?

Seriously, just give the guy some kind of custom power, -2 or -3 sounds right for everything you want the sword to be able to do, and don't give yourself a headache over it.  It might not be the kind of power a PC would get access to, but thats why you don't mix GM'ing with PC'ing. 

[finnmckool]

Again, it's not an actual sword. It's a bar of fire. So it could conceivably block whatever a thick bar of magic fire could block i would think. Remember, a light saber is NOT a sword, and I'm trying to make a lightsaber. Not a sword. And a sword CAN block a bullet, it's the PERSON who can't do it. It's certainly possible for someone in this game to be able to intercept projectiles, even bullets. Likely? No. But we are talking about magic here.

Mechanically I'm talking about using the spin rule to change an attack into a defense. The example the book gives is the opposite of what I'm talking about, spinning his shield into an attack. Why wouldn't the reverse work?

[luminos]

What you are referring to is not the spin rules.  You are referring to using an evocation already in place that hasn't been used yet that round, to have an effect different from what it was originally cast as.  Your lightsaber won't mimic an evocation effect the way you want to use it, so I don't think you can use it like that.  If your GM (when you actually have someone GM this character) decides otherwise, then sure, you can block with it, but changing the effect like that will use up the spell, so you'd have to summon it again to use it again.

[finnmckool]

ehhhhh it's not an evocation, exactly...It's a conjuration holding an evocation in it. It persists from round to round.