Author Topic: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council  (Read 1375 times)

Offline groinkick

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A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« on: October 13, 2021, 07:23:28 PM »
The White Council has come to realize the Black Council is real.  They kicked Dresden out knowing that eventually he would be contacted by the Black Council to be recruited.  They want Dresden to accept, and go undercover (they will hold something over him to do it).... 
Stole this from Reginald because it was so well put, and is true for me as well.

"I love this place. It was a beacon in the dark and I couldn't have made it through some of the most maddening years of my life without some great people here."  Thank you Griff and others who took up the torch.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2021, 09:21:02 PM »
Really? What are they going to hold over him? He has plenty he can hold over them. They touch his daughter and thatís the end of them, ask the Red Court and the Titan if you can find them. In the supernatural world, Harry is a one man nuclear power, they donít want him inside and they donít want him outside. Harry is just going to do now what he he feels is best and screw the White Council, and frankly his judgement has been better than theirs. That is what is terrifying the Merlin, that Harry has been right all along, and that he the Merlin has got it wrong.

The Black Council are equally terrified of Harry for pretty much the same reason, they are not going to recruit him.



Offline Mira

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2021, 09:52:29 PM »
The White Council has come to realize the Black Council is real.  They kicked Dresden out knowing that eventually he would be contacted by the Black Council to be recruited.  They want Dresden to accept, and go undercover (they will hold something over him to do it)....

It would be nice if they let him in on the plan.. ::)

Offline Ed0517

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2021, 02:49:06 AM »
Nah, they want Harry to join the Black Council.

Look at Harry's allies....

Susan - dead
Murphy - dead
Michael - crippled.
Shiro - dead
Thomas - last seen badly injured, probably dying

... hanging with Harry is like wearing a red shirt on Star Trek - and you are not an engineer.

Offline Mira

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2021, 03:08:44 AM »
Nah, they want Harry to join the Black Council.

Look at Harry's allies....

Susan - dead
Murphy - dead
Michael - crippled.
Shiro - dead
Thomas - last seen badly injured, probably dying

... hanging with Harry is like wearing a red shirt on Star Trek - and you are not an engineer.

Yeah, but two current Holy Knights and one retired Holy Knight very much alive.. Marcone has been on and off, now mostly off ally.. Lara of the White Court, Major General Toot and the minions of the Za'Gard, Mac, Gard, Rashid, Rivershoulders, Eb, Listens to Wind... So Harry isn't down to zero exactly yet.

Offline RobReece

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2021, 03:33:10 AM »
I think BG really injected steroids into their fear of Harry.  Now they know he has the power of The Warden, The Winter Knight, Consort to the ruler of the White Court, his own fae minions (the display of Toot and Co over the castle), the Spear of Destiny and he's building his reputation as The Wizard of Chicago.   That's a significant power base.

Offline vincentric

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2021, 04:58:34 AM »
Only Marcone, Anna and Demonreach know he has the Spear. The other immortals on the battlefield probably sensed it and Odin may know through Murphy but no one on the Council saw it in use.

Offline Con

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2021, 09:52:41 AM »
I mean it could be a Cold War esque Spy novel.

Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy.

The only person you trust not to be Black Council is the one not currently on the White Council.

He's outside the Circus so isn't one of the leaks.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2021, 11:46:34 AM »
Only Marcone, Anna and Demonreach know he has the Spear. The other immortals on the battlefield probably sensed it and Odin may know through Murphy but no one on the Council saw it in use.

The Council know very little about what Harry actually has, they suspect he has the Eye, but donít know about The Spear, the Crown, the Placard, the Shroud, Amorrachius, or Bob. They have been looking for Bob for decades as their number 1 dangerous artefact, now number 2, thanks to the Eye, but as Bob would say ďthatís flattering, but I donít even make the top five in Harryís collectionĒ

I am waiting for the scene where Eb confronting Harry draws on the Blackstaff, only for Harry to reveal the Spear of Destiny ďnever bring a staff to a Spear Fight.Ē

There was so much magic in BG, I doubt anyone felt it. Harry purposely didnít think of it to avoid detection during BG.

They think Harry having the Eye makes him a Nuclear Power, but he already was one, they just didnít know or suspect it.

Offline groinkick

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2021, 07:39:05 PM »
It would be nice if they let him in on the plan.. ::)

Well to make something convincing you would not let him in on it until the last second.  So his actions are totally natural.  It also allows them to monitor him to see if he actually is Black Council. 

Who are his friends on the Council?

McCoy
Gatekeeper
Listens to Wind
Martha Liberty
Lucio who is either captain of the Wardens, or near the top.

I could see where McCoy and the others are using the Councils fear of Dresden to their advantage.  Let the Council kick him out, and then monitor if someone tries to contact him.  The Grey Council fears the White Council has spies.  So allow Harry to get kicked out, and see if someone tries to contact the Starborn, Warden, Winter Knight, and holder of powerful weapons.  I mean how could the Black Council not enquire about Harry as an ally with all that power?
Stole this from Reginald because it was so well put, and is true for me as well.

"I love this place. It was a beacon in the dark and I couldn't have made it through some of the most maddening years of my life without some great people here."  Thank you Griff and others who took up the torch.

Offline Ed0517

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2021, 07:31:28 AM »
I wouldn't classify Martha Liberty as a friend. More as not generally opposed. She's a swing vote. He had her sometimes, other times not. I don't think she is "He means well, if not always doing it the right way" like Eb or LtW or Rashid, but not assuming the worst like Mai and Langtry.  She's a skeptic who will look at each case.

I don't think Luccio has an official role any more. She lost her captaincy when she lost most of her power and her old body.  We don't know who is captain now. Could be Carlos, but I think more likely a more senior Warden like Berserkergang.  Or Mai's icepop warden that we later saw with the temple dog statue

Offline Mira

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2021, 11:00:09 AM »


  I think Harry has three friends on the Senior Council and all were absent when they voted, Eb, Listens, and Rashid..


I think Luccio is still head of the Wardens, I don't remember her being replaced in any of the texts.  Though she needed a lot of rehab as of Turn Coat because of what Peabody did to her.  At the same time though she needed rehab because of the damage done by Peabody's ink, they'd keep her in her post.  Why?  Scandal, it was bad enough that they had all been compromised by the ink, they wanted to limit the damage.  That is why they were setting Morgan up to be the fall guy for LaFortier's murder even though Harry had proof of his innocence.

Offline Conspiracy Theorist

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2021, 05:37:09 PM »
Those three together could sway Martha Liberty, the swing vote.

Luccios position of Captain was built on her being a powerhouse, and the fact only she could make the Wardens Swords, she can do neither now, so I suspect she is in the structure,  but not in the field, weakening her influence markedly. Her deputy Morgan is gone, most of the Old Guard too, Carlos is the most trusted of the New Guard, but isnít a powerhouse. The Wardens are probably at their weakest in centuries. The worry might have been that Harry as a Warden would become the de facto Captain and a candidate for a vacancy on the senior Council.

Thinking on it, the one Wizard most likely to be able make a new Warden Sword in the future is The Warden, Harry. He has the power and has shown he is good at making magical artefacts. He has also had a good look an unravelling, the Spear, The Swords as well as an interest in the nature of magical swords, and Charity is well versed in the physical process of making weapons. Put Harry, Charity and Butters together they could probably make one. Although I suspect they would look a lot like something out of LOTR.

If Harry were to make Warden Swords and mint his own Wardens when the White Council canít that would be yet another reason for the White Council not to be Wild About Harry, and put him in the de facto Captaincy.

I suspect Harry wouldnít  make himself a Sword, but would make a Warden blade capable of fitting to his staff when he doesnít need the Spear or risk it in conflict. A Sword is something else to juggle with a staff,
Blasting Rod, and gun. Thinking about it, canít Harry also make his new Blasting Rod attach to his staff for maximum power? Convert the stored kinetic energy in the staff into a superpowerful blast of fire? But still use it on its own, giving him effectively handgun and rifle options with it.

Offline Basil

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2021, 01:28:59 AM »
I've posted before that I think only Merlin and Ancient Mai were actually able to attend the meeting that expelled Harry.  Moreover, given what we know about the Senior Council operates, Merlin controlled the proxies of all non-attending SC members.  We KNOW that McCoy, LTW and even Christos (whom I think is not BC, actually) were damaged in the fight.  Liberty was there, but we don't know if she was injured. 

There was a great deal of controversy at that meeting -- at least judging by the fact that Carlos had been screaming at people during the meeting.

I don't think that Merlin kicked Harry out to flush out the Black Council.  I don't think Merlin really wants to admit to the existence of the Black Council, and honestly, it don't see much evidence of their acting up recently.  After Harry's "death" it's been Fomor this and Fomor that.  Perhaps the Black Council receded to allow the Fomor to occupy everyone's attention.  Now that Harry has destroyed the Fomor -- and he did destroy them -- the Black Council will get active again. 

I'm inclined to think that Merlin kicked Harry out thinking that he could control Harry by enticing him with re-entry.  However, it could just be as simple as not wanting someone with so many divided loyalties in the White Council.  After all, Harry is beholden to/mixed up with Heaven, Hell, Odin, Winter X 3 (Mab, Molly, Lea), Summer, Demonreach and the White Court of Vampires through various debts, favors, obligations, grudges, etc.

If you think about it, it's quite a mess.  I'm told that networking is a good thing, but perhaps not always.

Offline Ed0517

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Re: A reason Dresden was kicked from the White Council
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2021, 07:35:47 AM »
re: Making a sword - is Stormbringer too dark ? :) Should go well with the Blackstaff....

I would not necessarily say Harry is definitely the most qualified to make a sword - what about Klaus? He may LIKE to make toys, or made one so you did not EXPECT a weapon, but he sounds like he could make a weapon.

As far as blasting rod vs. staff - I don't think the rod is better than a staff at anything other than portability. You use both as a focus, and possibly the larger staff even focuses better (otherwise why carry the larger one?). Think of a pistol vs. a rifle. Really, with the exception of extremely close quarters (like room to room) a rifle is a far superior weapon in range, power, accuracy, capacity....  I think you carry a rod when you don't want a 5 or 6 foot stick. Though has anyone other than Harry had a rod?  I think it is more because Harry, especially early in the series, tends to be firehose like in his focus. See the ghoul outside Camp Kaboom.