Author Topic: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"  (Read 66873 times)

Offline magnuskn

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Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« on: March 10, 2020, 05:12:12 PM »
Oof. And I'm pretty sure Harry hasn't called once since coming back. He's just like that, not calling on his friends for years on end.

Offline didymos

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2020, 05:15:25 PM »
Oof. And I'm pretty sure Harry hasn't called once since coming back. He's just like that, not calling on his friends for years on end.

Kincaid was never really his friend. He just owed Harry one.

Offline spiritofair

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2020, 07:02:16 PM »
Kincaid was never really his friend. He just owed Harry one.
I suspect he's talking about Ivy, not Kincaid.

Man, Harry's selfish suicide in Changes caused Ivy to fire Kincaid... There has been speculation that Ivy going bad could be the cause of the BAT. Harry hiring Kincaid to kill himself, forcing Kincaid away from Ivy, leaving her alone, could be the tipping point for the girl.

Wow.

Offline Kindler

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2020, 07:09:15 PM »
Dude. I never even really considered that Ivy had already fired him... like, what? Two and a half years ago by the start of Peace Talks?

Offline Maz

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2020, 07:13:10 PM »
 :-[

Offline Maz

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2020, 07:14:11 PM »
Addendum:
That means Ivy is /alone/.  That's got to be problematic just from her mental/social/emotional state...

Offline Kindler

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2020, 07:33:45 PM »
Addendum:
That means Ivy is /alone/.  That's got to be problematic just from her mental/social/emotional state...

Lots of people have been anticipating her reappearance in Peace Talks after Ghost Story's revelation about Kincaid. Most of the context of those posts have been "Boy, what happens when Ivy finds out what Kincaid did? Does she know? It's going to be mighty awkward when the two of them show up!"

But... she's parted with Kincaid. That means we may see both of them apart from one another, in totally separate circumstances. As in, Ivy is a mediator during the Talks. Kincaid is a mercenary sent by *insert X-faction here* to eliminate *insert Y-target here*.

I feel like this really does free up Kincaid as a character to go from tentative ally/colleague/guy-who-owed-you-one-so-you-asked-him-to-kill-you to possible full-on antagonist.

I'm also going to say it here: Ivy contacted Mab and told her what was going to happen, but waited until Kincaid's flight landed or something. That's how Mab knew to save him, and that's why Ivy insisted on a center-mass shot instead of a headshot.

Offline darius379

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2020, 07:57:22 PM »
True, but Ivy seems to know what's going down. She *asks* for a chest shot. She knows what's going down and wants to ensure Harry can be recovered. Which means she was intentionally or unintentionally clued in by conversations with Mab and DR. And if she knows this, she (present day) knows Harry lives. Sure it was rough on her, but not nearly as traumatic as Molly had to deal with.

Offline Silentbrick

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2020, 08:19:22 PM »
Considering that the Gatekeeper said he'd help Harry with the paperwork for the Council to show he's alive, Ivy would certainly know Harry is up and about and probably that he's the Winter Knight.  I'm still really curious how the Merlin reacted to finding out that not is Harry alive and now WK, but Molly is the Winter Lady.  I'm sure it'd make the Anti-Harry faction of the Council dislike him more, claiming, "SEE SEE, he's always been Mab's creature!"
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Offline morriswalters

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2020, 08:56:53 PM »
True, but Ivy seems to know what's going down. She *asks* for a chest shot. She knows what's going down and wants to ensure Harry can be recovered. Which means she was intentionally or unintentionally clued in by conversations with Mab and DR. And if she knows this, she (present day) knows Harry lives. Sure it was rough on her, but not nearly as traumatic as Molly had to deal with.
He used the phone which meant that the conversation with Kincaid went digital.  So she owns it, unless the Archive is obsolete.  And since she can model the future she knows Harry's best chance was for a chest shot.  Which explains something.  It's possible that she knew during Ghost Story what was going on.  Also Harry is a d**k if he didn't write a note to her after he woke up.

Offline Mira

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2020, 09:54:43 PM »

   What is the address for this? 

Offline magnuskn

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2020, 10:01:16 PM »
Just the main page, as far as I know, i.e. www.jim-butcher.com.

And, yeah, I meant Ivy. And, yes, Harry is kind of dick for not calling, but he always has been more than a bit thoughtless in keeping up with his friends who are not immediately in Chicago. In fact, I'm pretty sure he only was in contact with Ivy whenever she was in Chicago or there was some immediate crisis, like in Changes. That's a character flaw and one I hope he is able to correct in time, especially now that he really is a dad of two.

Offline morriswalters

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2020, 10:36:42 PM »
If his magic were tied to his promises he wouldn't have any.  I've hoped that Harry was growing up. I guess if I caught Jim at a con my question would be, does this behavior constitute the actions of a good friend or father?

Offline Dina

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2020, 12:09:02 AM »
I was very sad about Kinkaid and I really hope they can compose their relationship. And I do wish Harry has written something to Ivy perhaps even to tell Kinkaid (as Harry probably does not know what happened between them).

Still, I am glad we now know why Kinkaid shot to the chest, and I agree with Kindler, she told Mab.

I really, really hope Harry has not broke Ivy's heart for ever. I want them to have a few cute interactions yet. In fact, I wish Ivy meets Maggie Jr. someday-

@spiritofair: Harry was not selfish! He was misguided, yes, but his actions were not inspired by selfishness but love. Still, he was unfair with Molly. He did not realized how much he will be hurting her.
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Offline Yuillegan

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Re: Kincaid microfiction "Goodbye"
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2020, 01:34:18 AM »
Some interesting stuff, only real thing of importance is that Kincaid was fired (and likely still) doesn't work for Ivy. And Ivy is mad at him, and probably Dresden too.

I agree that it might be interesting to see Kincaid playing for the other team, perhaps his original team. Although - one wonders why he left the service of Drakul in the first place? Perhaps he has a conscience after all...

I don't know that Ivy did tip off Mab though. The Archive was built to be neutral, as in magically limited. Her doing that is taking a side. However, her small nudge was telling Kincaid to hit him in the chest. I think she knew Harry was much more likely to survive that. I don't know that she would have been able to accurately predict that Kincaid would shoot him while he was on the Water Beetle. Harry had been Winter Knight for some time by that point, Kincaid could have shot him in Mexico just as easily or even once he returned before he got to the boat. But even had she predicated that he would be shot there, she would likely have known that once Harry had fallen into the Lake, Mab would have intervened.

It is hard to cast judgment on Harry's decision to kill himself, considering all the facts. Especially since he was pushed. Remember, one of the Fallen (implied to be Laciel, and almost outright confirmed in Skin Games) pushed him into doing it. Hence Uriel's intervention. It was a terrible thing, that's true. But even under normal circumstances, suicide is a highly complex and difficult issue. And deeply personal.

Dresden isn't a good friend. He isn't a good father. He might not even be a good man. But he does try to get better, and to be better. He does show up when the chips are down. And he saves the world semi-regularly. He has more on his plate than just about anybody. It would be difficult to find any who have done as well in his shoes. Not even Michael. Michael couldn't have done all the things Dresden has done. He is a better father, friend and probably person than Dresden. But he isn't Dresden. He can't do what Dresden can, he doesn't face the choices Dresden does, he cannot compromise his personal code for the greater good. If Michael had been in charge of saving the world there are quite a few occasions where he would have died nobly. But die he would have, and the world would have been in peril.

I guess I am saying, is it fair to measure him this way? He has more than unusual and difficult challenges. He absolutely could improve and do better, and have made better choices. But he isn't perfect or infallible and he doesn't know the future. If you want to judge him so, perhaps reread the passage in Skin Games where Harry first talks to Michael after the first encounter with Tessa and reexamine the question in your thoughts. Michael says it best.