Author Topic: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning  (Read 1161 times)

Offline skybluemonk

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The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« on: January 19, 2016, 06:33:56 AM »
Each spire is  a square with sides of 2 miles and therefore a floor area of 4 square miles. The Spirearch of Albion states Albion is ten thousand feet high and has 250 habbles of which 236 are occupied. Each habble is quoted as 50 feet floor to ceiling. This has to assume that the none inhabited  habbles are somewhat less that 50 feet high in order to fit within 10,000 feet overall height [1.89 miles].It is possible the Spirearch is generalising  the dimensions and the spire is a black  tower 2 miles high. There are references to a 2 mile fall for aeronauts. The living use-able floor area of each habble is a circle with a 2 mile radius. This then allows for various utilities and engineering needs at the periphery of each habble. It is possible that some habbles are not used for habitation and do not require a 50 foot ceiling. But the design is by the builders so it would presumably be uniform given the building material seems indestructible. To fit the 250 habbles need at 50ft ceilings would need  a height of about 12,000 feet [2.27 miles].
As the spirearch  is simply making a point of the complexity of the Albions spire he needn't have to be precise. Its 2x2 dimension  needs to be to be a square but to grow a cylinder on that base and to still be symmetrical  the height is immaterial. A spire normally tapers from that square, clearly these don't but can still call them spires why not.

Jim talks in his public appearances of the spires as Borg cubes. Which sort of destroys any visual image as a spire which has to at least be taller than wide and should taper but a square based tower ie rectangle  would sort of cover a spire. In the book chapter 33 further confusion as the spires are described round with the habbles having a square floor plan fitting inside. This contradicts the maps drawn for the books which reverse  to square containing circle.
Perhaps its pedantic and can be dismissed as the characters Bridget in this case having no real idea of geometry and having never gone outside to see the actual shape of the spire. Whether the earth is flat or round matters very little to most people in conducting their day to day lives.
But editing should have spotted this for Jim.

What interests me is  the sub title of the series  the cinder spires. Cinder is slag something left over after a process  iron slag coal slag  etc  cinders. As a verb to slag something is to reduce it to rubble.  So Jim, made from slag or are we venturing into the future not the past.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2016, 06:58:53 AM by skybluemonk »

Offline jumborex

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2016, 12:46:38 PM »
Neat exposition! I also have similar questions in mind. Expecially the real aspect of Spires! They appear to be no "spires" al all, but cylinders, or (perhaps) cubes!

Offline Shecky

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2016, 01:02:51 PM »
Jim talks in his public appearances of the spires as Borg cubes. Which sort of destroys any visual image as a spire which has to at least be taller than wide and should taper but a square based tower ie rectangle  would sort of cover a spire. In the book chapter 33 further confusion as the spires are described round with the habbles having a square floor plan fitting inside. This contradicts the maps drawn for the books which reverse  to square containing circle.
Perhaps its pedantic and can be dismissed as the characters Bridget in this case having no real idea of geometry and having never gone outside to see the actual shape of the spire. Whether the earth is flat or round matters very little to most people in conducting their day to day lives.
But editing should have spotted this for Jim.

Editing did spot this. Two things: 1) "Spire"—Word meaning drifts over time; think of the original vs. current usage of "terrible" if you want a perfect example. The same concept applies, if not as dramatically, to "cinder." 2) Squared circle vs. circled square—oops. ;)
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Offline Dina

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2016, 08:45:44 PM »
Yes. I still imagine the spires as towers, more or less cone shaped. I don't care for reality, I imagine what I want  :P
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Offline skybluemonk

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2016, 08:42:12 AM »
WHOOPS HERE WE GO AGAIN!

"Habble Morning occupied the entirety of the spire  most of it beneath a vast atrium nearly 200 feet high and it was the next best thing to 2 miles from one side of the  great cylinder that was the spire Albion to the other. Ch 14"

Hmmm  Cylinder  but  but means square in circle and not as map [circle in square] and not a Borg cube!!!!!
Plus
 200 foot atrium  room for 3 habbles and decreases the available space for 250 habbles spaced 50 feet apart [which is tight anyway]  The need to get the 250 habbles into a spire needs about two and half miles allowing for variations like this atrium  ie how thick are the floors  10 feet   that would give another  2,480 feet to account for. Grins sorry Jim i'm being pedantic  and I guessing the spires are in of themselves  important to your story  so would  be nice to get them right and as an arcology
its an exciting idea for a living environment.

Offline Shecky

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2016, 01:09:57 PM »
Yes. I still imagine the spires as towers, more or less cone shaped. I don't care for reality, I imagine what I want  :P

Stop being so healthy. :D
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Offline skybluemonk

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2016, 07:33:51 PM »
 :-\ Cant help it  still need to get my head around the Spires.
on re reading  re assessed Habble Landing thought it was ground/surface but no they carved a hole for themselves in the spirestone and built the landing platform. Was no "original"  entry point to surface but there must be one as people and goods do get in and out to the surface [Capt Pine and crew]. When the Landing is destroyed ships and people fall to the surface which isnt visible so must be a considerable fall.  So question is are there Habbles below Habble Landing. If Habble landing is "floor 1" and there is say for arguments sake a 200 foot drop to the surface  that once again squashes the available room for 250 Habbles in the overall structure.
Must in fact be uninhabited habbles near to or on the surface. Need to supply water. There are cisterns in each habble but have to get water from surface so pumps and presume a central reservoir  2 miles by 2 miles by 50 feet would give a good volume of water if flooded... Habble lake....  room for aquaculture vats maybe shell fish filtering the water and providing food.

I also keep thinking why no internal lifts [steam powered or lift crystals] particularly as only 3 external doors. Commerce/trade  would demand  some  efficient  internal transportation system between habbles unless they are largely self sufficient and economically independent which doesn't sound realistic.
And  .... so sorry but my mind got on to lighting.  Habbles have translucent spirestone  which is fine but how they are distributed would matter. if i was designing i'd have a circle of them high up so light is directed down on to the floor of each habble. Likely each habble would be designed same.
But if Habble Landing built its mezzanine floor over the same area minus the Monastery then  that creates issues for where the translucent spirestones are placed on the outside walls and has to create areas or area as dark as ventilation tunnels either on one floor or the other.

Then theres population  food production and distribution,  management of waste [human and material]  course none of which is necessarily needed for the story  but helps if the world being created is believable fine point of course is where one draws the line and thats up to the author. We fans of course can let our minds roam as we will [and we will], to our hearts content.  All that is thanks to the author.

Offline Chupathingy

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2016, 05:15:01 AM »
I imagine something like a wine goblet or the space needle in shape with a base that narrows as it assends before flareing out to support a wedding cake of habbles. Also the discriptions in the books are consistent with the maps in my copy of squares within circles.

Offline Flynnarrel

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Re: The Cinder Spires Description and Meaning
« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2017, 12:50:25 AM »
How does water distribution happen in the habbles?