Author Topic: Social Status of Warriorborn  (Read 2961 times)

Offline Second Aristh

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Social Status of Warriorborn
« on: October 04, 2015, 01:49:46 AM »
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I thought this excerpt was an interesting look into how people perceived the warriorborn, at least on Spire Albion.  We know that warriorborn are amazing fighters, much faster and stronger than a typical person.  They also have stronger senses.  All of this comes at the price of a faster metabolism.  So, why exactly are warriorborn shunned socially?

We've seen more than once that Benedict tries to disguise and hide how much he eats.  We've even seen the Lancasters give trust and authority to warriorborn Esterbrook, but for some reason warriorborn aren't good enough for average nobles without special circumstances.  Any theories?
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Offline Brightbane

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2015, 02:16:24 AM »
Racism.
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Offline Gman

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2015, 12:22:39 PM »
They are not completely human. They are called half souled also. I have a feeling there is some prejudice but also some differences with normal humans that can affect relationships. I would also guess Etherialists get looked at oddly too in social settings.

Offline cass

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2015, 12:58:51 AM »
Because, well, they're part-Cat, at least at some level.  And given the view of cats among the elite of society--even among those knowing that they're sentient and intelligent-- it wouldn't surprise me that Warriorborn are associated with (tainted with) those views.  So, as brightbane said, in short: racism.

Offline Agravaine

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2015, 01:17:12 AM »
Well, I'm not sure its as simple -- after all, it seems to be somewhat random otherwise a Lancaster scion wouldn't manifest the traits.  It would seem that there are some other "prices" to pay for the physical powers.  Helen Lancaster describes some of Esterbrook's limitations and Benedict remarks on the difficulties he had learning to read maps -- which are essentially effortless for normal.

The half-soul comments seem to be exclusively made by cats. 


Offline Second Aristh

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2015, 01:54:57 AM »
Because, well, they're part-Cat, at least at some level.  And given the view of cats among the elite of society--even among those knowing that they're sentient and intelligent-- it wouldn't surprise me that Warriorborn are associated with (tainted with) those views.  So, as brightbane said, in short: racism.
The prejudice towards Cats seems odd anyway.  Traditionally, cats were well regarded for their ability to deal with mice and other pests (one of the reasons ancient Egyptians were so fond of their cats).  In an enclosed and crowded space like a Spire, dealing with disease would be more important than ever (see the verminocitors).

Also, racism rings hollow when the traits show up in noble lines and presumably in many families. 
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Offline Mith

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2015, 02:14:20 AM »
It confuses me as well.  Perhaps Cat temperament causes them to be seen as a necessary evil, rather then a valued member of the community.
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Offline Aesir

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2015, 11:08:28 AM »
Albion maybe a democracy in name, but it's one that is highly tilted in favor of an entrenched aristocracy who monopolize the positions of power. Children are not taught that all men and women are equal.  High House members are born High House Members, and what makes them High House Members? It's their bloodline that makes them a "blue blood".  As with many historical real world aristocratic societies, there is almost assuredly a belief that their very blood is superior, and thus the products of illicit sex with inferior bloodlines (such as "beasts" or wherever it is the warriorborn get their genetics) would be considered likewise inferior.  That said, practicality can trump bloodline in certain instances. For example, if Bennedict were heir to House Lancaster then according to Gwen that "might" trump his mixed genetics when it comes to his eligibility as a suitable mate to a gal from another High House.

In the case of the warriorborn, there is a perception held by Bennedict's own cousin Gwen that they're too focused on the present, and lack the mental ability to consider the past and plan for the future the way members of the High Houses can and do.  This perception is very likely shared by the other High Houses, and probably explains why it is considered "unseemly" for a High House to recognize one as a member, why they are not considered eligible as spouses for High House members, and why it is considered "outre" for a High House member to get romantically involved with one. Furthermore as per Major Aspira's thoughts,  "if he had been born like Ciriaco (ie. a warriorborn) he wouldn't be a major in the Auroran marines" , and given that Ciricaco is only a sergeant, this further implies that the Aurorans likely don't consider the warriorborn to be good officer material, especially not high ranking ones. Whether or not there is any truth to these perceptions is up in the air, but a certain subtle prejudice certainly seems to exist as a result.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2015, 12:07:12 PM by Aesir »
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Offline dspringer1

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2015, 12:03:15 AM »
Just a genetic tangent here.   Some thoughts
1) I wonder if warrior born have issues breeding?  Given an aristocratic house values the bloodline, they would avoid warrior born marriages simply because of the risk of no kids.   Nothing said in the book on this, but it is possible.

2) Warrior born are clearly a genetic recessive "type", but obviously a very complicated one.  It feels like they were bred into in people for some reason.  Either the recessive gene provides some value or warrior borns cannot breed true.  Either way, it makes for interesting social implications.

3) Warrior born seem uncommon.   There were only a small number among the invading marines.   Given the advantages of warrior born to a marine, that implies that they are very uncommon.   Or possibly that they are urgently needed for some other purpose. the 2nd seems unlikely as there seemed no pressure on the warrior borns in the book to "serve in some specific way"

Offline Moglorosh

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2015, 11:12:46 AM »
I only remember the term "half-soul" being used by cats as well, and given the way cats view the world, it probably refers to their feline half.

Offline Tarion

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2015, 12:41:26 PM »
Worth noting that there are some downsides to being warriorborn.

In Chapter 41 Cavendish says that you can't expect warriorborn to be perfectly poised - "Inevitably, the beast emerges".  And there's the way that Benedict reacts after his injuries - It's pretty clear that he's not in control and could be dangerous.

I don't think that it's particularly unreasonable to consider the potential for hurting the people around them a negative trait.  I can certainly see why you might not want to marry a warriorborn. 

Offline NutJobismyJob

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2015, 06:41:38 PM »
I also think it's interesting to look at the degree to which social standing can trump warriorborn prejudice.  As someone else mentioned, if Benedict had been the heir to his house, he might have had less trouble finding a match.  I also recall the possibility being mentioned of a match being made with someone from a lower house who would thereby gain status despite him being a warriorborn.
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Offline Dina

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2015, 07:45:48 PM »
I had some ideas along the lines of what dspringer said, problems to breed. But that wouldn't explain that an Auror Warriorborn wouldnę reach the highest ranks. So racism, probably because they look different enough. I suspect they could have been some accidents with warriorborns
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that make people wary of them.

That said, it's still confusing but racism always is, at least for me.
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Offline Beadchaser

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2015, 03:49:34 PM »
I don't think they're all part cat... The Warriorborn who was hanging out with the tea-time baddie was mentioned as moving like a spider. Apologizing for lack of names b/c I "read" it via audiobook so names don't stick in my head, just the pictures/scenes.
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Offline kazimmoinuddin

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Re: Social Status of Warriorborn
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2015, 05:30:18 AM »
It seems like it is a mistake to even attempt to marginalized a group of people built to fight. I wonder if there is somekind of warrior society/guild. The Way might just have started as a way to impose discipline on them.
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