Author Topic: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves  (Read 16754 times)

Offline LizW65

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #30 on: May 05, 2013, 08:38:01 PM »
The ancient Sumerian pantheon has some very interesting and nasty critters, as do the Mesoamerican mythologies.
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Offline Snowleopard

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2013, 08:57:43 PM »
I keep waiting for Mister (in the Dresden files) to be tied
to Bast/Egyptian gods somehow.
(Though, in all fairness, I think the Norse Goddess Freya had a chariot
pulled by cats. - Just Googled it - two cats pulled her chariot.)

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #32 on: May 05, 2013, 10:12:03 PM »
  When was the last time you saw one that drew heavily from the Persian pantheon, for example.

The closest I've got is Robert Silverberg's story of Gilgamesh the King. ?

Offline Snowleopard

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #33 on: May 05, 2013, 10:14:43 PM »
It might be that a lot of writers pick the pantheons they think
their readers are most familiar with.

Offline Quantus

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2013, 01:15:09 PM »
The closest I've got is Robert Silverberg's story of Gilgamesh the King. ?
Hadnt heard of it.  Any good?  Im in need of beach reading for a vacation next week. 
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Offline the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #35 on: May 06, 2013, 02:06:10 PM »
Fae who are seductively gorgeous, can predict the future, can fly etc etc...all end up sounding like imitations of vampires, even when they're not (if that makes any sense).

Which looks to me like the trend for Romantic Vampires basically stealing stuff from older depictions of Faerie in the first place.
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Offline arianne

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #36 on: May 06, 2013, 02:09:27 PM »
Which looks to me like the trend for Romantic Vampires basically stealing stuff from older depictions of Faerie in the first place.

I know; it feels like even when you're writing about something that is really truly seriously NOT a vampire, someone can point to one or two traits and say, "That's kind of vampire-y" even if it is nothing of the sort.

Really, if one were to tally up all the traits displayed by vampires in modern (romantic or not) fiction, pretty much ANYTHING goes.
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Offline the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #37 on: May 06, 2013, 02:11:04 PM »
^this.     Mythos mining leaves me stone cold.     More mythos mining at this stage simply weakens the source mythoi to the status of cultural baggage.    Ripped, with broken handles and torn lining, stinking of the dump they're left on.

I am in agreement with you on the vast majority of contemporary examples, but I'd not be without the exceptional minority.

Quote
I am also sick to death of worlds and cultures that are just like ours except for the tiny little change of "oh and magic works".   

Oh, strongly agreed.  Have I recommended DD Barent's Bloodhound Files in this context before ?  (Series in which smart tough FBI profiler is, at the start of the first book, summoned into an alternate world where magic works, which has vampires, werewolves, and golems; billions of them, with humans a tiny minority ethnic group.)

Quote
Put another way, if the world is just like ours except for magic working then you will have immense trouble convincing me that anything magic-related in your books is possibly going to have an effect on the world as it moves past the events of your books.

Exactly; nor am i overly fond of settings that attempt to get around this by coming up with convoluted explanations for how it's the impact of the magic that has caused our world to be like it is.
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Offline the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #38 on: May 06, 2013, 02:12:23 PM »
... Also, what's up with there being no heroes in the world who have good families? In any genre? If there's a hero, their family is either dead or seriously messed up. Why?

Loners are a lot easier to write without having to figure out complex real backstories, and messed-up families are a cheap and easy way to get trauma and angst.
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Offline the neurovore of Zur-En-Aargh

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #39 on: May 06, 2013, 02:14:10 PM »
I dont mind using existing mythos, but I am starting to get a little tired of the Norse tie-in.

Maybe I'm not reading in the same space as you are, because I've not seen too much of that, but I really wince at versions that seem totally not to Get It.  (I'm looking at you, American Gods.) I can think of a couple of good counterexamples, but not many.
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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #40 on: May 06, 2013, 02:15:39 PM »
The closest I've got is Robert Silverberg's story of Gilgamesh the King. ?

Geoff Ryman's The Warrior Who Carried Life is a lovely weird feminist redaction of Gilgamesh.
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Offline Quantus

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #41 on: May 06, 2013, 02:23:08 PM »
Maybe I'm not reading in the same space as you are, because I've not seen too much of that, but I really wince at versions that seem totally not to Get It.  (I'm looking at you, American Gods.) I can think of a couple of good counterexamples, but not many.
Offhand Ive seen it in American Gods, Dresden, Iron Druid, as well as nearly every Urban fantasy television show Ive seen recently.  And then there is the Avengers Thor that is getting so much screen time recently, though that admittedly isnt fair of me since the comic has been around for decades.  In most cases I dont think it has been done poorly persay, but it would be nice to see one of the less euro-centric mythologies take more of a role in one of these.   
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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #42 on: May 06, 2013, 03:07:07 PM »
In most cases I dont think it has been done poorly persay, but it would be nice to see one of the less euro-centric mythologies take more of a role in one of these.

*Has a brief flash of mash-up amusement for the thought of a Yiddish Policemens Union that includes some of the raunchier elements from A Kayak full of Ghosts.*
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 03:09:36 PM by o_O »

Offline Galvatron

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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #43 on: May 06, 2013, 03:43:37 PM »
I suppose this isnt so much a plot theme, but I would enjoy a few more books done in third person in UF.

I don't mind first person at all, but UF is kinda overrun with first person stories and something different is always nice.
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Re: Your Pet Urban Fantasy Cliche Peeves
« Reply #44 on: May 07, 2013, 06:04:39 PM »
*Has a brief flash of mash-up amusement for the thought of a Yiddish Policemens Union that includes some of the raunchier elements from A Kayak full of Ghosts.*

I'll be over here in the corner picking up the bits of my skull and fitting them back together after my brain exploded.
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"What do you mean, Lawful Silly isn't a valid alignment?"

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