Author Topic: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]  (Read 7442 times)

Offline Rhewtani

  • Participant
  • *
  • Posts: 33
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2013, 06:21:18 PM »
You see, with books 1 and 2, I'm not entirely convinced yet that the "full master outline" was written.  Every time Harry tries to convince me that they are now obviously part of this overarching plot by nemesis/bc, it instantly reminds me of the deluminator from the HP series.  Sure, it was always meant to also have the ability to help Ron find his friends when teleporting and that wasn't a tacked on power that JKR came up with while flipping through the first book and writing the seventh.

JB might convince me by the end that 3I and hexenbelts fit in somewhere, but I still don't quite see it, unless we find something that conveys that there were hundreds of these little things going on all over.

-C

Offline SAZ

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1424
  • I cast my spirit into the many spheres seeking…
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2013, 06:54:25 PM »
Some good ideas being batted around, however I just can’t buy the “bog down the WC angle”. Chicago is one city, albeit a big one, in a big world. The council is worldwide (more or less). Heck – one young inexperienced, semi-rogue wizard named Harry was sufficient to the task of taking care of things in the early books – hardly a threat to the WC.

If you think about it, it took the softening up of the Red Court/White Council war, followed up by a worldwide fomor incursion to force the WC to pull back and concentrate on defending Europe as we learned in CD. So the developing of a few minor league magic users in Chicago, if it were an attempt to weaken the council, was simply a poor plan.

I’ll concede the point if we have evidence of black magic and other weird stuff being on the increase worldwide during the same time. Then the events of the early books could have been a small part of a bigger wear down the WC plot.

The wearing down of the barrier between worlds, and the removal of Marcone seems to be the major goals.
Why Marcone? He represents a power in the area of Chicago, a power that likes things stable. Also the area its self is important because of its nearness to demonreach and it is also near the stone table in faerie. Perhaps there are other reasons.

Getting back to Marcone – maybe someone leading team evil has foresight on a par with Odin and saw that their evil plans would be more likely to succeed if Marcone was removed. Odin saw this to and made Gard and other help available.

I love these books because they are wonderfully complicated.
Last night I had a vision. The World in flames. Terror and death spreading across the globe in an unstoppable wave, destroying anything resembling order or civilization. At the center of it – I saw Mister. Sitting there grooming himself, looking disinterested.

Offline aShorty21

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1063
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2013, 07:35:47 PM »
[...] Also the area its self is important because of its nearness to demonreach and it is also near the stone table in faerie. Perhaps there are other reasons. [...]

The stone table is wherever the Queens decide it needs to be. They call forth the area to do battle. They just happened to call it forth in in Chicago because that was where the shit was hitting the fan at the time.
DV aShorty21 V1.2 YR5 FR4 BK++ RP- JB TH++ WG++ CL SW BC++ MC---- SH(Velvet Room+++++,Murphy+++,Sarissa++,Lash+,Lara+,Molly--)

Offline Dimitri

  • Conversationalist
  • **
  • Posts: 143
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2013, 07:52:21 PM »
I don't believe Vanilia's are immune to Nemesis, but i'd say they're usefulness is minimal and i'd say they're working to fix that as well as spread influence.
In book 1 three Eye gave Vanilla's the Sight, giving a very limited tool extra abilities, it's possible that it was at least considered as a channel for the Nemesis infection.
In book 2 the wolf belts were one step up, giving several people who had mortal power "AKA authority" supernatural power, it's implied by an unreliable source (Maeve) that they were infected and even if they weren't, they were taking orders from someone who probably was.

Offline madness

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1968
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2013, 08:07:49 PM »
I don't have a full-fledged theory to support this (I don't know that I even believe it myself) but while trying to fit these puzzle pieces together myself I have often wondered - what if someone (Odin?  The Circle?  HWWBehind?) was primarily using these black magic events to shape Harry and to guide his path?  Someone with a sadistic Lea/Justin style of teaching.

The Three Eye and Victor Sells force Harry to run up against Marcone as well as Bianca (the two most powerful forces in Chicago).  The Three Eye also allows Harry to eventually escape the Doom of Damocles.

The Hexenwulf belts put Harry together with the Alphas as well as forcing him to come to a working arrangement with Marcone.

The events of Grave Peril draw Harry and Michael closer together, introduce Harry to Thomas, expose Harry to a good chunk of the supernatural political world, force Harry to finally confront Lea and eventually result in Harry removing the Red Court influence from Chicago while starting a war that will keep him on his toes for the next 8-10 years.

Is there some reason that these events could not be the result of someone like Mab trying to further shape Harry into a weapon?  Or someone like Odin trying to shape what would eventually become the Chicago Alliance (and what I think he plans to eventually become the core of the human (ish) army in the coming wars)?  As a bonus on the Odin theory - he got to screw with the Erlking's hunters at the FBI while pushing Marcone down the supernatural path.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2013, 08:09:31 PM by madness »

Offline Arjan

  • Seriously?
  • ***
  • Posts: 13235
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2013, 08:12:31 PM »
I don't believe Vanilia's are immune to Nemesis,
Maeve clearly thought she could infect Justine.
Quote
but i'd say they're usefulness is minimal and i'd say they're working to fix that as well as spread influence.
In book 1 three Eye gave Vanilla's the Sight, giving a very limited tool extra abilities, it's possible that it was at least considered as a channel for the Nemesis infection.
In book 2 the wolf belts were one step up, giving several people who had mortal power "AKA authority" supernatural power, it's implied by an unreliable source (Maeve) that they were infected and even if they weren't, they were taking orders from someone who probably was.
WG+++: The White God is Mister.
SH[Elaine+++]

Offline madness

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1968
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2013, 08:17:59 PM »
Speaking of which...Harry should track down whoever created Three Eye.

If someone could come up with a non-crazy version it could fundamentally alter the fashion in which humans interact with and defend against the supernatural community.

Granted - most vanilla humans would lack the mental strength to handle such a thing but I bet that someone like Murphy (or someone not entirely vanilla like Thomas or the Alphas) would be able to put it to good use.  Someone with great mental discipline from another 'art' and who was already comfortable with the supernatural world.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2013, 08:19:43 PM by madness »

Offline TheCuriousFan

  • Special Collections Division
  • Seriously?
  • ****
  • Posts: 16609
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2013, 08:23:43 PM »
Speaking of which...Harry should track down whoever created Three Eye.

If he ever tracks down the guy who gave Victor the recipe I don't think they're going to sit down for a civil conversation.
Currently dealing with a backlog of games.

If you want me to type up a book quote or find a WoJ quote, send me a PM.

Rest in peace mdodd.

Offline madness

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1968
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2013, 08:28:41 PM »
If he ever tracks down the guy who gave Victor the recipe I don't think they're going to sit down for a civil conversation.

Agreed. :)

Giving vanilla human's some sort of sight might screw with the plot anyways.

Offline aShorty21

  • Posty McPostington
  • ***
  • Posts: 1063
    • View Profile
Re: Motive for giving out black magic? [CD spoilers]
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2013, 08:40:42 PM »
Speaking of which...Harry should track down whoever created Three Eye.

If someone could come up with a non-crazy version it could fundamentally alter the fashion in which humans interact with and defend against the supernatural community.

Granted - most vanilla humans would lack the mental strength to handle such a thing but I bet that someone like Murphy (or someone not entirely vanilla like Thomas or the Alphas) would be able to put it to good use.  Someone with great mental discipline from another 'art' and who was already comfortable with the supernatural world.

I always assumed that Victor got the black magic power up from outside, but created Three-Eye on his own or at least through is own machinations.
DV aShorty21 V1.2 YR5 FR4 BK++ RP- JB TH++ WG++ CL SW BC++ MC---- SH(Velvet Room+++++,Murphy+++,Sarissa++,Lash+,Lara+,Molly--)